Hi all,

Just wanted to share / discuss tips on using Tie Phantoms. I haven't had a chance to try the ship against a human opponent, but did learn quite a few things facing off against multiple AI ships, the latest of which was:

[My SIde]

• Tie Phantom (Whisper): Advanced Cloaking Device Engine Upgrade, Fire Control System, Veteran Instincts

[A.I.] (pre-arranged in a diamond formation)

• E-wing (Knave Squadron) x1
• X-wing (Rookie) x3

After a very narrow win (down to my last hull point), these are my findings so far:

• The Phantom has to have the highest Pilot Skill to be used effectively, and Whisper does better than Echo in this regard with a possible pilot skill of 9

[Opening Moves] - applies to Whisper

• Advance towards the opposing ships quickly, so as to start engaging as close to the middle of the board as possible. Decloaking works best when all 3 directions are open to the Phantom.
• I assume that a savvy human opponent will fly his ships in formation, with at least one ship covering the rear. Try to mess with your opponent's formation by veering slightly to the side during your approach.
• Keep slightly off centre just before engaging, so that you can flank the ship furthest to a side
• Stay away from opposing turrets and higher PS ships
• Stay away from stress-generating effects (e.g. Rebel Captive)

[Decloaking Tactics] - applies to Whisper with Engine Upgrade

• It helps to be angled away from opposing ships before decloaking, as the 2-straight barrel roll to the side is more flexible / adjustable than the 2-straight to the front
• If you are relatively close to the opposing ships, choose a short, tight turn (don't worry about collisions, as you have 3 possible decloaking positions). Try not to go for long, straight moves as it's easy to get caught in firing arcs by overshooting an enemy ship.
• Consider all 3 decloaking positions- you might be surprised at the one that puts your Phantom in the optimal spot*
• Cloaked or not, always stay out of firing arcs. If this is not possible, increase the distance between the nearest opposing ship who has your phantom within its firing arc. Use your action if necessary to boost / barrel roll. If this is not possible, consider decloaking to retreat
• If forced to decloak to retreat, try to get manoeuvre for a shot against an opposing ship next turn, as this activates the Advanced Cloaking device's effect Edit: retreat and recloak after each shot

*This is a joy to behold when you pull it off:

The pic above shows a possible opening move. As all of the opposing ships are of lower pilot skill, they advanced from just outside their own firing arc towards the Phantom. The Phantom began at the bottom, facing the left, and moved into the E-wing's blind spot with a boost action.

After this shot, the Phantom will need to retreat and recloak as soon as possible, before repeating the attack run.

[General Tips] - applies to Whisper

• Never turn away from / expose your Phantom's rear to opposing ships, as it lacks a 2-straight decloaking move to the rear to enter blind spots with
• Watch for possible K-turns from enemy ships; assume that all unstressed enemy ships will make one
• Avoid stress. If you ever need a K-turn, use a combination of decloak + barrel roll / boost instead

Comments / criticisms / additional tips?

Boost? Not an action in my phantom's repertoire.

Have you been making a mistake or are you choosing engine upgrade over ACD?

Also, when in doubt, I tend to prefer long bank or turn maneuvers if I'm looking to stay out of harms way. This gives me a choice of the most disparate positions and better possibilities for putting myself at range.

Yeah, no boosting a Phantom unless you take an Engine Upgrade over Advance Cloaking Device. So in your illustration the Phantom will be parked in the firing arcs of 3 ships. That would be the worse possible placement for the phantom.

Yeah, no boosting a Phantom unless you take an Engine Upgrade over Advance Cloaking Device. So in your illustration the Phantom will be parked in the firing arcs of 3 ships. That would be the worse possible placement for the phantom.

Yeah, looks to me like decloaking straight ahead, executing that hard one and BR to the left and forward would possibly have been the best choice in that particular setup given that maneuver.

Unless I misunderstood what the Op is saying. You don't want to advance towards your opponent head on.

The Phantoms are best used to flank.

Send your squad towards your opponent main force. Your Phantom should be getting behind the other ships.

Like in the picture shown above the Phantom is in a very bad place.

Your squad should be used as a distraction and get in the way of your opponents squad.

While the Phantom comes from behind he doesn't have to worry about being in so many firing arcs.

