Community Errata

By Distractionbeast, in The Lord of the Rings: The Card Game

Posted at

Mndela abd ruchsabre

Developers can make mistakes too. If you look at hearthstone, they do a lot of errata, making some cards stronger, some weaker. A lot of times. Why? Because they make mistakes, because they don't really know the game before people play then too long, they sometimes are too cautious when creating cards, they can overlook some cards (as you can see with the Blue Mountain Trader). I saw the interview with one of the Star Wards Devs that he said that if he could change some cards, he would, but because doing so is horrible for the players (because what they see on the cards does not correspond) they shy away of correcting it and keep the faq to a minimum, only doing corrections for misworded or broken cards. I understand why they do that.

My problem is having a lot of useless cardboard around, but those cards could be awesome (and fun) with a little push. That's why I find this discussion interesting. The devs are not going to use any of our card design here, so don't worry.

This came is not competitive and people can play with they friends with those errata no problem. I will if I can make a list of good errata that is not broken. My vision for my changes and suggestions are:

  1. The simpler, the better.
  2. Make the card useful, but not overpowered.
  3. Look at other cards to help design.
  4. Cards should be usable to as many decks possible (ex: Hero Dwalin)

Mndela and ruchsabre I think that you suggestions could be useful, if you have then.

Edited by Edvando
Posted at

well, from my perspective i feel lucky as i am

1- a weaker player

2- a theme player

so, i guess i am a little more merciful to weaker or strong cards, as they are never just sat there :P

actually, my other main concern for a growing errata, alongside my above points, is the players who dont frequent this forum or read through the insert fully... i really do believe that the players would benefit from having a paper version of the faq inserted in the packs

i guess this would not add a huge amount onto the cost, especially as the errata isnt updated all that often, though it would depend on how it was printed...

if it would add a lot to the printing costs, then perhaps add them into the deluxe boxes only (as they are needed for the adventure packs anyways

Edited by richsabre
Posted at

Catastrophic09, great suggestions! I will give my two cents in your opinions.

Glorfindel (Spirit) Raise your threat by 1 after Glorfindel commits to a quest. He would still be powerful but not ridiculous with LoV

I try to avoid nerfs for the reasons that I said before. I agree with this, but would shy away of implementing it.

Dain Ironfoot should only give his boost to dwarves under your control. giving it to all dwarves in multiplayer is outrageous
Same as above. But a 4 player all Dwarfs decks are INSANE.
Lure of Moria should cost 4 since its super close to Grim Resolve if you're playing all dwarves and seems way OP at 3 cost
I never understood Lure of Moria. It is much better than Grim Resolve and We Do Not Sleep. I think each Ready All should be different from one another, So I would make it cost 2 and Dwarfs don't need to ready to defend and also give dwarfs the text from Stand Together. What do you think? The problem is that this is against my philosophy of "The Simpler, The Better". Personally I would make Grim Resolve cost 4 and keep Lure of Moria as is.
Unexpected Courage should be limit one per deck because its such a superior readying ability
Unexpected Courage is fine. Just buff Stead of the Mark and we are good.
Steward of Gondor needs to cost at least 3 or even 4 because its such a huge resource engine at only 2 cost
Same as Nerf. But it would be probably fine to cost 3.
Outlands characters could be fixed in many ways one being they only give each other outlands character a bonus and not themself or.. instead of being a passive ability they have to exhaust to give outlands characters the stat bonus.

Outlands are fine. Devs told us that they are a easy Trait for people that want it. They will probable not receive any more direct support. But I kinda dislike Ethir Swordsman because he is used in other decks too in place of Silvan Refugee. I would buff silvan to have 2hp and nerf Ethir. Not sure what to do with Ethir.

Edited by Edvando
Posted at

actually, my other main concern for a growing errata, alongside my above points, is the players who dont frequent this forum or read through the insert fully... i really do believe that the players would benefit from having a paper version of the faq inserted in the packs

i guess this would not add a huge amount onto the cost, especially as the errata isnt updated all that often, though it would depend on how it was printed...

if it would add a lot to the printing costs, then perhaps add them into the deluxe boxes only (as they are needed for the adventure packs anyways

The idea of adding a print errata to the deluxe boxes is a REALLY great one. Worth of making a whole new topic on it so, maybe, devs see it. They will very hardly do it though =/

Posted at

actually, my other main concern for a growing errata, alongside my above points, is the players who dont frequent this forum or read through the insert fully... i really do believe that the players would benefit from having a paper version of the faq inserted in the packs

i guess this would not add a huge amount onto the cost, especially as the errata isnt updated all that often, though it would depend on how it was printed...

if it would add a lot to the printing costs, then perhaps add them into the deluxe boxes only (as they are needed for the adventure packs anyways

The idea of adding a print errata to the deluxe boxes is a REALLY great one. Worth of making a whole new topic on it so, maybe, devs see it. They will very hardly do it though =/

yeah i agree - if others add their support i will do so :D

Posted at 
Bilbo Lore should obviously be less threat

This changes nothing. One less threat and he is the same. Instead, I would +1 Def. Now he is playable as a defender (as Denethor). The problem is that maybe he overshadows Denethor.

