I'd have to say no. I won one in the tournament. I've played it in three games so far. One epic, it got one shotted by a corvette at range while cloaked. The tournament game, it got owned by a Han Solo with initiative. Finally one regular game where it got eaten up by a Ten Numb with VI and an engine upgrade.

It's just to dependent on green dice and knowing where the enemy goes first.

During the tournament game, I was one shotted by Wedge in the first combat round. My phantom never got off a shot. :-( It went downhill from there.

Interestingly, no one actually suggests a better ship. So if the phantom is not the best, and I think it is, then what ship is?

Interestingly, no one actually suggests a better ship. So if the phantom is not the best, and I think it is, then what ship is?

The best ship really comes down to "best at what?". I know that is kinda taking the easy way out but there is a lot of truth in that statement. Best overall, you have to consider all aspects of the ships. For above average on maneuverability, offense, defense and point value the Firespray tops the list. If you isolate a category like maneuverability then surly the Phantom is the best. It's hard for me personally to consider it the best overall based on its 2 shield, 2 haul, 2 agility and high point cost. It certainly in the top 3 best overall but not the top.

The best ship is a category...the best at what, does not matter... the best support ship may be the Hawk. The best larger ship may be the Falcon. The best fighter...well maybe the x-wing or tie...

The best ship? As per the OP? Possibly the Phanton. Best system, movement, it has the best primary firepower, good agility, if not the best..

You decide...

Interestingly, no one actually suggests a better ship. So if the phantom is not the best, and I think it is, then what ship is?

How powerfull the phantom will be against list without a falcon it's hard to say, how powerful the phantom will be without a mini swarm to back it up its hard to say. Somewhere in the middle my just very well be the new meta

The best ship is a category...the best at what, does not matter... the best support ship may be the Hawk. The best larger ship may be the Falcon. The best fighter...well maybe the x-wing or tie...

The best ship? As per the OP? Possibly the Phanton. Best system, movement, it has the best primary firepower, good agility, if not the best..

You decide...

2 > 3 ? 2 would be the middle to me out of 1, 2 or 3. Ships that have a better agility, A-Wing, E-Wing, Tie Defender, Tie Fighter and Tie Interceptor all have better agility then the Tie Phantom. So are we just counting the cloak action as part of it's base stats now? Ok so a ship that can't attack while cloak is no threat at all. I know we are taking into account the Advance Cloaking Device right. Ok so upgrades count too, the E-Wing wins with Stealth Device and R2-F2. Unless 4 > 5?

Echo is good if flown well. The others might be predictable on where they are going to end out... Echo not so much. To make it even more random you can toss advanced sensors to barrel roll before the de-clock. It still comes down to predicting where your opponent is planning to move especially if you are going against higher PS.

The biggest thing I would say... It's more important to have the opponent in the flank than it is to get a shot off. You don't have to declock every turn if you are going to be giving a PS 9+ a shot on you (Especially Wedge!!!).

That and high PS turrets are your bane. To be honest I would take the list above with chewie and Lan both at PS 7 with my list of Echo, VI, Adv Cloak, Advanced Sensors, Bounty Hunter, OGP with Gunner and FC (tempted to swap the BH for a defender with HLC). I have 2 big bases to block where you can move the falcons. I can attack at range 2 with 4 dice to your one evade and keep the other falcon at range 3 for 4 and 5 evade dice (or slam into one to keep it from attacking). Meanwhile I have the OGP and BH both with 3/4 dice a turn as well.

Now if you instead give Lando VI or if you swap for Han its a different story. Now to take an attack I first have to get shot at with 3/4 dice with only 2 evade dice meaning I'll likely take the evade token over a focus.

Flew in a 3-way match today where the phantom player parked his loaded fighter right in front of Corran Horn even after cloaking shenanigans. It did not last past turn 3.

I think to qualify for "best fighter in the game" it needs to be forgiving of mistakes. The Phantom is not forgiving. If you park it on a rock, decloak with no ability to attack, forget that other ships fire before you fire and re-cloak, park yourself in front of an autoblaster, you're going to loose that fighter. 4 hit points and 2 base agility is not a mark of a tough survivor. Without cloaking the TIE Phantom is statted like a Z-95 but with twice the guns.

The best fighter in the game needs to handle well in the hands of experts and novices, and I think the X-Wing (and maybe the B-Wing?) has this down. The TIE Phantom will be throwing away points in the hands of an inexperienced novice who has no practice and understanding with how the Phantom works and who believes 4 attack and magical cloaking will somehow make him auto-win.

