So there has been a lot of talk about what to do with the tie advanced. If and when they come out with a refit type mod for it....this is my thought.

2 pts. Advanced only title

When you reveal your maneuver dial, you may perform one free coordinate action.

Turns the advanced into a command ship. Basically giving it squad leader without giving up its own action. Does not make it compete with the defender or interceptor for a role in your squad.

Would make it very unique, and give the imperials some action passing. Witch would in turn be a boon for the bombers, witch also do not get much love.(except for seismic charges). But would make missiles more usable.

Would be fun to play, as you can have what amounts to advanced sensors passed to any ship within range 2.

Not sure about the points.....I think it is worth more than 2 for sure....but on the advanced that is a bit over costed to start I think it might be a good price point.

Thoughts?

edit...might make it just a range one coordinate.

Yikes, could you imagine a squad of TIE Advances led by Vader who all had this title?

It's an interesting idea, to be sure. But I think there are other possibilities that could work better...as TheWanderingMiller says, a squad of them could be killer. Actions upon actions. You could, of course, make it a unique title, but then you could still only field one Advanced at a time.

Honestly, it would probably be easier to either add a missile slot upgrade a la Chardaan Refit or a missile slot upgrade that gives it +1 attack. But I'm just beating a dead horse by saying that, of course

Ya, I heard the refit idea, and I am not sure i like just making it cheaper. Not sure how good a squad of just advanced with the title would be. at the end of the day you have 4 ships with 2 attacks each, but I did consider that.

And if they were led by Vader, you would just have 3 ships....so prob not that strong.

I also thought about making it a unique title as well. I don't mind the idea of just fielding one at a time. That is one more than I field now. And it is such a cool ship.

Also, just love the idea of turning it into a support ship. Not really useful as is, and if you make it better it will just be a defender.

There is a precedent for abilities like this already. Cracken, Lando. So not really that broken in my opinion.

Oh deary...

It's probably not going to give up it's missile slot; if that was the route they were going charden refit wouldn't have been awing only. Also, since they were making the awing 2 less that means the advanced are probably 3 or 4 over latex since most of us were on the "at least 2 over" mark for the advanced and 1 over for the awing.

I still think the most elegant method is a avenger title and x2-7 unique prototype titles.

The only title that the advanced should be is Advanced 1x. and I say add Boost in the Action bar and it will be good enough. Unique 3 point title card because Vader is expensive enough.

The only Advanced I have actually tried on the table is Vader.

Not worth the points (IMO) but fun with his 2 actions.

Why not expand that in a balanced way?

Grant the Tie Advanced a second action. (with limitations perhaps; no desire to beak the game)

Advanced avenger upgrade: this ship now has three attacks cost 0

The problem with the advanced is its under gunned so simply give it that extra attack die, it's already priced as if it was a ship with quad guns.

The Advanced is the best ship in the game to take Proton Rockets. It also does a very good job of feeling like an x1 thematically. I'd say just knocking a few points off it would do the trick. Knowing FFG they'll do something clever though.

Advanced avenger upgrade: this ship now has three attacks cost 0

You're aware that would make it pretty much exactly a 3 agility X-wing, just with a 5 straight instead of a 1 straight?

You're aware that would make it pretty much exactly a 3 agility X-wing, just with a 5 straight instead of a 1 straight?

with a barrel roll.

with an evade.

with a missile.

without a torpedo.

without an astromech...

If tie avenger comes in it'll be 3332 with target lock, evade, focus and missiles all my suggestion does is upgrade the experimental advanced to the production avenger.

By all means suggest a points cost, I put it at 0 because everyone already complains the advanced is over costed.

In the universe, the Advanced production was halted in favor of mass producing the Interceptor, which was considered more cost effective.

The lack of cost efficiency on the advanced and it becoming a fading memory of Imperial lists of the past reflect its in-universe fate.

So forget the Advanced! Forget it for ever!

Do you think Fantasy Flight games will revive a ship that everyone already has 2 dust collecting copies of with a new errata or rules update, or do you think they'd rather sell a new product?

The Advanced is the best ship in the game to take Proton Rockets. It also does a very good job of feeling like an x1 thematically. I'd say just knocking a few points off it would do the trick. Knowing FFG they'll do something clever though.

Advanced avenger upgrade: this ship now has three attacks cost 0

You're aware that would make it pretty much exactly a 3 agility X-wing, just with a 5 straight instead of a 1 straight?

Tie Bomber with Stealth Device is the best ship to take Proton Rockets!

