Having only one faction available for a game mode makes judging its success premature. I hear a lot of people not picking up the CR90 because of a lack of Imperial equivalent.

Having only one faction available for a game mode makes judging its success premature. I hear a lot of people not picking up the CR90 because of a lack of Imperial equivalent.

At the moment, despite having the big ships, the Rebels are at a disadvantage really. A "standard" CR-90 build costs around 110-120 points.

That's a LOT of Academy TIES.

Until the Imperials get a nice big, shiny *cough*expensive*cough* plaything of their own to field, the Epic Play format is imbalanced (the missions are quite good,though).

You take a trio of defenders with HLC they'll mince a cr-90 section pretty fast, same goes for a swarm that things meant to fight other cap ships not fighters.

That's why I think Imps should get the Lancer. If both sides have big ships that get overpowered by fighters than no-one will use either. But if you make the Imp huge ship deadly to fighters the Rebs will take the CR90 to counter it.

That's why I think Imps should get the Lancer. If both sides have big ships that get overpowered by fighters than no-one will use either. But if you make the Imp huge ship deadly to fighters the Rebs will take the CR90 to counter it.

^ I second this, this is super important. I have a CR90 and would not bring it to any epic tournament, instead I would just pile up on TIE Fighters /w Howlrunner and Defenders+HLC /w Jonus.

This resembles an arms race, but it's out of order. If we received an efficient fighter-killer first, then Epic would have been dominated by that ship. Instead we receive its counter first. At least that's what I believe/hope.

If the Rebel CR90 had been so good at killing fighters, then we'd have the problem that no one would want to bring Empire to the table. You need both kinds of ships all at once. It's really quite baffling that they didn't just release one Rebel and one Empire ship, at the least. Only thing I can think of is that they were waiting to see if the CR90/Transport had any major design problems and holding off on the Empire ships allows them time to work out appropriate fixes.

FFG have really dropped the ball with the lack of EPIC ships for XWing

That's why I think Imps should get the Lancer. If both sides have big ships that get overpowered by fighters than no-one will use either. But if you make the Imp huge ship deadly to fighters the Rebs will take the CR90 to counter it.

^ I second this, this is super important. I have a CR90 and would not bring it to any epic tournament, instead I would just pile up on TIE Fighters /w Howlrunner and Defenders+HLC /w Jonus.

This resembles an arms race, but it's out of order. If we received an efficient fighter-killer first, then Epic would have been dominated by that ship. Instead we receive its counter first. At least that's what I believe/hope.

Your thinking is flawed in one regard.

Epic ships you can only get a certain number on the table at a given time, they can never be like most wargames. Most games (at best) you have a rock paper scissors setup with units that excel in particular areas and others that are weak in the same area and the idea should be to get your Rocks on their scissors and avoid their Paper.

The squad building meta is centred around that and we have all seen the meta change on a lot of different games.

in Epic format you are still only going to see 1 CR90 sized ship and possibly a support EPIC and they have it about right I think.

The CR90 is a good anti capital ship (or the decimator) with some anti fighter in way of the turret on top that is flexible in how you build it other wise you are playing rock paper scissors before the game wondering if your opponent actually brings an anti capital shop or anti fighter. If the CR90 is an out and out capital killer for example when would an imperial player ever want to bring an anti fighter capital (if that's what they release plus a support) just to get mauled by the CR90, when he could just bring fighters and sit and watch a capital killer trying to hit fighters.

Even if their were 10 capital choices for each side only being able to bring one would bring you to the same question Rock, Paper, Scissors and the winner would be decided randomly based on what people bring to the game and a totally lob sided meta.

Capitals need to be multipurpose customisable beasts least of all for the cost of them, most of all for the state of this part of the game

Concerning the price.

I have only played with my CR-90 once but use it most games or the transport for scenary

it look EPICO

I have to disagree with a lot of the stereo type of the 'vette. Just as with any squad build some ships are better at certain things and if you take them you cover their weakness with your other ships that excel in those other areas. See also recent turn zero article. Only the vettes main gun and single turbos are your anti cap. But in all the games we've played with it, which for epic is quite a few, the swarm is usually pretty bloody by the time it gets to the fat lady. I mean let's be real if your playing a '90 you bright at least two assault missiles. If anything I expect to see the imperial huge ships drive home the idea that these fatties are highly customizable multirole command centers. I seriously anticipate a new anti cap hard point gun and a new point defense hard point gun. Off hand guess is dual turbo laser cannons and auto blaster turrets or some such. All interchangeable with the corvettes hear of course.

I'm guessing their rationale was as follows:

The GR-75 and the CR-90 were small capital ships that were seen in the movies, whereas the Empire didn't have anything that small portrayed. We can put these out there and see if people will buy them up or not, and then think about further developing epic-style play.

If people buy the Rebel huges, then they'll have a sunk-cost rationale for also picking up Imperial when the time comes for them to produce them. They already bought into epic, so might as well just go the further ~$150 for the imperials. (Or your friends bought the rebel huges, and now they're pressuring you - the guy who plays imperial - to pony up and get an imperial huge to play epic too, even if the imperial huge is not as familiar.)

I'm not really seeing how a Howlrunner swarm would do well in epic when 3 Assault Missiles firing at PS 8 is only 66 points. I'm sure I could come up with more ways to get other Z-95s TL + Focus for Assualt missile goodness as well. Oh and through in Roark for PS12... and then swap VI for Swarm on Blount... and replace generic Z-95's with Green Squadron Pilots with Swarm too... D'oh. I don't really see the Rebels needing the CR90 to do anything, I haven't played epic yet but when I do I'm already leaning more toward he GR75 than CR90. I'd spend everything else on AOE or long range hard target destruction.

