I'd like to further stir up the Internet here by point out that Keyan Farlander is an Ace Y-Wing pilot in the canon, and was one of the survivors of the First Death Star assault.

Didn't he also fly a B wing at the battle of Endor?

I'd like to further stir up the Internet here by point out that Keyan Farlander is an Ace Y-Wing pilot in the canon, and was one of the survivors of the First Death Star assault.

Didn't he also fly a B wing at the battle of Endor?

Sure did! Farlander flew pretty much everything in the EU as well! :L

Maybe we've been looking at this the wrong way. B-Wing Aces? Sure, why not. But did A-Wings really need any attention? We already know how powerful they are, especially when you run them against Y-Wings. The fact that all you have to do to win as an A-Wing player is kill a single Y-Wing and kite the rest around the edge of the board until time is called clearly means that A-Wings are the superior craft. In that context, then, shouldn't the Y-Wing get some love? Without more pilots and upgrades there's no way for this poor dog of a dogfighter to ever catch up with the nimbler craft.

Be a good sport, FFG. Let slip the dogs of Star Wars, and give Y-Wings their time in the spotlight.

I've stayed out of this little poo-flinging extravaganza--although I have to say, if your intent was to bait iPeregrine into a(nother) fit of incoherent, COC-violating rage, then it's a job well done. But I don't see why both of you can't be right.

Given that X-wings were already getting a content refresh with the transport, and that the Falcon is still a beast and the HWK appears to be functioning more-or-less as intended, the remaining options for the Rebel mirror of the Imperial Aces sku were (in order of age) Y-wing, A-wing, and B-wing. The A-wing was also kind of a gimme, since they were obviously underused and in need of an update.

So that leaves us with B-wings and Y-wings competing for the final slot. B-wings are aggressively priced (1-2 points too cheap in comparison to an X-wing, or 1 shield too strong), but the named pilots are run very seldom (Ten is 1-2 points too expensive in comparison to Wedge, which means he's 2-4 points overpriced with respect to Blue Squadron; Ibtisam has poor synergy with all the existing system-upgrade options). So B-wings really did need a bump in the form of new unique pilots, which an Imperial-Aces-style blister is perfectly positioned to deliver.

On the other hand, Y-wings are ancient in terms of the game's lifecycle, and they suffer from a lot of the game's early design flaws: they're an ordnance platform saddled with inefficient ordnance, their PS bids are overpriced and underused, they lack EPTs, and one of the named pilots has a great ability that synergizes with almost nothing else in the game. They still have a role to play as a stubbornly durable control platform, and they're actually great there; and if you have a need for a no-action TL, Dutch is still a great addition. But that means only two pilots are ever run, and neither has any practical flexibility in their configuration.

But I can understand the argument in favor of the B-wing: the Y-wing is getting a small refresh on the side from new astromechs (e.g., Dutch + R7-T1) and new torpedoes (e.g., Gold + Flechette + Flechette), while the standard B-wing doesn't get much out of the Epic releases and due to its higher base price is less attractive as an ordnance platform. So the B-wing got a couple of new pilots and the ability to pick up some of the Rebels' recent crew (at a price, which is a nice little of balancing). That also gave FFG the ability to introduce a pair of new support crew that work well in Epic play and also synergize with the HWK. Buffing the Y-wing would have made a very narrow slice of the game, but buffing the B-wing actually has a subtle but wide effect on the game.

But with all that said... Of course the only people who know for sure what's coming up can't talk about it, but it seems silly to think that FFG's people looked at the Y-wing and said "nah, it's fine, let's go on to something else." They play the game too, I think, and they undoubtedly know how we feel about the Rebellion's poor, overlooked workhorse.

So I read through 6 pages of this (What am I doing with my life?), and iPeregrine is still arguing essentially that every box which expands upon a ship must be called, very specifically, an "Aces" box? And this is the core of his argument?

Perhaps you should try understanding instead of just reading the words? Obviously there is no requirement that every expansion have an "aces" label, as FFG very clearly demonstrated when they put a bunch of new x-wing pilots and upgrades in the transport box. But if you're going to make a rebel "aces" expansion, as FFG was pretty much committed to doing once they did the imperial one, that implies some things about the ships and pilots will be chosen for that expansion.

It wouldn't have changed anything about the set if it had been called "Rebel Heroes" instead of "Rebel Aces"; with that said, I don't have any problem with adopting "aces" as a generic label for FFG's reprints going forward.

But worth noting: you've gone far beyond your original point into the realm of just vomiting insults all over the thread. If someone can read the whole thing and come out with the idea that you're overly fixated on what FFG decides to call the sets, then maybe it's worth considering that either (a) you're not communicating as well as you think you are, or (b) you actually are overly fixated?

"If one guy calls you a Hutt, ignore him. If a second guy calls you a Hutt, begin to wonder. If a third guy calls you a Hutt, buy a drool bucket and start stockpiling spice." Corran Horn, I, Jedi

Oh man, I forgot how amazing this thread was. It was just as fun to read a second time as it was to write.

Farlander + Opportunist + FCS + E mod + Gunner

Spendy at 41 points, but he gets to roll 4 dice at range 1. If he misses, he can attack again, roll 5 dice the second time with Opportunist, with a target lock from the first attack and FCS, and still spend the stress from Opportunist as a focus.

Also, I like the idea of Blue + E mod + Lando. A B-Wing that can have 2 evade tokens on top of his green dice is one determined B-Wing.

