Fair enough, but you should word it like that and not expect every tom **** and harry to know you meant it exactly like that. I apologize for the misunderstanding on my part.

No harm, no foul. Stress isn't one of those things you think about until you start actually playing with the Phantom, and then suddenly someone re-reads ACD and says "hey wait, you can't take a free cloak action while you're stressed." Then you're dead because you only have two agility and four HP, and you realize that the Phantom is slightly less OP than you were lead to originally believe.

So, yeah. Four stress tokens will probably be insurmountable for anyone short of Tycho, but it's a veritable death sentence for Phantoms.

I'm thinking that all these stress inducer abilities and upgrades is created to counter the Phantom, but unfortunately, the Interceptor (probably the only one that really hate-hate-hate stress) got caught in the crossfire. Poor poor little interceptors, let your younger brother Tie-Defender to take over for you.

Will be tough to activate Tactician against the named Phantoms.

Otherwise good idea though and handy against normal ships.

I'm thinking that all these stress inducer abilities and upgrades is created to counter the Phantom, but unfortunately, the Interceptor (probably the only one that really hate-hate-hate stress) got caught in the crossfire. Poor poor little interceptors, let your younger brother Tie-Defender to take over for you.

I probably stress my interceptors any time they are in enemy arc and don't need to K-turn. PTL evade/focus has saved more dice than worrying about stress. My experience anyways.

Unless you mean stress induced by something else. Then yes I agree ^.^

I'm thinking that all these stress inducer abilities and upgrades is created to counter the Phantom, but unfortunately, the Interceptor (probably the only one that really hate-hate-hate stress) got caught in the crossfire. Poor poor little interceptors, let your younger brother Tie-Defender to take over for you.

I probably stress my interceptors any time they are in enemy arc and don't need to K-turn. PTL evade/focus has saved more dice than worrying about stress. My experience anyways.

Yeah I do too, a bit hard to clear 5 stress in one turn

Speaking of decimator with tactician +Flechette torps+ gunner+failsafe anyone? shoot the Torpedoes and stress/doublestress something in arc, try to reroll any hits you get, then make a primary attack at anything else, don't really need the tactician for that but double stressing is more fun then single stressing right?

Tactician doesn't sound that great. It only works against ships that you attack at range band 2. I like Mara Jade much better, every one in range band 1. Of course you could take both. Then just add fleet officer, so you are stressed too. Everyone is stressed, it will be like my sisters wedding.

Tactician doesn't sound that great. It only works against ships that you attack at range band 2. I like Mara Jade much better, every one in range band 1. Of course you could take both. Then just add fleet officer, so you are stressed too. Everyone is stressed, it will be like my sisters wedding.

EH is almost a must if you're trying to position yourself in a particular range band.

The Rear Admiral, an OGP and a Bounty Hunter together total exactly 100 points. Sounds like fun.

Why yes. Yes it does.

I'm not sure I'd run a two ship build with the Decimator, especially with the inevitable Z-95 swarms it will be facing.

Honestly, if all you're trying to do is duplicate HSF then why bother? IMO it's not going to be as good a list for two reasons:

1) I seriously doubt the Decimator is going to have the Falcon's amazing maneuver dial. One of the biggest reasons why Falcon lists work is the fact that you have the whole range of maneuvers. You can use 1-turns and almost pivot on the spot or slip through tight spaces, or you can go fast and out-run stuff. The Decimator will probably have the speed, but without the tight turning ability (and I really doubt we'll see a 0-agility ship with white 1-turns) it's going to be a lot less flexible.

2) The Decimator doesn't have the defensive upgrades. The extra HP kind of makes up for the loss in defense dice (depending on exactly what is shooting at you), but it doesn't have Chewbacca (crew or pilot), C-3PO, the Falcon title card, etc. Add in the likely reduced maneuverability to avoid fire and you're going to be taking more hits and a lot more crits. So you've got a ship that costs as much as a fully-loaded Falcon, but can't stay on the table as long.

So, forget about trying to make a HSF variant. The better comparison is probably Firespray + swarm lists, where the big ship contributes a lot to the list but isn't as important as the Falcon in HSF.

I'm thinking that all these stress inducer abilities and upgrades is created to counter the Phantom, but unfortunately, the Interceptor (probably the only one that really hate-hate-hate stress) got caught in the crossfire. Poor poor little interceptors, let your younger brother Tie-Defender to take over for you.

Most ships hates stress, its just that one stress token has proven to be little more than a nuisance since all it takes is a green move to get rid of it.

