One factor I consider to be an advantage for the Defender over a Firespray is the base. It is far too easy to block a large-base ship like a Firespray (with initiative, anyone PS3 or lower can do it). They're also far more vulnerable to tightly clustered asteroids, depriving their action.

So why wouldn't you take ptl if you wanted both a focus and tl? I get that the defender becomes very predictable shredding stress, but being able to always get a focus, and getting a tl or a br when needed sounds better to me than relying on predator. I still stand by my argument that rexler ability doesn't trigger enough to justify his cost.

because the defender's only green moves are straight. it can't bank if it has a stress and wants to focus. it can't hard turn at all at that point other than at 3. With predator, even if you hard turn or get stressed somehow, you can re-roll dice. On a defender (and sometimes in general for this new stress-inducing environment) predator > PTL

Perhaps. There is a LOT of factors that are involved with when you choose to trigger is ability. What the opponent is playing. But, I do really like him as a potential way to screw up big hull ships.

They are very similar ships and I think it comes down to pilot skill (player not stat) and pilot skill (stat not player).

If you have a lot of time flying the Firespray you can get sooo much mileage out of that back arc (I also like Kath with EH or PTL so...). Once you have the player skill to fly the Firespray it becomes deadly fast. I don't think anyone (well only a handful at this point) has the time in on the defender to claim "mastery". I don't think the new meta has shaken out enough to even know what "mastery" of the defender (or phantom) will look like as player skill comes in the form of tactics AND maneuvers. Even after we get maneuvers down the tactics to go with the new meta will evolve.

Pilot Skill (stat) is also awkward for the comparison. The baseline Delta is PS 1 while the "standard" firespray is 3. Those are important move and fire positions. One moves before everything and one fires before all base models and at the same time as a few non-basics. Both have benefits. When you move up to Onyx vs. Krassis you're looking at 3 vs. 5 with the defender occupying the same spot as the Basic Firespray and Krassis firing before almost all un-named and with many named and moving after all basics. If Krassis had an EPT he'd be pretty **** scary.

Moving farther up you have Kath and Fett Vs. Vessary and Rexlar...really no comparison between pilot abilities. I am a firm advocate of seeing Fett (and to a lesser extent Kath) as the first pilot to get a second card. Make him either "Boba Fett, Bounty Hunter" and have him with a lower PS and new skill or "Boba The Fett" and just give him a more powerful ability. My personal favorite is: "When this ship is placed during the deployment phase, acquire 1 TL on any enemy ship; while you have an enemy ship TL'd you may reroll 1 die when defending and 1 die when attacking." Makes him an actual bounty hunter and is pretty powerful too. Kath's PS 7 is nice but her ability is totally outclassed.

Define Rich? Most any full time employed adult can afford the Corvette if they want it, andmost players playing competitively in these kind of events will have it.

If you don't play Epic it's an utterly excessive amount of money to fork out for two cards. You need to have a pretty significant disposable income to not care about that.

Define Rich? Most any full time employed adult can afford the Corvette if they want it, andmost players playing competitively in these kind of events will have it.

If you don't play Epic it's an utterly excessive amount of money to fork out for two cards. You need to have a pretty significant disposable income to not care about that.

Id say, relying on the rear firing arc can suck when you are trying to get your opponent to chase you, and they don't, putting you out of close range or potentially any combat for a whole round. The Defender is more able to stay in close range combat, WITH actions. The 1 fwd and banks help with this as well. We all know how annoying it can be to play imperial ships whose slowest speed out of a K Turn is 2. Can certainly cause problems that rhe Defender doesn't have.

Also, you can formation fly with the Defender with Tie Fighters pretty easily. Its not a bad idea, imo. Cant do thay very easily with the Firespray, making focus fire harder sometimes.

Define Rich? Most any full time employed adult can afford the Corvette if they want it, andmost players playing competitively in these kind of events will have it.

If you don't play Epic it's an utterly excessive amount of money to fork out for two cards. You need to have a pretty significant disposable income to not care about that.

And most players that play this game play Epic as well. It's a fantastic format. Far and away a better game than standard.

proof for both of these statements, plz

They are very similar ships and I think it comes down to pilot skill (player not stat) and pilot skill (stat not player).

