Hopefully some of the smart people here can clarify some questions I have regarding Desent : RtL.

1.) Can you use Breath or Blast to hit multiple targets if you are inside of a pit?

2.) Regarding Necromancy, does the creature you control also block Overlord Spawning (ie, works like Boggs)?

3.) Its possible my entire group has missed it but we have not read anywhere that the original Leadership Skill card should be removed to be replaced with the newly written Leadership card that mandates a Fatigue point to be spent to use it. We have just added the new Leadership Skill card to the deck. Obviously the original card is better and we figured that the "other" Leadership card was put in so others in the party can have Leadership but at a higher price. Are we doing this right? Or should the original Leadership Skill card be removed to be replaced by the one that requires Fatigue to use?

4.) Who exactly can the Overlord buy Avatar Upgrades for? More specifically the ones that read for Any Avatar (like +1 movement, +1 armor, +1 gold die, +15 health). There are essentially 3 catagories I guess. The Main Avatar, Lieutenants, monsters. Can these cards that read Any Avatar only be bought for the Main Avatar or the Lieutenants? Or can you buy the +1 armor, +1 gold die, +15 health for a specific type of monster (ie Skeletons)? The rule book reads like I should be able to put those upgrades on monsters if I like but +1 gold die and/or +15 health seems way over the top and too powerful to put on a monster.

Thanks

Montag

Montag1 said:

1. As far as I know yes.

2. never used the skill, so will let someone else answer that.

3. Afraid you got this one wrong. Remove the original skill from the game. Play with the reworded one.

4. I think you might be a little confused. The Avatar upgrade that says "Any Avatar" mean that any of the avatars can purchase them. So, if you are the Demon Prince, or Beastman Lord, etc. - doesnt matter, you can buy them. When the card says "Your Avatar gains +1 armour", it means just that - the Avatar himself. i.e These upgrades do absolutely nothing until the final battle (which from what I have read is completely pointless anyway as the heroes always win)

Montag1 said:

A figure in a pit only has LOS to the spaces next to the pit. You could use a blast to target one of those spaces, but then the attacking figure would also be hit. Does not seem like a wise move in most circumstances.

I see I was beat to answering by a couple people as I'm at work and pulled up the rulebooks online to check for myself, but this is what I found:

1) I'd say so, because even when you don't have line of sight to some monsters (say with blast, you target the monster in front and it hits the one behind him as well). So long as you can target someone next to the pit (or an open space? I forget if you can target an empty space with blast), you can use blast, but you will hit yourself. And I think Breath would just use the template as normal, hitting whatever would normally be hit. Although in both cases you suffer -1 range and damage for attacking up, right (didn't see this specifically about pits, just tables/beds, if anyone has an answer if that applies to pits, that'd be cool)? Not that range matters for breath

2) I'd say no, figuring it works like a familiar (don't recall if the card specifically says so, but it seems right), and from page 14 of JitD rulebook: A familiar does not count as a hero for purposes of spawning monsters unless its description states otherwise. Boggs is the only one that states otherwise.

3) it says at the beginnging of the AoD rulebook to remove the old leadership card and use the new one.

4) I believe the cards themselves say specifically what is upgraded, what it says in the rulebook just applies to avatar upgrades in general, which could be the +1 gold die for your avatar, or it could be adding a new lieutenant to the game, or it could be the spider queen's upgrade giving bane spiders pierce 2 and burn.

Hammerdal said:

Yes, you can target Blast to an empty space. You can actually target any attack to an empty space but Blast the only one that really makes use of it. There is no penalty for attacking out of a pit like those associated with tables/beds/etc, aside from only being to hit the squares adjacent to the pit.

Big Remy said:

This makes it sounds like you can only hit squares adjacent to the pit. I assume you mean target? And I assume you are referring to blast and not breath? I may have actually told a hero he couldn't breathe out of a pit once, but thinking about it now it seems that he certainly could, since breath ignores range, los, elevation, obstacles and all that good stuff that isn't a door or a wall. And with blast, you could target an adjacent space and then blast 3 would make it go that many spaces in all directions from your original target...unfortunately that would also include the blaster in the pit.

Yes in that case, hit = target.

Nitpicker

Hammerdal said:

Thank you for the timely answers and responses.

Regarding the answers...

1.) Yeah, we suspected that blast could work (by targeting the adjacent hex) and taking the hit to yourself as the price. With Breath, the reason we didnt know was because the rules dont address if it could be used out of a pit. The rules do explicitly state that Breath can NOT be used up or down stairs.

2.) That certainly makes the most sense. I guess because it was an actual figure (and not a token) we just all assumed it blocked spawning like a Hero! Heh, silly us.

3.) Well thats just plain stinky! I liked my Fatigueless Leadership Skill. Out of curiousity, I read through all the FAQ stuff I could find but didnt come across an explanation for the change to Leadership. Is there a reason why this was changed?

4.) I agree now with the consenus here because it certainly makes the most sense. However, I'm still confused on the issue. On Page 24 of the RtL Rulebook on the 4th paragraph it reads:

"Avatar Upgrades can improve the Avatar itself, upgrade a specific type of monster, or bring into play a lieutenant for the overlord to command."

Why does it say "upgrade a specific type of monster" instead of upgrade a specific lieutenant? To me and our group it seemed like you could upgrade specific types of monsters (ie skeletons, bane spiders, kobolds, etc). That is the confusing part. And then, looking at the cards, some of them seem very weak (for example the +1 armor, +1 speed cards). It would seem odd to me to ever spend 20 xp points for those 2 when you could almost upgrade a monster type to silver/copper/gold/diamond or buy more treachery points which would be WAY more useful.

I'm not tryng to argue with anybody, just trying to understand the rules better and hoping that with clarification from you guys on stuff I dont understand it can help me to understand the other issues myself without having to ask silly questions on the forums.

Thanks again,

Montag

Montag1 said:

I think this is easily enough cleared up by just looking at the cards themselves, as each one is quite clear on who they affect.

For example, Protective Magics is for any Avatar, and says: "Your Avatar gains +1 armor"

Or, Mountain Giants for the Titan Only: "All of your Giants gain 10 extra wounds"

Seems pretty clear, so sorry, you can't spend 10 conquest to give your kobolds an extra armor

I believe the way that passage you quoted is supposed to be read, is as giving 3 examples of the different bonuses Avatar upgrades can get you, not to say that each one one gives you the choice of one of those three options.

Hammerdal said:

Ahhhh, now I get it. That really clears it up. Thanks.

Montag