Plus the Phantom has no boost option in his action bar, this would require engine upgrade, which would be pretty silly to take over advanced cloak.

The beauty of the Phantomv is you shouldn't have to get that close to your opponents ships.

By doing so you make it harder for yourself to decloak.

By getting in so close you may narrow down your decloak options. This gives your opponent an easier time to try to block the Phantom Whisper over echo as he see the options given and since Whisper will likely move last.

Plus if your going against anything with a Turret staying at range 3 is best. This gives you more options, and not become a likely target.

This is how I view a phantom when it faces a 360 turret: Indy, is Han Solo after all and the swordsman is the Phantom

After all that fancy flying he just gets shot!

I've beaten a few Falcon list with Phantoms. Key is keep your distance as much as possible, while sending your main force toward the Falcon.

A Falcon player will find it hard to ignore range one or two shots over range 3

I strongly believe that Falcons not the instant-bane of Phantoms like everyone has been predicting. They're good but still beatable. I wouldn't put it past a triple phantom list.

I've beaten a few Falcon list with Phantoms. Key is keep your distance as much as possible, while sending your main force toward the Falcon.

A Falcon player will find it hard to ignore range one or two shots over range 3

I think the key is to overcome that urge to attack the Range 1 ships and hit that Phantom with everything you've got while you can. A good Phantom list will limit the number of turns you can do that, though, since your Falcon won't fly forever.

Your right but its a gamble.

I took some shots at echo at range 3 over a range 1 shuttle

Even with Luke as gunner and Han, still didn't land a shot.

Eventually I did get him, but had I focused on the shuttle instead probably would have made the game go quicker

OMG do I want to put an engine upgrade on the Phantom, but that would spell its death, as it would not auto-cloak after firing, and then it would loose all that decloaking manuevering which is why you bought the Phantom in the first place.

i like this loadout a lot...

Echo + Rebel Captive + Sensor Jammer + VI + ACD (42)

heres i what i team it with but u could go in other directions too.

Omicron + Advanced Sensors + Ion Cannon + Tactician + Tactician +EU (35)

Gamma Squadron + Flachette Torps + Flachette Torps + Munitions Failsafe (23)

Echo and lower can also go Stygian. It is not as surefire as ACD but it also just makes other options viable. A free evade and a Recon Sp or Rebel captive for "one point" vs. ACD is pretty good if you're decent at flying the phantom. A stigian phantom will go down when an ACD MIGHT not but it will almost always get it's points first.

Edited my original post - Whisper was equipped with Engine Upgrade (and not advanced cloaking device), which allows the Phantom to perform the manuever shown in the pic. The downside is that it cannot re-cloak right after an attack, and has to spend at least 1 turn afterwards retreating to recloak.

I re-played the battle without Advanced Cloaking device, and found that it is still viable, BUT you need to spend at least every other turn running away.

Ya but your also playing against ai and not people

This would get torn apart

i like this loadout a lot...

Echo + Rebel Captive + Sensor Jammer + VI + ACD (42)

heres i what i team it with but u could go in other directions too.

Omicron + Advanced Sensors + Ion Cannon + Tactician + Tactician +EU (35)

Gamma Squadron + Flachette Torps + Flachette Torps + Munitions Failsafe (23)

I do Whisper + Rebel Captive + Sensor Jammer + Vi + ACD (44)

Black Sq + Predator x 2 or two PS 1 Interceptors

Scimatar Sq + Prox Mines or Seismic Charge/PS 1 Interceptor/Black Sq Predator

It either comes out to 96/97/98 which wins me initiative most of the time, and allows me to pretty much always stay cloaked with Whisper, dart around the board avoiding arcs and really punishes people for firing at her.

(I only have 2 PS1 interceptors and 2 Predator cards so I tend to mix it up, haha)

Ya but your also playing against ai and not people

This would get torn apart

This is very true.

That's why I'm interested in discussing how would a human rebel player respond to a Phantom's attack, and how the Phantom player could then counter this.

I overrode the AI in a few instances to reflect what I would do against the Phantom. Specifically:

Right after the manuever in the photo, I had all of the opposing ships spread their firing arcs around to cover as many escape routes as possible. But the decloaked Phantom could still escape more often than not with a barrel roll / boost (with engine upgrade)

Edited my original post - Whisper was equipped with Engine Upgrade (and not advanced cloaking device), which allows the Phantom to perform the manuever shown in the pic. The downside is that it cannot re-cloak right after an attack, and has to spend at least 1 turn afterwards retreating to recloak.

