Unique cheap titles x1-x7.

+1

Unique cheap titles x1-x7.

But most of those weren't "TIE Advanced". The x1 and x2, but the x3 was more of a testbed for the Interceptor, the x7 was a Defender prototype, and I've never seen anything canon about x4-x6.

Plus seven different titles would be a lot of design and playtesting work--I don't think there are that many new upgrades in any non-Epic release.

Unique cheap titles x1-x7.

+1

Definitely this. They could make each one have a different effect to really allow you to customise to fit with other options.

How about giving it the one thing that imperials never get, a droid slot.

Another possibility would be giving it a backstabber like ability to increase its offense when it "comes from behind".

Truthfully, Vader makes most upgrades too powerful so I am willing to bet most will be underwhelmed with whatever they do to it.

It may take a mod that has more than one effect. The advanced is a cool ship worthy of better than what is now so I hope they do something to make it worthy of competitive play.

R2 D2 isn't rebel only. I get that Vader owned him at one point. But no.

The best fix to the advanced is to give it a title that adds something free or reduces the cost. Even then, it'll be a tough sell for most. It's a 2 attack ship. It costs a lot. And for all kt's bad stats increasing any of them puts it in another ships wheelhouse. Unless they increase its stats and add something new it'll trump the Defender. It still might. The best bet is to add a cannon slot. 28 points for a PS2 4/3/3/2 ship is actually good. But then you'll never ever see defender with a Cannon because the Advanced is better in every way.

It's a hard sell.

I like the idea of giving it a cannon slot. I would be happy with a 2 point modification to give it a cannon.

Modification, Tie-Advanced only

The ship gains the cannon upgrade. 2 points.

Then add a Medium laser cannon. Range 2-3, attack 3, and worth 4 points. Special ability could be something like, any un-modified crit cannot be canceled by evade dice (meaning any crit originally rolled cannot be canceled buy green dice). It would give Maarek ability a nice boost. It would really only be viable on the Advanced due to being 3 attack. But it would put your PS 2 Tempest pilot at 27 points with 3/3/3/2.

Its right in-line with the Defender. You sacrafice a shield and a crappier dial to pick the Tempest pilot for 3 less points. You could go with a HLC cannon, and be the same points as a PS 1 defender, but you only have 3 attack dice at range 1 compared with 4 for the Defender.

The x-titles is a very good idea. Each with a unique trait.

Each one could give it a unique upgrade set.

I like the idea of the shield regen for one.

Maybe an upgrade that changes all white moves to green, and red moves to white.

One with a cannon slot.

One with a bomb slot and a boost option.

One a mini ion reactor that can be used to ion all ships at range 1 as an action or discard if that is too good.

One with a cloaking device slot.

One with system upgrade and an EPT.

Things like that. Not saying that these should be them, just spitballing

How about a Vaderesque option.

Experimental Reactor. Modification. Tie Advanced only, before you make a Primary weapon attack you may sacrifice 1 shield token to boost your primary attack value by 1, if the attack hits you regen your shield at the end of the Combat Phase

This would cost 1-2 pts (to balance out the higher base cost of the Advanced) and while not as suicidal as Vader (Crew) it is a bit risky and could reflect the "prototype" nature of the craft While it would make Vader(pilot) better would you really want to risk sacrificing a shield on your 30+point ship every turn? It doesn't necessarily help Maarek a whole lot but Marksmanship is more viable on him now with 3 Dice

At this point, the Advanced just needs something to give it a clear role within the Imperial fleet. The Fighter is cheaper space fighter, has a better dial and allows more offense for the cost. The Bomber is a cheaper missile platform with fairly equal survivability. The Interceptor has more offense and is better at a Space Superiority role. The only thing the Advanced offers is shields and a built-in target lock action.

How about this:

Advanced Refund: Owner of this card may return to FFG one TIE Advanced model and pilot cards to receive one free Interceptor, Defender, Bomber, or Phantom Expansion. Giggling optional.

Unique cheap titles x1-x7.

But most of those weren't "TIE Advanced". The x1 and x2, but the x3 was more of a testbed for the Interceptor, the x7 was a Defender prototype, and I've never seen anything canon about x4-x6.

Plus seven different titles would be a lot of design and playtesting work--I don't think there are that many new upgrades in any non-Epic release.

On one of the threads where we already discussed this I had x2-7 and one called "Vader's personal Ship" or something for x1. Someone with more time and a little search fu should dig em up.

