Think of it as inspiring FFG to release new content!

Yes. and writers, even. Sometimes they ghost through and even troll the forums.

I only troll you Baron.

BYE

THe problem I always have with this is the moment I do use house rules, FFG pushes out official ones. Though I still think mine for the tanks of the IG are superior to what FFG wrote.

Now who's trolling.

BYE

So, FFG has created the Rak'Gol, Stryxis, Yu'Vath, Egarians, and the Slaugth right? Those are pretty cool, distinctive xenos. They fit in easily in almost any game and they blend well with the rest of the 40K universe.

I guess most of us want big empires as big enemies to deal with. Xenos empires should be flourishing the Expanse, dozens and dozens of them, ready for exploitation and extermination. Even another handful of big threats, not their ruined remnants, would be cool to face.

It's nothing we can't homebrew, and you guys probably have drawn up a lot of xenos over the years for your own games. If the approval process with GW is long and difficult, then that's understandable. I like the xenos threats we do have. I just want to commit xenocide repeatedly is all.

I want small empires. With social structures, rites, culture elements, military structure/power, geography, etc. Stuff to breathe life to xenos races. And this is not created on the fly if it is be convincing instead of cheap cliche.

Alex

Fun fact: Most xenos that are mentioned in 40k canon hate humanity for being jerks and attacking them for no reason.

Fun fact: Most xenos that are mentioned in 40k canon hate humanity for being jerks and attacking them for no reason.

Heretic!! Repent thy sins by reporting to the nearest Arbite Precinct-Fortress for immediate execution! Praise the Emperor!

Thought for the day: An open mind is the tool of damnation.

Now who's trolling.

BYE

And I quote you: "This is not a tank simulator'.

I know the second I roll out a PDF of 'Only War: Realistic Armored Combat' they'll have you pump out the official version 'Armored Fist: An Only War supplement!' that will turn out to be a series of hilariously grimdark tables to roll on and have nothing to do with how tanks and other armor (or Newtons Laws of Motion) actually work.

Creating fully flourishing Xenos Empires sounds cool.

As for the idea of small PDFs for playable Xenos, what other existing races do people think would make good subjects, Stryxis, Sslyth (forgot how to spell them) perhaps? Other Auxiliary races from the Tau Empire (although I guess these would not be well represented in the Koronus Expanse.......)?

Maybe bring back creatures long abandoned by lore (the last survivors of the Zoat hiding out in the Koronus Expanse)?

I'd be fine with Zoat, and could also imagine playing one of those crazy butterfly people, but if the Stryxis become playable, you'd have to explain their motivations, and those motivations would doubtless be crap. Though I don't care much for playable xenos myself - even portraying a member of the Imperium is too much for most role players I know. Get back to me when you can play a convincing missionary, and we'll see about alien races.

I don't know if it counts, but in my last campaign, these guys (properly 40k-ified) had a flourishing empire in the Expanse:

http://static2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20121010140129/paperpedia/it/images/a/a1/Evroniani.jpg

Psy-draining, mutations, genetic experiments, oh my!

Though as my players experienced, beating a multi-system alien empire with just your little fleet of ships is hard. Not that you'll have a shortage of willing allies.

Fun fact: Most xenos that are mentioned in 40k canon hate humanity for being jerks and attacking them for no reason.

Heretic!! Repent thy sins by reporting to the nearest Arbite Precinct-Fortress for immediate execution! Praise the Emperor!

I'm afraid it will be hard to find one of those within the Screaming Vortex, where I currently reside. Also, I don't have enough slaves in my cargo bays to make it through to the Imperium, I'd burn through them before i made it half way through. Sorry. :<

What if they would put a new Warp Gate linking to a Greater Good controlled sector?

With Human, Kroot and Vespid worlds allied with Tau. It could focus on secession and on picturing the Imperium as "the real enemy". Could support turncoat RTs (seceding from the Imperium), smugglers and also Militant ones greatly.

or....

They could make a "final" Yu'Vath & Rak Gol supplement, maybe even a 3 part adventure (like Warpstorm Trilogy) - focused on a Rak Gol & Yu Vath invasion of the Koronus Expanse (maybe in the midst of a Waagh!! coming from Undred Teef).

Now who's trolling.

BYE

And I quote you: "This is not a tank simulator'.

I know the second I roll out a PDF of 'Only War: Realistic Armored Combat' they'll have you pump out the official version 'Armored Fist: An Only War supplement!' that will turn out to be a series of hilariously grimdark tables to roll on and have nothing to do with how tanks and other armor (or Newtons Laws of Motion) actually work.

Okay, I'm intrigued. What are the key features of your set of tank rules? Hit locations, I assume? Because "Hull Down" position would be probably the most important component missing in tank warfare in 40K Roleplay.

Alex

Okay, I'm intrigued. What are the key features of your set of tank rules? Hit locations, I assume? Because "Hull Down" position would be probably the most important component missing in tank warfare in 40K Roleplay.

Alex

Location of hit, armor thickness and angle, angle of impact, location of crew positions inside the vehicle, relative motion of the vehicle and target.

Then we get into things like number of rounds that a given hull holds in it's ammo racks (not to be confused with magazines as are represented in weapons stat lines), variant munitions, turret transverse speeds, ammo rack location, mines, losing a track/wheel, spall liners, Schürzen and improvised armor, going hull down (as you mention), mine launchers, and realistic vehicle critical hits.

