I know that Rebel Aces is coming out soon and I believe it will do a good job in making the A-Wing more relevant, but I have been brainstorming ideas to make the A-Wing relevant in my personal (just for fun) games and had this thought.

"After performing a green maneuver increase your firepower by 1 until the end of the turn" - The basic idea is less energy is being directed to the engines and more to the weapons

I think this would dramatically increase the A-Wing's value, but too much so? It has a lot of green maneuvers on it's dial however it would make the A-Wing more predictable IMO.

Again! This is not in conjunction with Rebel Aces, just an idea I would like to discuss.

Thanks!

Toss Opportunist on a GSP and you essentially have this for 23 points.

Edit: Or 21 points after Rebel Aces. Do you take a Rookie Pilot, or that?

Toss Opportunist on a GSP and you essentially have this for 23 points.

Edit: Or 21 points after Rebel Aces. Do you take a Rookie Pilot, or that?

Ya, Opportunist is good, but it situational based on your opponent not having a token. To make the A-Wing more relevant in my mind it needs to have some claws to take advantage of flanking. I think my idea provides a better solution than adding Opportunist or Outmaneuver.

Except the A-Wing already has the most green maneuvers in the game. This would effectively allow it to attack like an E-Wing for 10 fewer points.

I think the game has enough talents of this nature already. Outmaneuver is literally more firepower to reward flanking/positioning well. Expose, as well, to a certain extent--if you're confident enough in your piloting to take the risk. Predator is also something to consider.

And as PhantomFO mentioned, the A-wing has green 2-everything AND green straight everything. I agree that it'd be too powerful.

So basically, give it Push the Limit and you have a PtL Interceptor, only better, for 2 point less.

I went one on one with Tycho, using Etahn.

I got wrecked.

I think the game has enough talents of this nature already. Outmaneuver is literally more firepower to reward flanking/positioning well. Expose, as well, to a certain extent--if you're confident enough in your piloting to take the risk. Predator is also something to consider.

And as PhantomFO mentioned, the A-wing has green 2-everything AND green straight everything. I agree that it'd be too powerful.

I don't think it has even close to enough. This is a game of dog fighting and yet outflanking means absolutely nothing UNLESS you have an EPT.

I like the idea and helping the A-wing would be nice as I really am avoiding using it till the Aces come out however I can't help but feel like this title/modification ability would be better/more balanced on an advanced that only has 4 greens and at entry level is the same price as a rookie but with one more agility.

That being said if it was say an "Avenger" title, perhaps it should be costed at 1 point to make the rookie at 21, the blue squadron pilot at 22 and the basic tempest 22 along side the BSP. Further more Vader at 30 points with a built in PTL and possibility of throwing 4 reds at R1, 5 with opportunist makes the avenger something worth thinking about again. Also rolling that many reds might actually make us want to use Maarek Stele

I think the game has enough talents of this nature already. Outmaneuver is literally more firepower to reward flanking/positioning well. Expose, as well, to a certain extent--if you're confident enough in your piloting to take the risk. Predator is also something to consider.

And as PhantomFO mentioned, the A-wing has green 2-everything AND green straight everything. I agree that it'd be too powerful.

I don't think it has even close to enough. This is a game of dog fighting and yet outflanking means absolutely nothing UNLESS you have an EPT.

Outflanking generally gives a great advantage, the other guy isn't shooting back. (turrets excluded)

I like the idea and helping the A-wing would be nice as I really am avoiding using it till the Aces come out however I can't help but feel like this title/modification ability would be better/more balanced on an advanced that only has 4 greens and at entry level is the same price as a rookie but with one more agility.

That being said if it was say an "Avenger" title, perhaps it should be costed at 1 point to make the rookie at 21, the blue squadron pilot at 22 and the basic tempest 22 along side the BSP. Further more Vader at 30 points with a built in PTL and possibility of throwing 4 reds at R1, 5 with opportunist makes the avenger something worth thinking about again. Also rolling that many reds might actually make us want to use Maarek Stele

I don't disagree with the people who have raised the point that the A-Wing has too many green maneuvers and it would make it too good for it's price. Exactly the type of issues I was hoping would be brought up by the community. I like ixtda39's point that it might serve a better purpose on the Advanced.

I think the game has enough talents of this nature already. Outmaneuver is literally more firepower to reward flanking/positioning well. Expose, as well, to a certain extent--if you're confident enough in your piloting to take the risk. Predator is also something to consider.

And as PhantomFO mentioned, the A-wing has green 2-everything AND green straight everything. I agree that it'd be too powerful.