I think 7 titles is a bit much but the "idea" of all the advanced being prototypes is good. Being that each title would be unique and that it s for the "worst" ship in the game should make doing them loosely easier. I also suggest an "Imperial War Machine" box with these, imperial only crew and mods, a few new imperial pilots for most ships, and the Prisoner or Captive subtype for bounty hunters (Firespray upgrades!). Should help boost the Imps till they get around to huge ships.

The advanced could get a straight rerolling. It needs to be the imperial's answer to the Ywing. Cheap front line tank. The advanced aces pack could come with all 4 new pilot cards redone to meet current point values. Same pilots with same skills but about 5 points cheaper, also 4 new pilots with point costs reflecting the value changes. New upgrades along the lines of the X series mods that have been proposed,and a new missile or two. I think I could go along with that.

The bomber is the other imperial platform that could use a tweak. Not as profound of problems as the advanced but there needs to be some better options pilot wise,and the munitions could use some work option wise. I personally would love a special pilot skill dive bomber that could drop bombs in front or behind. Wouldn't need to be a high PS or anything. Another one I was thinking about would be can get stress to increase secondary weapons attack value by 1.

It needs to fill a leadership role. Give it a generic with ept, named pilots with leadership abilities. Limit them so that they don't affect whole squads or it has to much synergy with howl + swarm.

Or:

Master Computer System

Advanced only unique modification

Action: Choose two ships with Slave Computer system or Slave Targeting Computer. They may each take an action on your action bar.

Slave Computer System

Modification

Slave Targeting Computer

Modification

When you fire a secondary weapon at a target that the ship with Master Computer System has a target lock on, you may ignore any requirement to spend your target lock.

Point cost appropriately, obviously Slave TC more expensive than Slave CS. Or some other effect that depends on which ships are slaved. Let's you lead bomber alpha strikes, or small three ship squads, and makes the defensive abilities matter.

Edit: Imperial leadership skills have a much more top-down feel rather than teamwork like rebels passing to whomever they want. Make it feel like control. Subordinate ships are controlled rather than helped.

A "Battle of Yavin" pack that helps the TIE Advanced and Y-wing would be nice.

(Name TBD)

Modification (TIE Advanced only)

Cost: -1/0*

This ship may equip a Fire Control System at no cost.

* Cost: 0 for Vader, -1 for all others.

(Name TBD)

Turret Slot (Y-wing only)

Cost: -1 (maybe -2)

This ship gains the Bomb slot and 1 Crew slot.

I'm still not 100% sold on what should be done to give the Y-wing some love. It almost always uses the turret slot, so anything to promote non-ion Y-wings would be good. You need an upgrade that consumes the Turret Slot (like A-wing Refit uses the missile slot) to accomplish this. It may or may not line up with the canon lore.

Also, Horton should have an EPT, but I doubt they will change that.

(Name TBD)

Turret Slot (Y-wing only)

Cost: -1 (maybe -2)

This ship gains the Bomb slot and 1 Crew slot.

This somehow costs negative points in your mind???

For TIE Bombers: how about a PS5 generic bomber (possibly with an EPT) at 20 points. It would place the cost nicely between Jonus (PS6) and the Gamma Sqd. (PS4). At PS5 it would move after a whole lot of ships that are currently very popular and if you said no to initiative you could also move after other PS5 ships - thereby making it easier to get early TL on your enemies. If it was possible to add VI to these ships you could even compete with PS7 ships. I believe that could bring the Bomber back into the field.

Edit: combined with a Bomber-only modification that said torps/missiles -1 point cost they could really see some use (abuse?)

(Name TBD)

Turret Slot (Y-wing only)

Cost: -1 (maybe -2)

This ship gains the Bomb slot and 1 Crew slot.

This somehow costs negative points in your mind???

Why not? If you take away the turret slot, then the ship is essentially worthless. How many Y-wings do you see competitively that don't use the Turret Slot? Go check the Regionals and Store Championship threads. It is exceedingly low: Dutch once, and Golds in 2 different 5-ship swarms. After wave 4 and Rebel Aces come out, Y-wings as filler in Rebel swarms should see exactly ZERO play, being completely replaced by two much more cost effective filler ships.

If the Y-wing was 2 points cheaper then it's jousting efficiency would be very good, basically the same as a naked TIE fighter, meaning marginally better than a B-wing or Refit A-wing.

If it was 1 point cheaper than its jousting efficiency would be about equal to or a hair worse than the X-wing. So make it a point cheaper (17 points @ PS2), and flavor it with a crew and bomb slot. Sure, you can pile on 7 points of bombs / crew, but would that be any better than any other 24 point rebel ship? The Y-wing dial is really terrible, so you would probably be looking at another +1 for an R2 to get green banks, let alone green turns.