The Advanced is the best ship in the game to take Proton Rockets. It also does a very good job of feeling like an x1 thematically. I'd say just knocking a few points off it would do the trick. Knowing FFG they'll do something clever though.

Advanced avenger upgrade: this ship now has three attacks cost 0

You're aware that would make it pretty much exactly a 3 agility X-wing, just with a 5 straight instead of a 1 straight?

Tie Bomber with Stealth Device is the best ship to take Proton Rockets!

Stealth device is not good on 2 agility ships. That added damage will get stripped away long before you fire. Especially because you can't spend your focus to preserve it.

If tie avenger comes in it'll be 3332 with target lock, evade, focus and missiles all my suggestion does is upgrade the experimental advanced to the production avenger.

By all means suggest a points cost, I put it at 0 because everyone already complains the advanced is over costed.

The Defender's stat line is 3/3/3/3, meaning there's only a Shield Upgrade's difference between that and your proposed TIE Advanced + Avenger title. Obviously the dial and upgrades are different, but it would be very difficult to balance such a title in a way that made both the Advanced and Defender viable choices.

Do you think Fantasy Flight games will revive a ship that everyone already has 2 dust collecting copies of with a new errata or rules update...?

Yes.

(1) Have you looked at the previews for Rebel Aces? They've already set a precedent by reviving the A-wing.

(2) Most of their manufacturing overhead is undoubtedly tied up in the development of new molds and production lines, so it's probably slightly more profitable for them to package an existing ship with new rules than to develop an entirely new product.

You're aware that would make it pretty much exactly a 3 agility X-wing, just with a 5 straight instead of a 1 straight?

with a barrel roll.

with an evade.

with a missile.

without a torpedo.

without an astromech...

Would you price Torpedo and Astromech the same as +1 Agilty, Evade, Barrel Roll, Missile? Cancel off the two ordnance upgrades and you've got Astromech slot costing the same as Evade (Falcon Title), Barrel Roll (Expert Handling) and +1 Agility (more hardcore stealth device).

I don't think a 3/3/3/2 Evade, Barrel, Missile, TL is in the same ballpark as 3/2/3/2 Astromech Torpedo TL, let alone worth the same.

I'm thinking about an avenger Title or modification for the advanced - 3 attack and a systems upgrade slot for 3 pts. then I'm also giving them a tractor beam option for their systems slot: if at the start of the combat phase a small enemy ship has your red target lock token and is in your firing arc reduce its agility by 1. 5 pts

Sorry, I should clarify, I'm thinking about using those as upgrade options for a campaign I'm planning, the main idea being that I need maarek stele to be playable, and fluffy.

If tie avenger comes in it'll be 3332 with target lock, evade, focus and missiles all my suggestion does is upgrade the experimental advanced to the production avenger.

By all means suggest a points cost, I put it at 0 because everyone already complains the advanced is over costed.

The Defender's stat line is 3/3/3/3, meaning there's only a Shield Upgrade's difference between that and your proposed TIE Advanced + Avenger title. Obviously the dial and upgrades are different, but it would be very difficult to balance such a title in a way that made both the Advanced and Defender viable choices.

Do you think Fantasy Flight games will revive a ship that everyone already has 2 dust collecting copies of with a new errata or rules update...?

Yes.

(1) Have you looked at the previews for Rebel Aces? They've already set a precedent by reviving the A-wing.

(2) Most of their manufacturing overhead is undoubtedly tied up in the development of new molds and production lines, so it's probably slightly more profitable for them to package an existing ship with new rules than to develop an entirely new product.

The defenders roll as hlc boat jousting master would be safe, the defender isn't a dog fighter but the avenger is.

It's got quad guns and all prior ships with quad guns get three attack, it's more substantial than a tie fighter having less than three hull makes no sense, it's as agile as the advanced so no justification for going below three defence.

How is 2332 over costed but 3332 undercosted, what value do you attach to that one attack because that's the only difference between the advanced and the avenger.

If tie avenger comes in it'll be 3332 with target lock, evade, focus and missiles all my suggestion does is upgrade the experimental advanced to the production avenger.

By all means suggest a points cost, I put it at 0 because everyone already complains the advanced is over costed.

The Defender's stat line is 3/3/3/3, meaning there's only a Shield Upgrade's difference between that and your proposed TIE Advanced + Avenger title. Obviously the dial and upgrades are different, but it would be very difficult to balance such a title in a way that made both the Advanced and Defender viable choices.

Do you think Fantasy Flight games will revive a ship that everyone already has 2 dust collecting copies of with a new errata or rules update...?