With more stress generators though, the odds of a ship getting double-stressed increases. And where one stress token is a nuisance, two stress tokens means your ship has a whole lot less options available to him next turn.

It's an interesting development. It means not only that actions are going to get more limited, but that the choice in what action to take becomes tougher as well. Any action that generates a stress token on you (including the upcoming Fleet Officer) becomes a more risky move to take.

So, forget about trying to make a HSF variant. The better comparison is probably Firespray + swarm lists, where the big ship contributes a lot to the list but isn't as important as the Falcon in HSF.

Bit too expensive for that. At 46 points stock for its most expensive pilot even the cheaper Decimators are likely going to make up half your list, since you'll want to actually use at least some of those upgrades. It's a centrepiece model.

As for defence, opponents will likely want to avoid range 1 when Mara is on board. Which means they're going to have to do some tricky manoeuvring to stay in range 2. And the there's the unspoiled card that is going to do something to give that evade token to the Decimator.

Stress doesn't cause a phantom not to uncloak, says it right on the rules card. Unless you mean just tossing out 3 crits will cause it to be dead before it decloaks...

...doesn't...not...uncloak.....brain hurt!!!

Am I not, not misunderstanding this, or not?

Stress doesn't cause a phantom not to uncloak, says it right on the rules card. Unless you mean just tossing out 3 crits will cause it to be dead before it decloaks...

...doesn't...not...uncloak.....brain hurt!!!

Am I not, not misunderstanding this, or not?

The stress from a high enough PS pilot would cause the Phantom to be unable to cloak with his Advanced Cloaking Device (ACD) it would also force them to do a green maneuver in order to do an action next turn(severely limiting in and of itself with the Phantom's dial)

The stress from a high enough PS pilot would cause the Phantom to be unable to cloak with his Advanced Cloaking Device (ACD) it would also force them to do a green maneuver in order to do an action next turn(severely limiting in and of itself with the Phantom's dial)

He's just playing around. Invest and I know full well the power and limitations of the Phantom, don't we buddy?

2) The Decimator doesn't have the defensive upgrades. The extra HP kind of makes up for the loss in defense dice (depending on exactly what is shooting at you), but it doesn't have Chewbacca (crew or pilot), C-3PO, the Falcon title card, etc. Add in the likely reduced maneuverability to avoid fire and you're going to be taking more hits and a lot more crits. So you've got a ship that costs as much as a fully-loaded Falcon, but can't stay on the table as long.

1. We don't know what defensive upgrades it does have since very little was spoiled,(we can assume it has at least 1)

2. A lower PS pilot may be defensive like Chewie, we do not know, once again lack of spoilers.

3. I do agree with you I think a miniswarm will be a more likely accompaniment than 2 ships, because PTL interceptors are the only things really comparable to the 2 rookies that the Imperials have (although 2 Lambdas might be doable, but I still think less than Ideal)

I think it will be funny if Interceptors plus basically the evil version of their number one enemy becomes popular.

The decimator is cool, and comes with some awesome upgrades that we know of, but I will always want to have to maneuver my super agile imperials to get a shot, not just fly in circles with a 360 arc.

As for defence, opponents will likely want to avoid range 1 when Mara is on board.

I wouldn't count on it. Remember, the stress only happens if the Decimator is alive at the end of the combat phase, if you kill it with all of those range-1 shots you just wasted those points. And the Decimator's zero agility means that range-1 shots from multiple ships (where you give out enough stress to make it worth it) are going to do severe damage even if they don't kill the Decimator. Are you really willing to trade most of your HP on a 40-50+ point ship to force some enemy ships to take green maneuvers next turn? I don't think this is at all a viable strategy when losing the Decimator early means losing the game.

1. We don't know what defensive upgrades it does have since very little was spoiled,(we can assume it has at least 1)

But we do know that no defensive upgrades exist right now . The only hope the Decimator has is speculation that a completely unknown card might give some kind of defensive benefit.

2. A lower PS pilot may be defensive like Chewie, we do not know, once again lack of spoilers.

Or it might not. We have to discuss what we know now, not wild speculation about what something might be.

As for defence, opponents will likely want to avoid range 1 when Mara is on board.

I wouldn't count on it. Remember, the stress only happens if the Decimator is alive at the end of the combat phase, if you kill it with all of those range-1 shots you just wasted those points. And the Decimator's zero agility means that range-1 shots from multiple ships (where you give out enough stress to make it worth it) are going to do severe damage even if they don't kill the Decimator. Are you really willing to trade most of your HP on a 40-50+ point ship to force some enemy ships to take green maneuvers next turn? I don't think this is at all a viable strategy when losing the Decimator early means losing the game.

