If they went the route of an Old Republic era product, I bet it would be a full-fledged core rulebook. There would be so much material to cover, they'd almost have to make it a huge book, and since they've shown a willingness to do a bunch of core rulebooks in the 40K line, I would not be even slightly surprised if we eventually ended up with 4-6 core rulebooks in the Star Wars line as well, accounting for possible second editions such as Dark Heresy is getting.

I would absolutely buy that.

The difference between the SW and 40k lines though is that all the SW games share the same system and are meant to be able to be played together, while the 40k line is not.

Well, the 40K books use the same basic rule structure, but each book is for progressively more-powerful character tiers, from the scrubs of Dark Heresy to the rather burly Space Marines of Death Watch, and the core issue is that the system really wasn't designed to handle such powerful characters, instead being an adaptation of Black Publishing/Green Ronin's WFRP2e system that FFG was required to stick with when they took over the Dark Heresy product line.

Core Rulebooks also tend to sell better than supplements, and there is also the fact that 30-40% of the book (the rules) are already done makes this a financial win. The question is whether Old Republic is still popular enough to sell.

Well, for most systems you've only got a single core rulebook, with D&D being something of an oddity due to splitting it into three main books (PHB, DMG, and MM), though you could consider the PHB to be the actual "core" rulebook with the DMG being more of an advisory tome. Thus, a core rulebook sells better than adventures or splats in most product lines because most players will at least want a copy of the core rulebook for their characters and to look up rules if need be.

FFG's Star Wars system is an odd duck in that each core rulebook is going to be around 40% the same material each time. And at $60 a pop, that gets rather pricey for those folks that want the proper rulebook for a given setting. Then you've got the matter of "should FFG publish sourcebooks for those additional core rulebooks as well?" It's not an issue if the customer is only buying books from one product line (such as sticking with just EotE material and ignoring AoR or F&D), but it becomes more of an issue as buying from multiple product lines increases the cost on the customer substantially, particularly if we start seeing more and more cross-pollination between product lines (already seen it with EotE recycling talents, specs, and species used in the AoR Beta).

What I'm wondering is how easy it will be to have characters from each core book together in one group? A Hired Gun with a Jedi Knight alongside a Soldier, for example.

Any idea how easy/seamless this will be?

It's going to be more a matter of GM's adventure imagination than mechanics. The devs have said all along they want all the book's careers to be compatible.

What I'm wondering is how easy it will be to have characters from each core book together in one group? A Hired Gun with a Jedi Knight alongside a Soldier, for example.

Any idea how easy/seamless this will be?

From what I've seen so far, everything looks to be fully compatible.

What I'm wondering is how easy it will be to have characters from each core book together in one group? A Hired Gun with a Jedi Knight alongside a Soldier, for example.

Any idea how easy/seamless this will be?

In terms of game mechanics, EotE and AoR fit together completely seamlessly (I can't comment on F&D, obviously, but I don't imagine that'll mess things up, either). Specialisations are of equal utility in both games, and a few are actually reprinted between the two lines (the Pilot spec in Smuggler IS the Pilot spec in Ace, for example). Characters could take Specialisations from both lines and, as far as I can tell, you wouldn't get any odd results.

Whether they fit together thematically depends only on the GM, and given the source FFG were aiming to adapt (a Smuggler/Diplomat/Jeeedai group) I don't think that'll be a problem for many. I can see AoR rebels pulling heists with their EotE contacts to fund their operations. I can see EotE scumbags supporting rebel operations if it means being rid of Imperial policing. I can see lots of drama and roleplaying opportunities bubbling up from the compromises each "faction" will have to make. Great stuff.

What I'm wondering is how easy it will be to have characters from each core book together in one group? A Hired Gun with a Jedi Knight alongside a Soldier, for example.

Any idea how easy/seamless this will be?

From Day 1, it's been the design intent to have all three books be able to be used in conjunction with one another, due to all using the same basic mechanics.