Yes it's the new best ship, are you kidding? In the hands of a skilled player it hard counters any ship with a Pilot Skill lower than it has, and does it with room for up to 5 other ships on the table to deal with the odd pesky YT-1300 that shows up to ruin the party. Absolutely hard counters them, even more thoroughly than the YTs used to hard-counter Interceptors. I have repeatedly defeated entire 100 point lists using a single Phantom.

In the rock, paper, scissors game it is like ROCK to everything else being paper and scissors. It isn't enough to bring paper, you need to devote your entire list to paper just to have a chance. Otherwise, you are depending on your opponent to screw up because in a remotely even playing field the Phantom dominates everything. Don't start with anecdotes about how you killed it this one time at band camp, of course it isn't invincible. It is however far, far, FAR, FAR!!!!! more effective for it's points than any other ship.

Maybe if they realize how badly they screwed up and ban Advanced Cloaking Device, things will trend back towards balance. As they stand, Echo and Whisper are so much more powerful for their points than anything else in the game it's not even funny.

This but replace Phantom with YT-1300 and also wind back the clock to wave 2.

The YT-1300 (named pilots) may be the best ship, but it's also the most expensive. In the words of the old cliche, you are getting what you pay for. But you might be able to say that the Academy TIE (or perhaps the Bandit) is the best ship, because it is the cheapest.

There is truly no way to answer such a question, without parameters to evaluate.

Just got back from an event in Tacoma where the winning build seems positioned to handle basically anything the Phantom could throw at him:

Chewbacca w/ Veteran Instincts, C3P0, Falcon Title, Recon Specialist

Lando w/ PTL, Nien, Han

With two pilots shooting at PS7, both with Focuses and Target Locks, they get initiative over everyone but the named ones. Even the named ones have to deal with 8 hull and 5 shields per Falcon. Chewie is tanky as heck, avoiding at least one damage per turn.

It's not a cheap list to run, requiring cards from the CR90 as well as two YT-1300s. But it flat-out murders Phantoms.

Looks like a similar list lost to Echo in regionals, though it looks like a different build.

I like the phantom but I will probably not run mine for a while. I think it was designed to help knock rebel pilots out of their comfort zones and it does that quite well. But regardless of what do you with it people have so built up the Phantom (even before it hit the table) that it will draw fire just because it will look nice on the Trophy wall.

I played a few games yesterday against the phantom with a mini swarm

Whisper , vi, recon specialist, ACD

Howlerunner

2x AP

Alpha

I ran

Han, vi, C3PO,gunner, falcon title, EU

Wedge, R2D2, outmanoeuvre , EU

Imperials had initiative in 4 games and I played the avoid the swarm and hunt the phantom, basically the phantoms mobility seamed very predictable ( would probably be different with echo) and the phantom went down very quick followed by wedge. I won 3 out of 4 games and the game I lost was when the swarm got to close ranks on wedge an Han faster than I predicted they would. I only just won each game and this was a list that was tailored to take out the phantom.

The big thing I expected was this huge movement on the phantom and not being able to predict where it would go and that was not the case. With out taking the phantom right out of the mix ( which I would have then focused on the mini swarm ) the movement was the same as with any list , move said ship into most idea position to fire on best/most vulnerable ship this round or next. Maybe not having the falcon would make a big difference but I'm not sure the mobility of the phantom is that unpredictable with whisper and with echo you are going to lose the PS bid rather easy.

Not saying I know all just stating what I experienced

With Falcon and higher ps I make sure that what I want you to shoot is up closer and personal, and the phantom is far away.

Most opponents will pick the shots at range 1-2 over shots at range 2-3

Last night I flew two different builds

One was echo with mini swarm which went 2-0 and my other was echo, Bh,and Fel and went 1-0

All games had Chewie, ewing and z95.

All games were just sickly one sided.

The most dmg done was 6 dm total in the third game which was 5 to my bh and one to Fel.

The echo mini swarm in a total of 5-0 with it. Really lovin that

This is what I fly

Echo

Veteran instincts

Advanced cloak

Fire control systems

Howlrunner

Swarm tactics

Alpha Squadron

Academy pilot x2

Had one close game with this against 2 shuttles with engine upgrades and Krassis with hlc. Went 2-0 against that

I haven't even used Whisper yet. I would like to but that 2 bank when used properly is just sickly amazing imo.

The options are so many.

When I pick my maneuvers I try to pick one maneuver that I can use of I decide to do a different bank

That way if my opponent does what I want him to do, I go plan A if not plan B and live to fight another day

I believe this is my favorite ship

I also had a similar list with Echo, Bh, and tie defeat Lando, wedge with swarm tactics and a rookie pilot

Again couldn't touch echo

What will be interesting is to see what the rebels get in response to the Phantom in Wave 6.