Yes.

(1) Have you looked at the previews for Rebel Aces? They've already set a precedent by reviving the A-wing.

(2) Most of their manufacturing overhead is undoubtedly tied up in the development of new molds and production lines, so it's probably slightly more profitable for them to package an existing ship with new rules than to develop an entirely new product.

The defenders roll as hlc boat jousting master would be safe, the defender isn't a dog fighter but the avenger is.

It's got quad guns and all prior ships with quad guns get three attack, it's more substantial than a tie fighter having less than three hull makes no sense, it's as agile as the advanced so no justification for going below three defence.

How is 2332 over costed but 3332 undercosted, what value do you attach to that one attack because that's the only difference between the advanced and the avenger.

3232 is 21, so 2332(Although it should be 2-3 points cheaper). Bumping up to 3332 requires an increase in point cost.

If tie avenger comes in it'll be 3332 with target lock, evade, focus and missiles all my suggestion does is upgrade the experimental advanced to the production avenger.

By all means suggest a points cost, I put it at 0 because everyone already complains the advanced is over costed.

The Defender's stat line is 3/3/3/3, meaning there's only a Shield Upgrade's difference between that and your proposed TIE Advanced + Avenger title. Obviously the dial and upgrades are different, but it would be very difficult to balance such a title in a way that made both the Advanced and Defender viable choices.

Do you think Fantasy Flight games will revive a ship that everyone already has 2 dust collecting copies of with a new errata or rules update...?

Yes.

(1) Have you looked at the previews for Rebel Aces? They've already set a precedent by reviving the A-wing.

(2) Most of their manufacturing overhead is undoubtedly tied up in the development of new molds and production lines, so it's probably slightly more profitable for them to package an existing ship with new rules than to develop an entirely new product.

The defenders roll as hlc boat jousting master would be safe, the defender isn't a dog fighter but the avenger is.

It's got quad guns and all prior ships with quad guns get three attack, it's more substantial than a tie fighter having less than three hull makes no sense, it's as agile as the advanced so no justification for going below three defence.

How is 2332 over costed but 3332 undercosted, what value do you attach to that one attack because that's the only difference between the advanced and the avenger.

Because a PS1 3323 is 27 points.(See the E-Wing.) And a 3333 is 30.

3232 is 21, so 2332(Although it should be 2-3 points cheaper). Bumping up to 3332 requires an increase in point cost.

Which is why I asked you to say what you think that point increase should be, what's that third attack worth in your mind.

If tie avenger comes in it'll be 3332 with target lock, evade, focus and missiles all my suggestion does is upgrade the experimental advanced to the production avenger.

By all means suggest a points cost, I put it at 0 because everyone already complains the advanced is over costed.

The Defender's stat line is 3/3/3/3, meaning there's only a Shield Upgrade's difference between that and your proposed TIE Advanced + Avenger title. Obviously the dial and upgrades are different, but it would be very difficult to balance such a title in a way that made both the Advanced and Defender viable choices.

Do you think Fantasy Flight games will revive a ship that everyone already has 2 dust collecting copies of with a new errata or rules update...?

Yes.

(1) Have you looked at the previews for Rebel Aces? They've already set a precedent by reviving the A-wing.

(2) Most of their manufacturing overhead is undoubtedly tied up in the development of new molds and production lines, so it's probably slightly more profitable for them to package an existing ship with new rules than to develop an entirely new product.

The defenders roll as hlc boat jousting master would be safe, the defender isn't a dog fighter but the avenger is.

It's got quad guns and all prior ships with quad guns get three attack, it's more substantial than a tie fighter having less than three hull makes no sense, it's as agile as the advanced so no justification for going below three defence.

How is 2332 over costed but 3332 undercosted, what value do you attach to that one attack because that's the only difference between the advanced and the avenger.

Because a PS1 3323 is 27 points.(See the E-Wing.) And a 3333 is 30.

3232 is 21, so 2332(Although it should be 2-3 points cheaper). Bumping up to 3332 requires an increase in point cost.

Which is why I asked you to say what you think that point increase should be, what's that third attack worth in your mind.

I think one more attack die is worth at least 8 points. HLC is 7 points, and you can only put it on a ship that already has 3. Plus it comes with a slight nerf, due to reducing crits. So a flat 1 point increase should be worth about 8. For the advanced, since we think it is 2 points over costed...6 pts to upgrade it to 3 attack.

But the big problem with upping the attack is that it starts to muscle in on the defenders turf. They would have about the same role in your squad.