There's been no hiccups in regards to using EotE and AoR characters in the same group, with the caveat that AoR characters have more of a military-theme and thus tend to be a bit more combat-capable (almost all the AoR careers get Ranged [Light] as a career skill for instance, so most anyone can be a decent shot with a blaster pistol).

The only question in regards to Force and Destiny is if starting characters (particularly Jedi) are going to be in comparison to EotE/AoR starting characters. Odds are that species will have the same Starting XP budget and like the same starting 500 credits to buy gear, but the question is more of "what starting perks do the F&D careers provide?" For instance, what Force Rating does an F&D Force user have at character creation? Would Jedi PCs get the option of starting out with a bona-fide lightsaber (which is a very powerful weapon in this system unlike prior SWRPGs) or do they have to wait to acquire one?

There's also the question of what mechanic F&D will use to mirror EotE's Obligation or AoR's Duty. There's a lot of guessing and speculation, but no solid information. And there won't be until August when (hopefully) the F&D Beta drops at GenCon.

To FFG's credit, they've designed the system from the ground up with the intent of multiple core rulebooks that are intended to work together, so we shouldn't be seeing the problems that folks had with White Wolf's Old World of Darkness where mixing various supernatural types lead to all sorts of GM headaches when it came to powers.

In talking about possible new core rulebooks, I think it's important to note the purpose/theme of each core book announced. They aren't each tied to a particular film, and although the game is set in the Rebellion Era, each book isn't really an "era" setting so much as it is a "theme" setting. FFG picked the major themes they saw running through the Original Trilogy and made 3 games around those themes.

If there is another core rulebook in the making, it will likely be based primarily on a theme rather than a particular era. Not that some eras aren't tied in very close to themes, as with Age of Rebellion, but rather that the thematic approach seems to be the key.

In talking about possible new core rulebooks, I think it's important to note the purpose/theme of each core book announced. They aren't each tied to a particular film, and although the game is set in the Rebellion Era, each book isn't really an "era" setting so much as it is a "theme" setting. FFG picked the major themes they saw running through the Original Trilogy and made 3 games around those themes.

If there is another core rulebook in the making, it will likely be based primarily on a theme rather than a particular era. Not that some eras aren't tied in very close to themes, as with Age of Rebellion, but rather that the thematic approach seems to be the key.

I could see setting sourcebooks. IE Legacy era. Which would be a overlay for the 3 core books. Maybe with appropriate alternate careers and era specific info. But that would likely be fairly far down the road. Most likely we will see region and career books first for each game line. Like dangerous covenants and Suns of Fortune.

In talking about possible new core rulebooks, I think it's important to note the purpose/theme of each core book announced. They aren't each tied to a particular film, and although the game is set in the Rebellion Era, each book isn't really an "era" setting so much as it is a "theme" setting. FFG picked the major themes they saw running through the Original Trilogy and made 3 games around those themes.

If there is another core rulebook in the making, it will likely be based primarily on a theme rather than a particular era. Not that some eras aren't tied in very close to themes, as with Age of Rebellion, but rather that the thematic approach seems to be the key.

I could see setting sourcebooks. IE Legacy era. Which would be a overlay for the 3 core books. Maybe with appropriate alternate careers and era specific info. But that would likely be fairly far down the road. Most likely we will see region and career books first for each game line. Like dangerous covenants and Suns of Fortune.

Sure, I get different eras/settings, but what would the themes of those 3 new core books be? That's what's kind of elusive for me, so I'm wondering what other people are speculating along those lines.

Well, if you wanted theme core books they could actually do a Clone Wars theme if they were so inclined. However, this would be more of the 'bad' guy book folks seem to want. The first theme could be politics as Episode 1,2 and 3 were very much about the politics of the Old Republic. The second theme could again be the focus of war but instead of David and Goliath like theme you get Sparta and Troy both equally powerful equipped forces fighting tooth and nail for every planet sometimes inch by inch. The third theme could be that of the Sith (which everybody wants except possibly me) and the rise of them. Now this could also be used to cover things that occurred before such as that of the Kotor video games with the Jedi/Sith War and other events involving the Sith.