1. We don't know what defensive upgrades it does have since very little was spoiled,(we can assume it has at least 1)

But we do know that no defensive upgrades exist right now . The only hope the Decimator has is speculation that a completely unknown card might give some kind of defensive benefit.

2. A lower PS pilot may be defensive like Chewie, we do not know, once again lack of spoilers.

Or it might not. We have to discuss what we know now, not wild speculation about what something might be.

Wow. For once I find myself agreeing with you, iPeregrine

As for defence, opponents will likely want to avoid range 1 when Mara is on board.

I wouldn't count on it. Remember, the stress only happens if the Decimator is alive at the end of the combat phase, if you kill it with all of those range-1 shots you just wasted those points. And the Decimator's zero agility means that range-1 shots from multiple ships (where you give out enough stress to make it worth it) are going to do severe damage even if they don't kill the Decimator. Are you really willing to trade most of your HP on a 40-50+ point ship to force some enemy ships to take green maneuvers next turn? I don't think this is at all a viable strategy when losing the Decimator early means losing the game.

Of course not. Mara is just one detractor, but it's one that can stack with other stress generators to make your opponent think twice.

1. We don't know what defensive upgrades it does have since very little was spoiled,(we can assume it has at least 1)

But we do know that no defensive upgrades exist right now . The only hope the Decimator has is speculation that a completely unknown card might give some kind of defensive benefit.

We know that the set comes with an evade token, which means there's going to be at least one card in the set that lets a Decimator have that token.

Zero agility sounds very intimidating, but ships like the Falcon or Lambda have only one, and they don't drop from the sky in a single combat round by the dozens either.

As for defence, opponents will likely want to avoid range 1 when Mara is on board.

I wouldn't count on it. Remember, the stress only happens if the Decimator is alive at the end of the combat phase, if you kill it with all of those range-1 shots you just wasted those points. And the Decimator's zero agility means that range-1 shots from multiple ships (where you give out enough stress to make it worth it) are going to do severe damage even if they don't kill the Decimator. Are you really willing to trade most of your HP on a 40-50+ point ship to force some enemy ships to take green maneuvers next turn? I don't think this is at all a viable strategy when losing the Decimator early means losing the game.

Of course not. Mara is just one detractor, but it's one that can stack with other stress generators to make your opponent think twice.

1. We don't know what defensive upgrades it does have since very little was spoiled,(we can assume it has at least 1)

But we do know that no defensive upgrades exist right now . The only hope the Decimator has is speculation that a completely unknown card might give some kind of defensive benefit.

We know that the set comes with an evade token, which means there's going to be at least one card in the set that lets a Decimator have that token.Zero agility sounds very intimidating, but ships like the Falcon or Lambda have only one, and they don't drop from the sky in a single combat round by the dozens either.

In truth most squads will take 2-3 rounds to take out the devastator. Even the vaunted howlrunner tie swarm needs perfect rolls and at least two double damage crits to take the devastator in 1 round.

16 hits is a lot, 0 agility or no.

If it can blitz past the oppozing force on the second round of fire it's more than capable of living several rounds under heavy fire, same as the falcon.

Of course not. Mara is just one detractor, but it's one that can stack with other stress generators to make your opponent think twice.

She only gives stress if you don't already have a stress token, so no stacking stress. And if you stack up lots of stress generators you find yourself severely lacking in firepower to actually kill stuff instead of just annoying it.

We know that the set comes with an evade token, which means there's going to be at least one card in the set that lets a Decimator have that token.

We know there's a token, but we have no idea of the ability is any good. Is it a cheap title card like the Falcon? Is it a situational crew upgrade that doesn't consistently give you evade tokens? Is it one of the unique pilots? Until we see all of the cards it's just wishful thinking to assume that the evade token can compete with options like C-3PO or the Falcon title.

Zero agility sounds very intimidating, but ships like the Falcon or Lambda have only one, and they don't drop from the sky in a single combat round by the dozens either.

No, it's a huge drop in durability. The base stats don't look so bad, but you have to remember that most Falcons are taking Chewbacca (crew) or C-3PO and so they really have 15+ HP instead of 13. Add in Chewbacca (either version) potentially turning multiple-damage crits into one damage and a Falcon can easily have the raw HP of a Decimator with an agility die adding occasional evades. It makes the biggest difference against a swarm, if both ships get shot at six times in a turn the Falcon can expect to dodge two hits while the Decimator takes all of them.

Of course not. Mara is just one detractor, but it's one that can stack with other stress generators to make your opponent think twice.