Farlander + Opportunist + FCS + E mod + Gunner

Spendy at 41 points, but he gets to roll 4 dice at range 1. If he misses, he can attack again, roll 5 dice the second time with Opportunist, with a target lock from the first attack and FCS, and still spend the stress from Opportunist as a focus.

Any plan that starts "if I miss with my 4-dice attack..." has a serious hole in it. It's why Gunner and HLC don't really get along (ditto Gunner and the Phantom): you're optimizing in two different directions simultaneously.

Aces mean five or more kills, right?

So what is the problem with having a Y-wing being an ace pilot? That just means that the Y-wing pilot is able to fly their clunky ship to the best of it's abilities while jacking up Tie Fighters. Not too far fetched in my opinion.

Scrubbed through this thread and didn't see anyone mention Fire Control System + Reconnaissance Specialist. This what I plan on doing...is this not viable?

Farlander + Opportunist + FCS + E mod + Gunner

Spendy at 41 points, but he gets to roll 4 dice at range 1. If he misses, he can attack again, roll 5 dice the second time with Opportunist, with a target lock from the first attack and FCS, and still spend the stress from Opportunist as a focus.

Any plan that starts "if I miss with my 4-dice attack..." has a serious hole in it. It's why Gunner and HLC don't really get along (ditto Gunner and the Phantom): you're optimizing in two different directions simultaneously.

You clearly haven't played me in a game. Let me rephrase my previous statement (to match what always seems to happen with me):

Spendy at 41 points, but he gets to roll 4 dice at range 1. When he misses, he can attack again, roll 5 dice the second time with Opportunist, with a target lock from the first attack and FCS, and still spend the stress from Opportunist as a focus.

I can't even count the number of times 4+ attack dice have come up with either all blanks or no damage output for me.

Scrubbed through this thread and didn't see anyone mention Fire Control System + Reconnaissance Specialist. This what I plan on doing...is this not viable?

I can't see much of a role for Recon Specialist on a B-wing, since having a focus token for defense doesn't provide much help to a ship with 1 Agility unless you're under seriously concentrated fire.

I can't even count the number of times 4+ attack dice have come up with either all blanks or no damage output for me.

Fair enough; I've had games like that, too. It's just that--at least, when I'm not at at the table watching my Fett miss that stupid HWK for the fifth bloody time in a row--5 points always seems way too expensive for an insurance policy against an event I'm trying to avoid.

Honestly, they just need to give them a turret that can deal damage and doesn't suck. Blaster Turret is a miserable weapon. A stress cannon would be pretty epic. Weapon 2. If it scores at least one hit also stress the opponent. Range 2-3.

But whatever it is, 5 points or so should be the upper limit. The Hawk and Y-Wing don't have the bulk to back up 12 points of upgrades like the Outrider does.

If you have a ship that can take a turret or a cannon and has a crew slot you can give it a tactician and start popping out stress tokens with all your range 2 attacks regardless of whether the attack hits or not. You take a HWK with an Ion turret and a tactician or a B-wing with an ion cannon and tactician with the new upgrade and it is going to piss someone off. Ion tokens force the target to do a white 1 straight maneuver so they can't do a green maneuver to lose the stress. So they will still be stressed the next turn so you can shoot again with the ion and give them a second stress and maybe even another ion. Whether you hit or miss they now have at least 2 stress and maybe another ion. Third round even if they don't have another ion they can't take actions like barrel roll or boost to try and evade your next ion shot nor can they K-turn due to the stress. At best they can try a green maneuver to get rid of one stress, but they still have the second one remaining. This means they can try to flee your attack, but will be quite limited in their options for doing so, and if you are lucky you can just keep piling the stress on them or at least bog them down so much that the ship can't do much other than frantically try to flee.

Honestly, they just need to give them a turret that can deal damage and doesn't suck. Blaster Turret is a miserable weapon. A stress cannon would be pretty epic. Weapon 2. If it scores at least one hit also stress the opponent. Range 2-3.

But whatever it is, 5 points or so should be the upper limit. The Hawk and Y-Wing don't have the bulk to back up 12 points of upgrades like the Outrider does.

If you have a ship that can take a turret or a cannon and has a crew slot you can give it a tactician and start popping out stress tokens with all your range 2 attacks regardless of whether the attack hits or not. You take a HWK with an Ion turret and a tactician or a B-wing with an ion cannon and tactician with the new upgrade and it is going to piss someone off. Ion tokens force the target to do a white 1 straight maneuver so they can't do a green maneuver to lose the stress. So they will still be stressed the next turn so you can shoot again with the ion and give them a second stress and maybe even another ion. Whether you hit or miss they now have at least 2 stress and maybe another ion. Third round even if they don't have another ion they can't take actions like barrel roll or boost to try and evade your next ion shot nor can they K-turn due to the stress. At best they can try a green maneuver to get rid of one stress, but they still have the second one remaining. This means they can try to flee your attack, but will be quite limited in their options for doing so, and if you are lucky you can just keep piling the stress on them or at least bog them down so much that the ship can't do much other than frantically try to flee.

Dealing a stress and an Ion can definitely be crippling, but keep in mind Tactician is firing arc only. You can only do it to a ship in front of you, and if you intend to do it repeatedly, you can easily be overwhelmed by his other ships attacking from behind, particularly if they stay at range so you can't shoot them for just the ion token instead.