I re-played the battle without Advanced Cloaking device, and found that it is still viable, BUT you need to spend at least every other turn running away.

In a timed event spending half your turns not attacking will mean you lose even if the Phantom does not die.

Ya but your also playing against ai and not people

This would get torn apart

This is very true.

That's why I'm interested in discussing how would a human rebel player respond to a Phantom's attack, and how the Phantom player could then counter this.

I overrode the AI in a few instances to reflect what I would do against the Phantom. Specifically:

Right after the manuever in the photo, I had all of the opposing ships spread their firing arcs around to cover as many escape routes as possible. But the decloaked Phantom could still escape more often than not with a barrel roll / boost (with engine upgrade)

Your uncloaked after you attack which can leave open to so many more attacks from numerous forces.

Plus next round if he survived more shipd will be lining up shots.

Just not worth it for a fragile ship that costs so much

Some valid points contrary to my play-style, which advocates using the Phantom as a close-range brawler:

Krynn007

• Engage at long range, especially against turreted ships (ships with turrets tend to have lower agility, and cannot survive long against 4 attack)
• Flank if you have a distraction available, to have less firing arcs pointed at the Phantom
• Whisper's decloak is more easily blocked by low PS ships, in comparison to Echo

Rakky Wistol

• Lower PS Phantoms could potentially use the Stygian upgrade, especially against valuable ships

[Flying Against Phantoms]

• Block possible decloaking positions with lower PS pilots
• Keep a ship to the rear of your formation to prevent / respond to a decloacking attack
• Use turrets
• Use stress-inducing effects

I like to think I have a lot of experience using the Phantomv since I got my first at the Imdaar alpha event and have been using it regularly since then.

Now I'm not sure if what your saying above is your idea of using the engine upgrade over advanced cloak.

If that is the case staying at range won't be enough.

If a Phantom is at range 2-3 and had only 2-3 evade dice, I'm going to take all the shots on it that I can.

If he is not cloaking after he attacks, he's going to have a hard time getting away next round.

Plus if he is using one round to try to get away abs is not shooting all that better for me.

You see, if you fly away and cloak. You don't get a shot. Plusthat's your action. I'm going to point all my guns in that direction. Sure you have 4 evade dice but more times than not I've seen that not mean a thing

Especially without a way to modify.

Flanking if the key way to play Phantoms.

Imo that is the only way. Get behind your opponent and reek havoc.

If I'm dealing with a Turret ship my main force gets in close to take the heat off my Phantom

Whisper is easier to block but she is still pretty good at keeping her distance.

If you use your main force right, I use them to block. Since I fly a mini swarm and at 99pts. I hope to get initiative.

I haven't tried using two yet but if like to try using the spa on two generic and see how well it works.

I've only used echo Or Whisper

I think getting in close with a Phantom is possibly limiting your choices.

First off if you have asteroids, and yours and your opponent ships around you, that really only leaves X amount of choices for when you decloak. Making it easier for your opponent to block and pin point where your going.

Ships like wedge and Han will eat it and then some.

Keeping is distance is key and allows more room for flexibility. Less likely to get blocked or boxed in.

In a tournament setting, I just can't see it doing well if he is in the front lines.

I haven't tried using two yet but if like to try using the spa on two generic and see how well it works.

I've only used echo Or Whisper

I think getting in close with a Phantom is possibly limiting your choices.

First off if you have asteroids, and yours and your opponent ships around you, that really only leaves X amount of choices for when you decloak. Making it easier for your opponent to block and pin point where your going.

Ships like wedge and Han will eat it and then some.

Good points all- I haven' previously tried firing from long ranges with the Phantom. I was treating Phantom manuevers like some puzzle game, plunging it unsupported straight towards enemy formations looking for blind spots...

I originally mistook the evade icon for a boost icon, hence played the Phantom with a boost AND advanced cloaking device. I then tried it with just an Engine Upgrade (still against A.I. ships).

It would be interesting to see how some of the generic low PS Phantoms would fare, with or without ACD.