She only gives stress if you don't already have a stress token, so no stacking stress. And if you stack up lots of stress generators you find yourself severely lacking in firepower to actually kill stuff instead of just annoying it.

We know that the set comes with an evade token, which means there's going to be at least one card in the set that lets a Decimator have that token.

We know there's a token, but we have no idea of the ability is any good. Is it a cheap title card like the Falcon? Is it a situational crew upgrade that doesn't consistently give you evade tokens? Is it one of the unique pilots? Until we see all of the cards it's just wishful thinking to assume that the evade token can compete with options like C-3PO or the Falcon title.

Zero agility sounds very intimidating, but ships like the Falcon or Lambda have only one, and they don't drop from the sky in a single combat round by the dozens either.

No, it's a huge drop in durability. The base stats don't look so bad, but you have to remember that most Falcons are taking Chewbacca (crew) or C-3PO and so they really have 15+ HP instead of 13. Add in Chewbacca (either version) potentially turning multiple-damage crits into one damage and a Falcon can easily have the raw HP of a Decimator with an agility die adding occasional evades. It makes the biggest difference against a swarm, if both ships get shot at six times in a turn the Falcon can expect to dodge two hits while the Decimator takes all of them.

As for defence, opponents will likely want to avoid range 1 when Mara is on board.

I wouldn't count on it. Remember, the stress only happens if the Decimator is alive at the end of the combat phase, if you kill it with all of those range-1 shots you just wasted those points. And the Decimator's zero agility means that range-1 shots from multiple ships (where you give out enough stress to make it worth it) are going to do severe damage even if they don't kill the Decimator. Are you really willing to trade most of your HP on a 40-50+ point ship to force some enemy ships to take green maneuvers next turn? I don't think this is at all a viable strategy when losing the Decimator early means losing the game.

1. We don't know what defensive upgrades it does have since very little was spoiled,(we can assume it has at least 1)

But we do know that no defensive upgrades exist right now . The only hope the Decimator has is speculation that a completely unknown card might give some kind of defensive benefit.

2. A lower PS pilot may be defensive like Chewie, we do not know, once again lack of spoilers.

Or it might not. We have to discuss what we know now, not wild speculation about what something might be.

Wow. For once I find myself agreeing with you, iPeregrine

While Yes we can't base anything on stuff we don't know is in there, we also can't completely write it off just because haven't been told if it is there or not. Bottom line is I am saying we can't make ANY assumptions either way on defensive upgrades when majority of the expansion has yet to be spoiled including 2 crew(has potential), a Mod (has potential) and a Title (has potential), and this isn't counting any Outrider cards either.

Basing a build on stuff that we don't know if it exists is bad, so is writing it off because of a lack of knowledge of stuff that may exist.

Of course not. Mara is just one detractor, but it's one that can stack with other stress generators to make your opponent think twice.

She only gives stress if you don't already have a stress token, so no stacking stress. And if you stack up lots of stress generators you find yourself severely lacking in firepower to actually kill stuff instead of just annoying it.

Blar, I forgot that Mara doesn't stack. Still, it's a deterrent. At range 1, maneuvering options are already limited as it is. A stress token further reduces your options.

We know that the set comes with an evade token, which means there's going to be at least one card in the set that lets a Decimator have that token.

We know there's a token, but we have no idea of the ability is any good. Is it a cheap title card like the Falcon? Is it a situational crew upgrade that doesn't consistently give you evade tokens? Is it one of the unique pilots? Until we see all of the cards it's just wishful thinking to assume that the evade token can compete with options like C-3PO or the Falcon title.

Granted, but the chance of having an evade token is roughly equal to having one agility.

No, it's a huge drop in durability. The base stats don't look so bad, but you have to remember that most Falcons are taking Chewbacca (crew) or C-3PO and so they really have 15+ HP instead of 13. Add in Chewbacca (either version) potentially turning multiple-damage crits into one damage and a Falcon can easily have the raw HP of a Decimator with an agility die adding occasional evades. It makes the biggest difference against a swarm, if both ships get shot at six times in a turn the Falcon can expect to dodge two hits while the Decimator takes all of them.

You've excused the Falcon. The Lambda does not have nifty Chewie's and 3PO's though, and that ship doesn't exactly die in one round all that often either.

I think the major threat to the Decimator will be stacking up crits on it and making it useless through crit fatigue. Using one or two Black Squadron pilot's with Draw their Fire will add to it's durability. As would using Determination in the EPT slot.

Crits are becoming easier to get now (the new E-Wing pilot springs to mind) and the Decimator will be very vulnerable to them with 12 hull.