If you have a lot of time flying the Firespray you can get sooo much mileage out of that back arc (I also like Kath with EH or PTL so...). Once you have the player skill to fly the Firespray it becomes deadly fast. I don't think anyone (well only a handful at this point) has the time in on the defender to claim "mastery". I don't think the new meta has shaken out enough to even know what "mastery" of the defender (or phantom) will look like as player skill comes in the form of tactics AND maneuvers. Even after we get maneuvers down the tactics to go with the new meta will evolve.

Pilot Skill (stat) is also awkward for the comparison. The baseline Delta is PS 1 while the "standard" firespray is 3. Those are important move and fire positions. One moves before everything and one fires before all base models and at the same time as a few non-basics. Both have benefits. When you move up to Onyx vs. Krassis you're looking at 3 vs. 5 with the defender occupying the same spot as the Basic Firespray and Krassis firing before almost all un-named and with many named and moving after all basics. If Krassis had an EPT he'd be pretty **** scary.

Moving farther up you have Kath and Fett Vs. Vessary and Rexlar...really no comparison between pilot abilities. I am a firm advocate of seeing Fett (and to a lesser extent Kath) as the first pilot to get a second card. Make him either "Boba Fett, Bounty Hunter" and have him with a lower PS and new skill or "Boba The Fett" and just give him a more powerful ability. My personal favorite is: "When this ship is placed during the deployment phase, acquire 1 TL on any enemy ship; while you have an enemy ship TL'd you may reroll 1 die when defending and 1 die when attacking." Makes him an actual bounty hunter and is pretty powerful too. Kath's PS 7 is nice but her ability is totally outclassed.

I agree with what you posted. The BH in my opinion is the 2nd best generic pilot in the game, 2nd only to the Royal Guard Int. The Defender generics are pretty low PS and pricey to boot.

So BH > Defender generics.

But, when you talk about the named pilots, its in heavy favor of the Defender. In reality the named Firespray pilots are kind of 'meh' when you look at their abilities. Trassis can re-roll on a secondary, but you can only use it in your front arc. Very limiting. Kath's ability is garbage as far as I'm concerned. Its the one ability I don't want to ever trigger. I rather give the target a Crit than a stress token. The only reason to run Kath is for the PS and EPT. Boba Fett's ability is lack luster too. It might be good on a small base ship, but its limited on a large base. He's harder to block, but his ability isn't that helpful.

Vessery has a built-in FCS thats not too hard to trigger. He can really dish out punishment. Brath is ok and it might take Tactical Officer for his ability to really shine. Predator helps on him too, but makes him expensive.

Vessery has a built-in FCS thats not too hard to trigger. He can really dish out punishment. Brath is ok and it might take Tactical Officer for his ability to really shine. Predator helps on him too, but makes him expensive.

Vessery's ability would be better suited on a rebel pilot, given that all of their ships have target locks. Vessery requires you to build a list around him if you want to use his ability an appreciable amount. If you put TC on squishy ships like tie fighters or interceptors, those ships are at risk if they decide to target lock instead of focus or evade. The ability also requires higher pilot skill pilots to not use their target lock, unless they have a system's upgrade and FCS.

At least Rex's ability stands on its own. Tactical Officer may make it more likely for his ability to trigger, but it can still trigger regardless.

Vessery has a built-in FCS thats not too hard to trigger. He can really dish out punishment. Brath is ok and it might take Tactical Officer for his ability to really shine. Predator helps on him too, but makes him expensive.

Vessery's ability would be better suited on a rebel pilot, given that all of their ships have target locks. Vessery requires you to build a list around him if you want to use his ability an appreciable amount. If you put TC on squishy ships like tie fighters or interceptors, those ships are at risk if they decide to target lock instead of focus or evade. The ability also requires higher pilot skill pilots to not use their target lock, unless they have a system's upgrade and FCS.

At least Rex's ability stands on its own. Tactical Officer may make it more likely for his ability to trigger, but it can still trigger regardless.

Vessery has a built-in FCS thats not too hard to trigger. He can really dish out punishment. Brath is ok and it might take Tactical Officer for his ability to really shine. Predator helps on him too, but makes him expensive.

Vessery's ability would be better suited on a rebel pilot, given that all of their ships have target locks. Vessery requires you to build a list around him if you want to use his ability an appreciable amount. If you put TC on squishy ships like tie fighters or interceptors, those ships are at risk if they decide to target lock instead of focus or evade. The ability also requires higher pilot skill pilots to not use their target lock, unless they have a system's upgrade and FCS.

At least Rex's ability stands on its own. Tactical Officer may make it more likely for his ability to trigger, but it can still trigger regardless.