Personally I would like to see more books on adventures (maybe even multiple books to span a campaign), career expansions/updates, and galaxy setting books. In fact one idea I had was that they could do the hyper space lanes to better educate us on what they are and how to use them (especially for classes from EotE) plus could use it to give us equipment, species, and threats that aren't region specific. Love a book on the Corporate Sector and the Hutt Sector and maybe take a look at the Tion Hegemony and Hapes Cluster and address them during the different timelines. That is what I would like to see more books about.

In fact one idea I had was that they could do the hyper space lanes to better educate us on what they are and how to use them (especially for classes from EotE) plus could use it to give us equipment, species, and threats that aren't region specific. Love a book on the Corporate Sector and the Hutt Sector and maybe take a look at the Tion Hegemony and Hapes Cluster and address them during the different timelines. That is what I would like to see more books about.

these are the supplement books that i'm most excited for and hope that will come out as as FFG continues to release all the career and adventure books. i loved Suns of Fortune and want more sectors, hyperlanes, and populated worlds. the details of these books spark my imagination as a GM for adventures and campaigns, but really just help to provide further details when discussing the universe at the table. these help us flesh out the Star Wars universe and make it a living breathing experience.

in regards to thematic books, a Clone Wars book could cover politics and corruption, warfare and peace, much as the tv series was able to accomplish. a Dark Times book could focus on how everyday people decide that they've had enough and unite to rebel -- a sort of powerful vs. powerless theme that pcs would need to make a choice upon. just some quick thoughts there.

As for future editions and possible license extensions, it should be noted that a direct parallel with 40k and Warhammer Fantasy can't really be drawn. We have to keep on mind that Dark Heresy and I believe the vast majority of Rogue Trader and possibly even parts of Deathwatch were developed by Games Workshop through Black Industries, not by FFG. That a second edition of Dark Heresy is/has been made has more to do with FFG probably wanting more control over the game and the hope of bringing to more in line with Black Crusade and Only War than it being that magical to.e to make a new edition of the rules. Thus, I don't expect to see FFG looking at a new edition of Star Wars for the better part of a decade, since they didn't take on someone else's problems like they did with 40k and Warhammer Fantasy.

But what do I honestly think about future releases? I'm sceptical. Even before Disney, FFG kept this game pretty tightly in the original trilogy. It was always about the Rebellion Era, with FFG never showing any sign of interest in any expansion. So I'm not sure that they would grow the line to include the new movies, Rebels, the prequels, or any other timeframe. Pure speculation, but it always seemed to be their intention to make just this.

Now, that doesn't mean they can't continue to expand the line with adventures, settings books for planets (like the Corellian book), or other splatbooks. I also think that we are looking at a five year license, given the haste in the release cycle and the limited scope. If more comes of it via an extension, great. If not, the line ends on a high note.

i think that it's going to take more than 5 years to get all this out. we've only just gotten the second core book today, only two career books for the first core, and a major whetting of the appetite for more. i do believe that now that only one core book remains to be published that we might start to see more supplemental titles being released. i just have enjoyed what FFG has published thus far that i really hope that they keep the license alive and fresh, continuing to expand upon it years after the final core book has released.

My objection, as someone who had to spend a lot of time studying themes and thematic structures for his degree, is that "politics" and "the bad guys" are not themes. Themes are things like "self-identity" and "family." Thus, a core book built around politics would be very weak; it's better relegated to a source book, which we'll probably get for the Diplomat.

I'm absolutely in line with awayputurwpn's (man, you need a nickname, that is too hard to write out) theme observation, as so far the two core books follow a few distinct themes. Here's my take:

• Edge of the Empire: Concerned largely with independence and the myriad complications independence brings to the table. Namely, the cost of trying to be free of the Empire (or any other controlling agency) and whether anyone can truly be free of those things. The Obligation mechanic feeds into this directly, as well as bringing up another theme of whether or not a person can escape her own past, and how much her past deeds define who she is today.
  