The Imps can't be the only ones to get a highly evasive and maneuverable ship.

Let the speculation begin.

You mean like the hyper mobile E-Wing, which can boost and barrel roll immediately before clearing the stress with any 1 or 2 maneuver?

Or the Hypermobile B-Wing, which can soon trade it's Engine Upgrade for a Navigator or Intelligence Agent? Or Gunner, for that matter...

First Regionals with Phantoms took place yesterday. Phantom took top spot, even after facing Falcons in the final. Too soon for definitive statements, but....

You know what his /her build was

That also matters

You know what his /her build was

That also matters

Whisper + Veteran Instincts + Advanced Cloaking Device + Fire Control Systems + Intelligence Agent; Howlrunner + Hull Upgrade; 3x Academy Pilot

From the regional thread.

Sure, mini swarm to kill large/turret ships, whisper to kill everything else..

I'm not convinced that a solid ship with meta-changing potential is considered "overpowered".

Just like any other ship that hit the meta and had a big impression, and it has happened every major wave. This is Wave 4, not some minor expansion that tweaks and adjusts. Expect big shifts in the meta in the same way like the Falcons and Slaves, Turrets and Interceptors, with Bombers and B-Wings before them.

Kill Phantoms first. Echo is amazing fast and with the right build is very hard to kill. First game I killed Echo first and the game was easy enough to finish to my win. In rematch I left Echo alone and he owned me in end game because I could not predict his movement and I could not get any of my three ships in good positions to pressure him. I was battered, but by ships were still in good standing, then Echo ate them alive.

First Regionals with Phantoms took place yesterday. Phantom took top spot, even after facing Falcons in the final. Too soon for definitive statements, but....

I saw that and it made me scratch my head why not one of those falcons was using Han with VI. I took a list that utilised Han with VI to an event on the weekend. It destroyed a Whisper + Mini Swarm list without breaking a sweat against one of the best players at the event.

First Regionals with Phantoms took place yesterday. Phantom took top spot, even after facing Falcons in the final. Too soon for definitive statements, but....

Because ships fly on autopilot and pilot error/variance is not a thing in this game...

First Regionals with Phantoms took place yesterday. Phantom took top spot, even after facing Falcons in the final. Too soon for definitive statements, but....

Because ships fly on autopilot and pilot error/variance is not a thing in this game...

All jokes aside, that proves one thing. They're competitively viable. Dual Falcons is a difficult list to do well with, something beating it is not really an indication of it being overpowered... Consider that it was paired with over half a tie swarm, which is already pretty powerful.

First Regionals with Phantoms took place yesterday. Phantom took top spot, even after facing Falcons in the final. Too soon for definitive statements, but....

Because ships fly on autopilot and pilot error/variance is not a thing in this game...

Yeah... Falcons do fly on autopilot.

All jokes aside, that proves one thing. They're competitively viable. Dual Falcons is a difficult list to do well with, something beating it is not really an indication of it being overpowered... Consider that it was paired with over half a tie swarm, which is already pretty powerful.

It kind of helps that the dual falcon list in question was janky in the extreme while the Phantom list was much tighter and cohesive too.

O.k. So let's look into the meta now that AZ regional is in. 2 Phantoms made the top 16. This does show the Phantom is a compedative viable ship. The words "Best Ship" and "Broken" have been tossed around while discussing the merits of the ship. Yes it seems the Phantom faced it's worse nightmare in a duel Falcon list. Despite that, the Imperial squad took home the prize.

Now this thread is dedicated to declaring the best ship in X-Wing Miniatures and whether the Phantom is worthy of the title. Most arguments are pointed towards Whisper and/or Echo as the example of the Phantom. Both of these pilots graced the top 16 this weekend, one each. Are we considering the Sigma or Shadow while we declare victory for the Phantom as "Best Ship"? Does the Phantom only really gain value at the named pilot level. If that is so, does it still deserve the crown or just the named pilots do?

There is one fact staring at me when looking at the meta and the information it provides. The winner of the AZ regionals did have the best ship (or named pilot) in the game in it. Yes the Phantom held a spot and showed off some new toys but Howlrunner was present yet again. 39 regionals have been reported at this point to the MajorJuggler. 19 of 39 winners of regionals, just better than 50% featured Howlrunner.

I can only come to one conclusion as to what the best ships is in X-Wing. That would be the Tie Fighter! The best pilot in the game is Howlrunner!