Yeah I'm guessing Epic, like Apocalypse in another game, is a totally different beast from normal play and not something that would pan out well competitively.

Edit: Before I lost interest I came up with 6 Assault at launching at PS 12 with Focus + Target Lock (or auto hit for Blount) for 283 points. Hardly pratical but that can potentially outright remove a swarm of Defenders... yeah I wouldn't bring Howlrunner into an Epic game or Biggs either. Better to have high health and spread out I'd think (and bring a little AoE to deal with formations).

Edit 2: NVM with Greens w/ Swarm tactics + PtL, I got it up to 10 PS 12 Assault missiles (all TL + Focus except Blount and Cracken) at 299pts... RETARDED.

I bet the Imp Hugies are on boss mans desk right now... but we ain't going to see them until FFG is **** good and ready for us to see them.

If the CR90 is an out and out capital killer for example when would an imperial player ever want to bring an anti fighter capital (if that's what they release plus a support) just to get mauled by the CR90, when he could just bring fighters and sit and watch a capital killer trying to hit fighters.

Currently my epic group passes on the cr90 the same reason as you suggest Imps would pass on a Lancer . It rarely earns back enough points to justify taking it. That's why I think it should be a counter to the Imperial epic. If you have two modular huge ships that are never as effective as swarms of fighters no-one will take either.

Also I'm not suggesting taking cards from the cr90. You could still kit it for anti fighter. You just pay extra for a primary weapon meant for anti capital ships.

I bet the Imp Hugies are on boss mans desk right now... but we ain't going to see them until FFG is **** good and ready for us to see them.

I just want to know if it came with the droids he was looking for.

I bet the Imp Hugies are on boss mans desk right now... but we ain't going to see them until FFG is **** good and ready for us to see them.

You mean, he's playing with them right now? Do you think he goes "pew pew" when he rolls the red dice?

Yeah he makes the "PEW!"

I mean wouldn't we, in his position?

Yeah he makes the "PEW!"

I mean wouldn't we, in his position?

I know I do. But it isn't a Star Wars game unless you make the appropriate noises.

I'm not really seeing how a Howlrunner swarm would do well in epic when 3 Assault Missiles firing at PS 8 is only 66 points. I'm sure I could come up with more ways to get other Z-95s TL + Focus for Assualt missile goodness as well. Oh and through in Roark for PS12... and then swap VI for Swarm on Blount... and replace generic Z-95's with Green Squadron Pilots with Swarm too... D'oh. I don't really see the Rebels needing the CR90 to do anything, I haven't played epic yet but when I do I'm already leaning more toward he GR75 than CR90. I'd spend everything else on AOE or long range hard target destruction.

Yeah I'm guessing Epic, like Apocalypse in another game, is a totally different beast from normal play and not something that would pan out well competitively.

Edit: Before I lost interest I came up with 6 Assault at launching at PS 12 with Focus + Target Lock (or auto hit for Blount) for 283 points. Hardly pratical but that can potentially outright remove a swarm of Defenders... yeah I wouldn't bring Howlrunner into an Epic game or Biggs either. Better to have high health and spread out I'd think (and bring a little AoE to deal with formations).

Edit 2: NVM with Greens w/ Swarm tactics + PtL, I got it up to 10 PS 12 Assault missiles (all TL + Focus except Blount and Cracken) at 299pts... RETARDED.

Your whole castle comes crumbling down unless you somehow have Ptl + Swarm + Deadeye

Assault missiles are far from an auto-win even without Kagi on the table. Between unreliable shooting (are you also going to put munitions failure?), you opponent's placement (when he sees AM do you think he will keep using his formation?), point blank vulnerability..

What I'm saying still stands. I'd rather take Howlrunner and Jonus then a CR90 at this point. If I see enough missiles on the other side, I will adjust my strategy (of course) to minimize possible damage from Assault Missiles. CR90 players will *not* be able to minimize damage coming from ~20 ships performing primary attack or other attacks that don't need a TL.

In other words, Paper still covers Rock, while Rock smashes Scissors... even in Epic Play.

In other words, Paper still covers Rock, while Rock smashes Scissors... even in Epic Play.

X Wing has a weakness in that it's very meta sensitive due to the relatively small model count. Other games you can be more generalist but XWing you need to be very meta sensitive. This is probably a design choice as it means you need to buy all the packs to get all the cards to be competitive.

Epic is more so (unless they are generalist) basically since you only get one CR90 size ship you have to pick you Rock/Paper or Scissors before the match you can't bring one of each effectively.

We don't know what FFG will do we will have to wait and see but the longer we wait the more epic is going to the dogs as a format.

We don't know what FFG will do we will have to wait and see but the longer we wait the more epic is going to the dogs as a format.

It's not "going to the dogs", it's just not seeing as much play. All it will take is a spoiler or hint of some sort (any sort!) from FFG, and interest will surge.

Don't forget, the second we get a reveal about Imperial Huge ships will be the second the prices for the CR-90 and GR-75 start rising again...

We don't know what FFG will do we will have to wait and see but the longer we wait the more epic is going to the dogs as a format.

It's not "going to the dogs", it's just not seeing as much play. All it will take is a spoiler or hint of some sort (any sort!) from FFG, and interest will surge.

Don't forget, the second we get a reveal about Imperial Huge ships will be the second the prices for the CR-90 and GR-75 start rising again...

Maybe the instant we see a Customs Frigate/Vigil + Gozanti release....