Radagast should cost less, 4 would be better

Totally agree. His stats are horrible and his ability are not worth 2 more cost.

Glorfindel Lore should heal 2 damage with one resource

See my suggestion. This one is also good (and make the card much better then my suggestion).

Silverlode Archer- the Ithilien Archer has an extra defense, hit point AND ability for same cost.. wtf.. SA should have 3 attack

I'm ok with this. Maybe this make him godlike, but he is still a fragile ally that is very costly.

Beorning Beekeeper- an extra attack point or ability dealing damage to all enemies in play not just staging area

I like more the all enemies in play. To make him more unique instead of a dmg dealing ally for any deck.

Ride to Ruin- should cost 0, you're discarding an ally!
Two cards, 1 resource from the card plus the resource from the ally. Good change.
We Do Not Sleep- the  worst readying ability event, for the same cost you can ready all characters! (Grim Resolve) or all Dwarves for only 3... And We Do Not Sleep is only good for "readying" after questing so it should only cost 4 max

I would make it cost 3. Look at lure of moria!

Dawn Take You All should discard all shadow cards (from at least one player), it's a one time event and the dawn covers ALL darkness

Totally agree. Still maybe not good enough.

Taking Initiative should discard the top two cards (maybe even add their value together) to increase this cards chance of working
The design of this card is horrible. It should work in a two hero deck or a allyless deck. Even so, the deck need good costly card to make it work and most of those cards are allies. The problem with this errata is that it changes the spirit and the intent of the card. I don't know what would make this card elegant, make it viable in a two hero/allyless deck and that is a simple change.
Keeping Count should add: Response- after Keeping Count enters play search your deck for another Keeping Count. Limit 2 Keeping Count's allowed in play.

+1 cost. If you don't, this card is too awesome and broken.

Ravenhill Scout- he sucks and should only cost 2

Totally agree. Would still make this card hard to put in a deck!

Dunedain Wanderer should cost 4 and have Secrecy 2

I'm ok with this. But it would still not be a good card. Make it neutral! Maybe this helps.

The End Comes- this card shouldn't exist.. lol

Agreed.

Grave Cairn- who uses this? a character has just died, how much attack can they really have? this card should cost 0
Agreed.
Watcher of the Bruinen- since when is a 2 defense 2 hit point ally good for anything!? give him an extra hit point or defense
An extra HP would be good enough.
Short Cut- you're exhausting a Hobbit and paying one to replace an encounter card? you should be able to choose a location at any time

Not sure of this one, but I don't like it though. Anyone has a suggestion?

Out of Sight is too expensive, make it 4 cost Secrecy 2 and maybe allow you to choose a player (most of the Secrecy cards are overpriced and shouldn't be)

Agreed. Maybe making it choose a player make it too good. But if we look at feint, that cost less and is useful in most if not all quests, you can make a case for this. Also, helps secrecy, that REALLY needs help.

Late Adventurer- this is only if you suck at planning who to quest with, give that character an extra willpower and this card might enter decks

Great idea. Totally agree.

Wealth of Gondor/Gaining Strength- worth a card slot for only one resource? I sometimes use these but I feel they need a little more, add a card draw for Wealth and make it a net gain of 2 resources for Gaining Strength

Good ideas. When you compare those to steward of gondor, you see how broken is steward. Those changes make those cards great and more competitive with steward. Still, steward overshadows both options.

Damrod- is his ability and stats worth that cost? how about an extra defense

Extra def is nice. Still almost impossible to use his ability and he would be a stat only ally. I would like to make his ability more useful somehow.

Master of Lore- should not have been errata'd

Master is the resource acceleration for lore. But he is fragile and take 3 turns to pay for himself. I would -1 cost and +1 hp. Maybe still not good though.

Mirlonde should be printed Lore AND Silvan heroes get her discount because at max all her ability does is give you 3 less starting threat, she should also be one less starting threat herself, why not?