• Age of Rebellion: The main focus here is on heroes, what it takes to be a hero, and what you sacrifice to become one. It works with Edge because it asks a question about costs: material costs, moral costs, the cost to one's soul. The book outright mentions that a very real way to deepen the experience for players is to bring the death and destruction, the sense of loss, to the fore. Make the players walk through a city after the battle is over and see the suffering they brought, even if they were ostensibly fighting to liberate it. Again, the Duty mechanic is designed around this as a singular objective for your character, the mark by which they'll measure their success or failure, and ultimately whether or not the war is worth it.
  
• Force and Destiny: It's hard for me to speculate, given the dearth of information about the final core book, but I imagine the main theme of this book will be -- surprise, surprise -- destiny. Do we define our own destinies, and if not, what can we do to avoid or embrace it? Corruption might also be important, specifically about the corrupting power of absolutes. After all, during the Clone Wars, the Jedi showed signs of being corrupted -- they were dogmatic and inflexible in the face of a real threat, and too overcome by the notion that they were the defenders of the Republic to step back and consider whether they should have been fighting or not. My guess is there will be a Destiny mechanic that acts as the goal of your character, and every step you take toward or away from it will be measured.

Hell, if that's too long of a read, just consider this: the theme of each book is its core mechanic. Obligation, Duty, and (presumably) Destiny. The questions of who your character is, where he's going, and how he intends to get there.

I'd eat my hat if FFG wasn't aware of this, and I'll double my portion if they think they'll need more than the three core books to accomplish this. If they wanted to release more core books of the same quality, then they'd need to come up with a fourth/fifth/sixth/ad nauseam theme that fits with the above. Thematic dissonance is the reason the old White Wolf games failed, and it's why it's so awkward to play Deathwatch with Rogue Trader. (Though in the case of the latter, the different companies having different influence levels with each product could easily explain the dissonance.)

This is why source books would be the way to go after all three core books are released. Source books only expand on existing themes, they don't introduce new ones. An Imperial and/or Sith source book would just take those themes listed above and explore them from the darker side, the failure of duty and destiny, or else the question of whether evil is an inevitability or a choice. Era-based source books could provide valuable and tantalizing details about your favorite timeframe of the universe and just transport these themes -- which are fairly universal -- into the Old Republic or the Legacy timeline.

Final note: I could be completely wrong, and FFG decides to crank out a few dozen more core rulebooks. My first assumption is that I'll be disappointed by the outcome, but who knows? Maybe I'll be thrilled. Probably not, because core books are so much more expensive than source books, but hey. I've been pleased with their work so far.

That was incredibly well-written and summed it up pretty perfectly. Well done!

That was incredibly well-written and summed it up pretty perfectly. Well done!

Thanks. I figured most people would just groan and say, "He's pulled out the bullet points again!"

Thanks. I figured most people would just groan and say, "He's pulled out the bullet points again!"

Better bullet points then a wall of (poorly formatted) text. Besides, they exist for a reason and you used them well.

CaptainRaspberry brings up an interesting speculation: will it be Destiny or maybe just the Force as the plot mechanic for F&D? I can't quite wrap my head around what it'd be like to track ones destiny or earn "points" for it unless it was tied specifically to the Destiny Points mechanic, but I wonder if FFG is considering something akin to what BioWare did by creating a Force spectrum -- showing whether your character is more light side than dark?

I wouldn't be a complete fan of them just throwing in a spectrum for the Force without further mechanics working upon that, but wonder what others thoughts on this would be?

Leaving the falling to the Dark side to the story-telling, not some arbitrary game mechanic, is my hope.

Aren't the current mechanics tied to storytelling already though? Obligation and Duty only apply if the GM feels it's appropriate anyway. I don't see why a new one in F&D would be viewed or applied any different.