I don't think it has even close to enough. This is a game of dog fighting and yet outflanking means absolutely nothing UNLESS you have an EPT.

Outflanking generally gives a great advantage, the other guy isn't shooting back. (turrets excluded)

Excluded turrets is a big exclusion.. especially with the meta shifting to either playing Phantoms or countering them with turrets.. And yes, when I outflank you I get to attack, you don't unless you have a turret.. but do you really care about my A-Wing hitting you for 2 from outside your arc?? Probably not, you'll keep focused fire on the ships in front of your formation.

In order to keep an A-Wing with this ability balanced at it's current price would the following change be sufficient?

"After performing a green maneuver, when you attack this round your Firepower is increased by 1 to a maximum of 3"

- Prevents the A-Wing from getting 4 red dice at range 1

I always thought of the A-wing to be under powered even in the game series but just super agile. That being said what if instead of adding an attack we had an a-wing only modification that added the barrel roll action to the action bar for something like 2 points?

Of course with the refit that would make the upgrade a wash but now you have an interceptor but with more greens? I really don't like the idea of an a-wing hitting as hard as a rookie.

Not every ship needs 3 attack dice. The A-Wing is about survival, and it does this by hit-and-run or getting behind the enemy. Being outside of an enemy's fire is reward enough, but add in EPTs that reward smart maneuvers and you have a great little fighter.

I know that Rebel Aces is coming out soon and I believe it will do a good job in making the A-Wing more relevant, but I have been brainstorming ideas to make the A-Wing relevant in my personal (just for fun) games and had this thought.

"After performing a green maneuver increase your firepower by 1 until the end of the turn" - The basic idea is less energy is being directed to the engines and more to the weapons

I think this would dramatically increase the A-Wing's value, but too much so? It has a lot of green maneuvers on it's dial however it would make the A-Wing more predictable IMO.

Again! This is not in conjunction with Rebel Aces, just an idea I would like to discuss.

Thanks!

The A-wing's stat line efficiency (performance for cost) will be almost as good as a TIE Fighter once it can equip the -2 point Refit. And the A-wing has a far better dial, and boost. It won't need anything else after Rebel Aces. If you want it to be more "effective" now, just proxy the Rebel Aces cards.

The thing is, making the A-wing as good as a TIE Fighter is a false win. TIEs gain power from swarms, reflected nicely in the game. A-wings, however, were incredibly rare and for much of the war were made in underground, custom workshops by hand. They were never meant to be a swarm ship and only had significant numbers post-Coruscant once the Alliance had established itself as the New Republic. Anyway, A-wings were meant to be robust enough to operate on their own or in small numbers. So using them as TIEs is pigeon holing them into another style of combat -- never mind the Z-95 is the comparable Rebel fighter to TIE'Lns.

Likewise, while the A-wing only has two lasers, it made them deadly with its high agility. It could put those 2 lasers on target with greater ease and frequency giving them added punch. Y-wings have 2 lasers too but struggle to put them on target. X-wings are not as agile but have 4. In that sense, the A-wing really is quite similar to a X-wing. It's just that there are so few of them. I'd almost rather they have better attack and higher costs like the B-wing and Defender. So granting the A-wing an attic bonus based on green moves doesn't seem that bad. Just scary. And that's what A-wings were for. Rushing in and scaring the crap out of Imps who knew they couldn't get away. An EPT tax is not the way to make it work since all the other ships do fine without them according to their own native stats.

The thing is, making the A-wing as good as a TIE Fighter is a false win. TIEs gain power from swarms, reflected nicely in the game. A-wings, however, were incredibly rare and for much of the war were made in underground, custom workshops by hand. They were never meant to be a swarm ship and only had significant numbers post-Coruscant once the Alliance had established itself as the New Republic. Anyway, A-wings were meant to be robust enough to operate on their own or in small numbers. So using them as TIEs is pigeon holing them into another style of combat -- never mind the Z-95 is the comparable Rebel fighter to TIE'Lns.

Obviously they can get used differently tactically, but the raw stat lines provide a reference point for if something is blatantly overcosted or not. Without Refit, A-wings are overcosted for sure.

A-Wings are meant to give you something different than Xs or Bs. They are more often in correct position, more likely to dodge, and more capable of stressing. They are not the damage dealers of the Rebellion. This shortcoming does not equal 'overcosted' unless you refuse to use them as they were intended.

I think the game has enough talents of this nature already. Outmaneuver is literally more firepower to reward flanking/positioning well. Expose, as well, to a certain extent--if you're confident enough in your piloting to take the risk. Predator is also something to consider.