The first part is ok, still weak but useful. The second part, I don't like it because it violate the implicit rule of the threat cost and make the card less elegant. 

Pippin Spirit should not be limited to having all Hobbit heroes and his ability should only raise your threat by 2

He is useful, the problem is the all hobbits that limit him too much. 2 threat is too low.

Denethor Leadership ally should get -1 Willpower for each hero with 2 or more damage

Not sure about this. He would be too good.

Faramir Lore hero should have an extra ability or something that boosts his fellow faithful rangers (If Faramir has X attack, all Ranger characters you control get ????)

-1 def and +1 atk would be enough.

Caldara- her ability is to DISCARD her, give her less starting threat, 7 or even 6 and if the allies she could put into play weren't limited to Spirit.. then she would be powerful

She is very powerful, but only goes in very limited decks. I like the idea of not limiting to Spirit allies. Maybe this make her useful in a 2 Hero Spirit deck.

Theoden- another hero from this cycle suffering with a poor ability, he should also have "Theoden can pay for Rohan allies from any sphere" he's the King of Rohan!! come on!

Yeah, this would be really nice. Compare him to Elrond and you see that he is not that broken if we do this.

Forth Eorlingas! why be limited to Rohan heroes, make it Rohan characters, there's hardly anyone left in the staging area after engagement anyways or just make it 1 cost

This one needs playtest! Not sure if one or both changes would be enough. I would go with Rohan Characters first.

Steed of the Mark is only worth it if attached hero has 3 or more willpower (so it may get better when those heroes come), why does it have to cost? just exhaust it for it's ability

If you make this change, basically we have a new Light of Valinor for anyone. Not sure what to do though. Make it 0 cost?

Fatty Bolger- 6 starting threat since his ability raises threat and he's not that great anyways

As I said before, this violate the implicit rule of threat cost. Not sure what to do with him. His ability is really good for the end of the scenario for the last punch or when the players are going to quest unsuccessfully or something. Very situational. Anyone has other suggestions?

Posted at

In this post i dont see cards that need to be faqqed. I only see bad players that they dont know how to play them.

Posted at

Good suggestions all around!

I don't know how I ever missed We Do Not Sleep. I tend to block certain cards out of my brain after years of non use.

We Do Not Sleep: cost=3

Forth Eorlingas!: target all Rohan characters.

Theoden: Attachments played from your hand onto Rohan characters cost 2 less.

Taking Initiative: If the cost of the card is equal to or higher than the number of allies and attachments you control...

Posted at

In this post i dont see cards that need to be faqqed. I only see bad players that they dont know how to play them.

Don't insult please. No game or design is perfect and they're not made only for "perfect" players. We're just participating as fans and having a little fun.

Posted at

In this post i dont see cards that need to be faqqed. I only see bad players that they dont know how to play them.

Wow, just wow. Not worth to go on more than this.

Theoden:  Attachments played from your hand onto Rohan characters cost 2 less.

This is broken. I can play my whole hand for free.

Taking Initiative:  If the cost of the card is equal to or higher than the number of allies and attachments you control...

Are you trying to make this card worse? Read the card again.

Posted at

In this post i dont see cards that need to be faqqed. I only see bad players that they dont know how to play them.

Taking initiative is useless unless you drawn it in your opening hand and playing with 2 or less heroes. This card is horrible no matter how good you are.

Posted at

In this post i dont see cards that need to be faqqed. I only see bad players that they dont know how to play them.

Taking initiative is useless unless you drawn it in your opening hand and playing with 2 or less heroes. This card is horrible no matter how good you are.

http://community.fantasyflightgames.com/index.php?/topic/103589-taking-initiative-deck/?p=1044971

The deck is bad and will fail hard. As the card itself is.

Posted at

If you search a deck to win all quest in multiplayer and solo, ok: all cards here must be faqqed. But those decks are boring, you can build them even with only core.

In fact, the taking initiative deck (see above) can win all quest playing with another friend. It is a very powerfull deck: it can deal 2 damage to 1 enemy almost each round and ready all allies or characters in play sometimes.

Edited by Mndela
Posted at

Yeah, whatever excuse you can find for this pathetic abomination of a card.

Posted at

Mndela, I'm trying really hard to not start a flame war here. But you are making it really hard.

What you doing is basically going into a Custom Card Topic and saying that creating cards is retard. Maybe for you, but let people have fun. You don't need to use those cards. I find most of the First Age cards bad, so I don't use then.