They could make a "final" Yu'Vath & Rak Gol supplement, maybe even a 3 part adventure (like Warpstorm Trilogy) - focused on a Rak Gol & Yu Vath invasion of the Koronus Expanse

I'd buy that!

Okay, I'm intrigued. What are the key features of your set of tank rules? Hit locations, I assume? Because "Hull Down" position would be probably the most important component missing in tank warfare in 40K Roleplay.

Alex

Location of hit, armor thickness and angle, angle of impact, location of crew positions inside the vehicle, relative motion of the vehicle and target.

Then we get into things like number of rounds that a given hull holds in it's ammo racks (not to be confused with magazines as are represented in weapons stat lines), variant munitions, turret transverse speeds, ammo rack location, mines, losing a track/wheel, spall liners, Schürzen and improvised armor, going hull down (as you mention), mine launchers, and realistic vehicle critical hits.

Armour angle and angle of impact might be overkill for games on the abstraction level of 40K Roleplay. Hit location does matter, in particular top and bottom armour are required. It would have been very easy to add that to the game. I think FFG should add times put more effort into adding granularity (see my inquiry to you about Small Craft rules in the other thread), instead of creating a d10 version of 40K or BFG.

Reload times also matter a lot, obviously. I like your idea, it sounds like Combat Mission gone 40K but, tbh, it seems a bit too much. The games aren't entirely simulationist and realistic rules probably ask too much from your average gamer. What I would have liked was a middle ground approach somewhere between what we have got in 40K RP (d10 40k rules) and what you have created there.

For me, it would have been enough if realistic tank warfare tactics would be required to be effective within the game mechanics. To give players a basic feel for what armoured warfare in the 41st millenium is really all about.

Alex

Looking at bare minimum/middle ground areas, these are required:

hit locations (turrets in particular gall me because turret side and rear armor tend to be so much thinner) hits to hatches and sponsons (since, again, thinner), and engine and ammo rack locations. Top and bottom armor values I agree with. The demolisher in particular is noted to have thicker than normal top and bottom armor (testing against it's side armor values as opposed to rear)

The number of rounds an ammo rack holds for a given weapon (this information has been released by Forgeworld at various points for all Leman Russ Variants).

rules for spalling on a non penetrating hit.

A sensible critical hit table not cribbed from 40k 2nd and 3rd ed critical hit cards.

Yep, agreed. I would like to add this:

Damaging main gun or tracks much easier than punching through hull armour. Much more important than hatches. The history of the Ferdinand should serve as an example.

Accurate damage rules for using SS Heavy Weapons on any target with a certain size. (Having Titans in mind.) This should represent aiming for weak spots. (Btw, I think SS Heavy Weapons should be Inaccurate for targets up to human-size. Lascannons Snipers are a tad bit too much.)

Simple visibility rules, depending on position in vehicle.

Some vehicle actions similar to Voidship combat in RT.

Slow Turret vehicle quality.

It doesn't need to be a lesson in Advanced Armoured Warfare. If the novice players understand that they ideally seek hull down position whenever possible and that an advancing tank is best accompanied by friendly infantry to keep melta at bay, that should do for most battles.

Specific scenarios can later handle added rules such as for soft ground, etc.

Alex

The discussion of tanks, being both entirely unrelated to the topic of this thread and worthy of more detailed discussion, should really be moved somewhere else...

The problem is, not many of the 'new' races belong as PCs, either. Slaugth I'll give a maybe (especially if the players end up signed on to the Syndicate), the others are just no.

I'm all for more Rak'Gol/Yu'Vath Shennanigans, though. We 'know' they're after Yu'Vath relics but it'd be cool to see an ultimate goal. The Rak'Gol finding an operational Yu'Vath base or capital ship (like the ones in the adventures we've seen to date) would be scaryawesome.

In fact, you could tie all three together as a sort-of-sequel to Dark Frontier...

• Adventure intro - somehow the PCs get dragged into working with/for the Syndicate, either on a one-off basis (helping them as a cold-trade go-between) or because they or one of their allies owes them money.
• The syndicate wants to exploit the prizes to be had in the derelic Yu'Vath facility where the psycharus worm took the players.
• The Rak'Gol attack (having skirmished with the players and located this facility)
• The players find out who they're working for and are caught acting as the footsoldiers for one xenos race, fighting a second xenos race, in the derelict military facility of a third xenos race - which has just been reactivated and cut off any escape into the warp until this mess is sorted out....

I just want neat aliens like the ones that think the entire galaxy is a giant opera and battlefields are like verses. Additional xeno PCs seems like such a wasted amount of creativity.

The problem is, not many of the 'new' races belong as PCs, either.

Again, this proceeds from the misconception that the tiny number of aliens we have seen so far are the only aliens in the galaxy, when in fact there are supposed to be innumerable 'minor' xeno races in the 40Kverse; hence FFG can create all the new Koronus-native xenos they want, including ones designed specifically to be used as PCs in RT .

I've started converting aliens from Aliens Unlimited and Aliens Unlimited Galaxy Guide from Palladium Books, and Ultimate Alien Anthology from Star Wars. Yea, I know. I'm a heretic at heart.