Leaving the falling to the Dark side to the story-telling, not some arbitrary game mechanic, is my hope.

As much as I personally would like for this to be the case, FFG has pretty much advertised in both EotE and AoR core rulebooks in that "full-fledged Jedi and other powerful Force users suffer unique penalties" for calling on the dark side, at least in the form of converting dark side pips to light side pips when rolling to activate a Force power.

And since Force and Destiny is going to the book about "other powerful Force users," there's bound to be some mechanical consideration towards what happens if a PC calls too frequently on the dark side. Star Wars RPGs sadly have a long history of games getting derailed because of arguments over what is and isn't a dark side act, and I doubt the FFG design team turned a blind eye to that history while working on Force and Destiny. I'm hoping it's elegant yet simple method, as much of this system is, but we'll have to wait and see.

And if certain GMs don't like said system (no matter how it turns out) or they trust their players not to act like a bunch of power-crazed murder hobos juiced up on Red Bull and PCP cocktails, then they can certainly ignore said method in favor of however they choose to handle such things.

And if certain GMs don't like said system (no matter how it turns out) or they trust their players not to act like a bunch of power-crazed murder hobos juiced up on Red Bull and PCP cocktails, then they can certainly ignore said method in favor of however they choose to handle such things.

Fair point Donovan. I'm lucky that I have a good bunch of players, and I can talk to them about expectations. For that reason, I prefer to use narrative techniques over heavy-handed mechanical ones. That's one of the things I enjoy most about EoE in fact, that it doesn't try to have 'a rule for everything'.

The EoE approach to using DS points is so simple and elegant, I can't see me not using it in F&D. But yes, I'm interested in what F&D will come up with.

I always felt like Star Wars drew a pretty good line between Light and Dark side. Something was Dark side if you did it for personal gain or in the heat of rage. Something was light side if you did it to help others or rectify wrongs.

Then I started role playing in Star Wars and I found out my fellow human being felt that healing was always good and shooting lightning out of your fingers was inherently evil. I still don't understand this.

Lightning can be used to jump start a heart so doesn't that make it healing? Healing a serial murderer would be bad, right?

This is where the mechanics of light and dark break down. Sophisticated views of good and evil will clash with simplistic visions of morality. I'm not sure any game group is immune to this. I'm not sure that there is a right answer. Some people need those simplistic takes on morality, while others pretend to use nuance to justify execrable behavior.

Sometimes a given action can be both light and dark. In Mass Effect 2 there is a choice between killing a bunch of Geth or rewriting their minds to think like hero wants. I always chose to kill the Geth rather than strip them of free will. To me that is by far the lesser of two evils. Others disagree.

In Mass Effect there was no negative consequence to picking against type (other then the potential loss of points in your chosen philosophy). So long as F&D does this, I think it could work. If doing things against an arbitrary code causes players pain then I think it's destined for failure and broken gaming groups.

I get your point about using lightning for good and healing for bad, though the way I see it, Yoda wasn't exaggerating when he said the Force was for knowledge and defense, never for attack. In order to use the force to hurt someone, you're bending a spiritual energy of life into doing something it's not meant to do. Like a doctor using their skill in medicine to cause harm instead of heal. In other systems, I was generally pretty harsh about making sure that using the Force for attacking always got a dark side point, a dark side point for generally calling on the dark side (like for using something that requires hate to activate), and then possibly add or mitigate one depending on the circumstances.

Also, though I'm sure you weren't being completely serious, I wouldn't rule that you could actually use force lightning to jump start a heart; it's not actually lightning, it's just hate and the desire for your target to suffer made manifest. Which is also why I hope they don't make it a general attack power, because it *ISN'T*, dammit, it's for torture. A powerful force user can just stop someone's heart if they wanted to kill them. (Now, I know in Legacy, Cade *DID* use lightning to jump start someone's heart, but I would rules that as a Heal power calling on the Dark Side).