Vessery's ability would be broken in conjunction with the Z-95. As is it's kind of terrifying for a number of reasons. Specifically what it can do with a Heavy Laser Cannon, but also in that he gets the target lock after rolling dice, which means when he uses ordnance he can get his target lock back for the attack. Even on the second cluster missile attack.

I don't see how it would be broken with Z-95s. Anyway, the point is that it's trickier to work into an imperial list, especially given the base cost of 35 points.

And I don't think we'll be seeing Vessery fielded often with cluster missiles. The cluster missile combo requires both Vessery and another ship to gain a target lock on the same ship. If the other ship is higher PS, it cannot spend its TL before Vessery. Then, if you want to ensure the attack does decent damage, you may want to wait until you can get a focus the following turn. It's a lot of setup in order to get what amounts to two primary attacks with target lock. I would think it better to pay three more points and just get HLC instead.

Define Rich? Most any full time employed adult can afford the Corvette if they want it, andmost players playing competitively in these kind of events will have it.

If you don't play Epic it's an utterly excessive amount of money to fork out for two cards. You need to have a pretty significant disposable income to not care about that.

And most players that play this game play Epic as well. It's a fantastic format. Far and away a better game than standard.

proof for both of these statements, plz

As to being a better format. There is more strategic depth to epic, and it actually fits the dimensions of battles we see in universe. I could continue but most of it involves how much fun I've had in every epic match I've ever played.

Defender has one downside... imo it is an ugly sloth looking ship. Looks like it was made with spare Tie/Int parts.

Sorry to de-rail the discussion.. just got my wave 4 in the mail.

Surprised but I am most impressed with the z-95 model and the defender just looks goofy (imo as always).

Defender has one downside... imo it is an ugly sloth looking ship. Looks like it was made with spare Tie/Int parts.

Sorry to de-rail the discussion.. just got my wave 4 in the mail.

Surprised but I am most impressed with the z-95 model and the defender just looks goofy (imo as always).

Awesome work on the diagrams. Very well put together!

Defender has one downside... imo it is an ugly sloth looking ship. Looks like it was made with spare Tie/Int parts.

Sorry to de-rail the discussion.. just got my wave 4 in the mail.

Surprised but I am most impressed with the z-95 model and the defender just looks goofy (imo as always).

You can pry that Defender model from my cold, dead hands! My ships came in yesterday, it was the first (and so far only) one I opened so far, I think it's the best looking of the bunch. /nostalgia

I'm not sure I would ever play it competitively though.

I agree as well, the Tie Defender is one of the best looking Ties around, sexy deadly beast!

Another two that look nearly just as good are the Tie Avenger and the Tie Interceptor (those angled dagger wings are sweet), I find the Tie Advanced (Vader's) just average...too plain vanilla.

shrug If Krassis has taught me anything, often times, one reroll is enough. I don't see using Rexlar's ability more than once or twice a game. And that is okay, because the rest of the ship is nice and beefy enough.

He's also PS 8 and his ability is a clear hard counter to Chewie, who we might be seeing more of to counter phantoms. Interestingly, too, PS 8 base, 3 agility and 6 health, a white k-turn and his ability, make him a decent phantom counter as well.

Hard counter to Chewie might be going too far. He negates chewies ability somewhat, but he can't just wipe the floor with Chewie, and any decent player will have 3PO and use him against you, making your crits a pretty slow damage process.

I don't follow this, how does Rexlar counter Chewy's ability??

Attacker modifies first(this includes pilots abilitys, yes?)

Then defender modifies (including pilot abilitys)

What have i missed??

shrug If Krassis has taught me anything, often times, one reroll is enough. I don't see using Rexlar's ability more than once or twice a game. And that is okay, because the rest of the ship is nice and beefy enough.

He's also PS 8 and his ability is a clear hard counter to Chewie, who we might be seeing more of to counter phantoms. Interestingly, too, PS 8 base, 3 agility and 6 health, a white k-turn and his ability, make him a decent phantom counter as well.

Hard counter to Chewie might be going too far. He negates chewies ability somewhat, but he can't just wipe the floor with Chewie, and any decent player will have 3PO and use him against you, making your crits a pretty slow damage process.

I don't follow this, how does Rexlar counter Chewy's ability??

Attacker modifies first(this includes pilots abilitys, yes?)

Then defender modifies (including pilot abilitys)

What have i missed??