Your defense against this is pointless. Our FAQ will not be made official, your group of friends are not going to use this and the Devs couldn't care less about this. So this is for our groups, for our friends. This is to make more decks possible, to make more cards useful, to add variety and more fun. If you disagree. Cool, we all can see that. If you are not going to help, please, leave. You are only making us feel a huge dislike about you.

Anyone is free to come here and add suggestions, improve the suggestions of other, argue about balance, show some insight about card design, etc. Coming here and saying what you saying is basically being a bad person. One of those guys. Do you know those guys? Man, those guys...

Edited by Edvando
Posted at

Ok, sorry if my posts are offensive. Closed question for me, then.

Posted at

Ok, sorry if my posts are offensive. Closed question for me, then.

Wow, I'm really surprised. I was expecting some more confrontational response. Thank you very much for understanding =D

You are free to add to the discussion in the model that I said in my post. You probably know a lot and could give us some insight. But it needs to be constructive, of course.

Posted at

Ok, lets go, for me the cards atm could be changed:

Master of Lore: i'd quit out the limit 1 per round)

Even Onward: maybe something like 'instead raise threat each player, distribute between players the raising of one player'.

Posted at 
Even Onward: maybe something like 'instead raise threat each player, distribute between players the raising of one player'.

Good suggestion. Probably need better wording, but the idea is very good.

Master of Lore: i'd quit out the limit 1 per round)

Didn't they errated that because it was broken?

Posted at 
Even Onward: maybe something like 'instead raise threat each player, distribute between players the raising of one player'.

Good suggestion. Probably need better wording, but the idea is very good.

Master of Lore: i'd quit out the limit 1 per round)

Didn't they errated that because it was broken?

Yes but the errata could be by another way.

Posted at

Anyone has sugestions for the following cards. If possible, make it simple.

Ever My Heart Rises

Something to make it less of a niche "I win this specific quest" type of card.

Spare Hood and Cloak

Very hard to use. If you give it to a hero that sometimes doesn't have what to do in a round (like Fatty Bolger) and pass it to someone else, it is great. But then the hero that received is generally someone that is very busy (like legolas) and the Hood never moves on. Maybe someone that enlighten me about some deck that this card is great.

Keen-Eyed Took

What is this card for? Can someone enlighten me or give suggestions?

Yes but the errata could be by another way.

Sure, but taking it back as is don't resolve the problem. You need to change it someway. Maybe -1 cost helps (probably not).

Posted at

Keen-Eyed Took: it is good for Taking Initiative. Lol ^^

Posted at 
Keen-Eyed Took

What is this card for? Can someone enlighten me or give suggestions?

It serves a few purposes:

1) Gives you knowledge of what is on top of your deck. This can be useful for something like Vilya or a card that relies on knowing what is coming next in your deck.

2) Allows you to get a card into the discard pile. Could be useful for things like Stand and Fight, Hidden Cache, etc.

3) Could allow players to "thin" their decks and get rid of their top cards if they don't seem too useful in the hopes that the next card will be better.

4) Pops an ally out of play in order to activate certain effects (Horn of Gondor, Imrahil, etc.)

That being said, there are better options out there for all of these purposes.

Posted at

being perfectly honest i was holding off posting in this thread, mainly because i disagree with the very idea of errata unless its 100% needed (as in a broken card)

personally i would rather have 20 or so cards that are pretty awful generally but work well in theme or specific decks (or even decks that are weak on purpose to give a challenge on older quests if you dont have nightmare packs), than have 20 cards that dont work the way the text is printed on them... it just feels like you have a half-completed product

Hmm interesting second point.. I definitely agree that errata should only be used on cards that break the game or are overly powerful compared to everything else. This whole thread was what errata would you like to see and its mostly for fun because I would actually not want to see all mine or other people's errata suggestions become real because it would be way too confusing to remember what cards actually are.

I still wish many cards were slightly different to be more useful but as an LCG you're simply going to have weaker and stronger cards and the freedom of deck building let's you choose your decks power level which has many benefits and yes certain weak cards you do have to build a deck around but that can be fun.

And I must add it is nice having certain powerful cards like a dwarf swarm deck because if you really need to beat a quest its nice having the option to pull out your power deck. If all cards were equal you wouldn't be able to make those extra powerful decks or even a weaker deck for the purpose of your own fun creativity or the extra challenge.. so having a spectrum of weak and powerful cards is healthy for the game as long as they're not on the extreme ends of bad (The End Comes) or powerful (pre errata'd Erebor Battle Master).

So even though errata is only used when crucial its still fun to dream how certain cards could be better or to express why you think a card is OP which is the whole point of this thread.