And as PhantomFO mentioned, the A-wing has green 2-everything AND green straight everything. I agree that it'd be too powerful.

I don't think it has even close to enough. This is a game of dog fighting and yet outflanking means absolutely nothing UNLESS you have an EPT.

Outflanking someone means you get to attack them without getting attacked in return. It also means that on the following round your opponent has a difficult decision to make, mediated by his or her dial (which, if you're in an A-wing, is almost certainly worse than yours): turn toward you, or K-turn and drop an action?

I think the game has enough talents of this nature already. Outmaneuver is literally more firepower to reward flanking/positioning well. Expose, as well, to a certain extent--if you're confident enough in your piloting to take the risk. Predator is also something to consider.

And as PhantomFO mentioned, the A-wing has green 2-everything AND green straight everything. I agree that it'd be too powerful.

I don't think it has even close to enough. This is a game of dog fighting and yet outflanking means absolutely nothing UNLESS you have an EPT.

It means you don't get shot.

A-Wings are meant to give you something different than Xs or Bs. They are more often in correct position, more likely to dodge, and more capable of stressing. They are not the damage dealers of the Rebellion. This shortcoming does not equal 'overcosted' unless you refuse to use them as they were intended.

http://community.fantasyflightgames.com/index.php?/topic/105107-2014-regionals-results/?p=1066846

1. TIE Fighter 30.61%
2. X-wing 17.14%
3. B-wing 14.44%
4. TIE Interceptor 11.81%
5. YT-1300 9.20%
6. Firespray 6.76%
7. Y-wing 3.48%
8. Lambda Shuttle 3.31%
9. TIE Bomber 2.08%
10. HWK-290 0.76%
11. A-wing 0.39%
12. TIE Advanced 0.03%

Do you still maintain that they are not overcosted at 17 points? The results from over 1000 people that competed at Regionals indicate otherwise.

A-Wings are meant to give you something different than Xs or Bs. They are more often in correct position, more likely to dodge, and more capable of stressing. They are not the damage dealers of the Rebellion. This shortcoming does not equal 'overcosted' unless you refuse to use them as they were intended.

http://community.fantasyflightgames.com/index.php?/topic/105107-2014-regionals-results/?p=1066846

Overall ship usage

(Regionals wave 3, last updated June 25, using weighted average)

• TIE Fighter 30.61%
• X-wing 17.14%
• B-wing 14.44%
• TIE Interceptor 11.81%
• YT-1300 9.20%
• Firespray 6.76%
• Y-wing 3.48%
• Lambda Shuttle 3.31%
• TIE Bomber 2.08%
• HWK-290 0.76%
• A-wing 0.39%
• TIE Advanced 0.03%

Do you still maintain that they are not overcosted at 17 points? The results from over 1000 people that competed at Regionals indicate otherwise.

Any change made to one ship only drops all the others. 'Improving' an A-Wing will inflate it past another ship which will then seem overcosted, until points mean nothing.

That is exactly what outflanking means.. but look at the possible scenarios of using an A-Wing "correctly" to flank an opponent.

- You successfully time a flank to coincide with your other ships attacking from the front (very difficult to pull off)

1. You are at range 2-3 and only throw 2 red dice... hardly more than an annoyance
2. You close to range 1, get to throw 3 red dice (if you even get to attack... In order to be range 1 on the opponents flank you have to make a very predictable move that your opponent can easily counter by banking a heavy fighter in your direction and hit you range 1 with 4 red dice. Roll the 3 fickle greens and see if you survive.) Then, because the A-Wing is limited on slow maneuvers (no 1 bank/straight) good luck staying on your target.
3. To avoid scenario 2, you either choose scenario 1 by staying further back OR try to position yourself to be in a better position come next turn and don't take a shot this round.
4. Included just for completeness, your opponent stupidly decides a flanking A-Wing is more dangerous than the rest of your ships and turns into the A-Wing opening his flank to your main force.

I have watched games were flanking works, and it has either been through fantastic maneuvering on the flanking players part or, and this is the more common occurrence, the player facing the flanking action mismanages his moves so badly that he loses too many actions via bumping and/or no one in firing arcs.

All that means to me is that the current trends in competitive strategy do not favor the A-Wing's specialties. A TIE Swarm cannot be outflanked. Neither can a Falcon. Wave 4 probably changes that, as Tycho is an excellent Phantom hunter.

There have been 4 wave 4 Regionals, total attendance of 126 players. There have been exactly zero A-wings in the Final Cut or Top Third. Feel free to revisit these statistics later until Rebel Aces is legal....