For TIE Bombers: how about a PS5 generic bomber (possibly with an EPT) at 20 points. It would place the cost nicely between Jonus (PS6) and the Gamma Sqd. (PS4). At PS5 it would move after a whole lot of ships that are currently very popular and if you said no to initiative you could also move after other PS5 ships - thereby making it easier to get early TL on your enemies. If it was possible to add VI to these ships you could even compete with PS7 ships. I believe that could bring the Bomber back into the field.

Edit: combined with a Bomber-only modification that said torps/missiles -1 point cost they could really see some use (abuse?)

I would be all for a 19 point PS5 Bomber with an EPT provided it had some valid background material, but game mechanically the TIE Bomber really needs this fix:

Modification (TIE Bomber only)

Cost: 0

All Missiles and Torpedoes have their cost reduced by 1, to a minimum of 0.

This would make missiles and torpedoes useful on the Bombers. Since Bombers are fundamentally not useful UNLESS you put Missiles / Torpedoes / Bombs on them (otherwise just get TIE Fighters), I think this would be a good way to buff their usefulness while still keeping the paper/rock/scissors dynamic. Given that missile carrying bombers are essentially non existent in the meta, I'm not too worried about this breaking their balance.

Edit: pay 1 point, get +1 PS and an EPT. At PS5 you either get an EPT or a named ability. There is plenty of precedent for giving +1PS and an EPT for 1 point for generic pilots. The EPT is really needed on Bombers to either get a better PS for TL, or PtL to TL + F.

(Name TBD)

Turret Slot (Y-wing only)

Cost: -1 (maybe -2)

This ship gains the Bomb slot and 1 Crew slot.

This somehow costs negative points in your mind???

Well it does cost your Turret the reason 90% of people play Y-wings

Modification (TIE Bomber only)

Cost: 0

All Missiles and Torpedoes have their cost reduced by 1, to a minimum of 0.

This would make missiles and torpedoes useful on the Bombers. Since Bombers are fundamentally not useful UNLESS you put Missiles / Torpedoes / Bombs on them (otherwise just get TIE Fighters), I think this would be a good way to buff their usefulness while still keeping the paper/rock/scissors dynamic. Given that missile carrying bombers are essentially non existent in the meta, I'm not too worried about this breaking their balance.

Or How about a modification instead of cheapening the Missiles/Torps rather let you fire them 2x for the same price? Before people get worked u I am NOT talking about a Cluster missile type attack I am talking about, you fire proton torpedoes (for example) in round 2 and again in round 3 then you discard the card call it "Expanded Ordnance Bay" Modification slot Y-wing/Tie Bombers only (Y-wings for being "Bombers" sure don't use torpedoes a lot either) for 1 point.

Edit: Text wording could read instead of discarding a Missile/Torpedo card when you perform an attack you may discard this card instead of the Missile/Torpedo. You may equip one EOB(it would be written out on the card) per missile/torpedo equipped no other modifications can be taken

So for an extra point you can fire a Missile/Torpedo a second time (If FFG got ambitious maybe apply it to Bombs as well and maybe add a Y-wing only Astromech that adds a bomb slot)

Or How about a modification instead of cheapening the Missiles/Torps rather let you fire them 2x for the same price? Before people get worked u I am NOT talking about a Cluster missile type attack I am talking about, you fire proton torpedoes (for example) in round 2 and again in round 3 then you discard the card call it "Expanded Ordnance Bay" Modification slot Y-wing/Tie Bombers only (Y-wings for being "Bombers" sure don't use torpedoes a lot either) for 1 point.

Edit: Text wording could read instead of discarding a Missile/Torpedo card when you perform an attack you may discard this card instead of the Missile/Torpedo. You may equip one EOB(it would be written out on the card) per missile/torpedo equipped no other modifications can be taken

So for an extra point you can fire a Missile/Torpedo a second time (If FFG got ambitious maybe apply it to Bombs as well and maybe add a Y-wing only Astromech that adds a bomb slot)

That sounds like a significantly more powerful version of Munitions Failsafe: rather than getting to fire the missile a 2nd time if you miss, your suggestion would simply let you fire every missile a second time no matter what. You essentially just cut the cost of missiles in half, which is probably too drastic.

Note: I intentionally suggested my tweak as a Modification so it can't be stacked with Munitions Failsafe.

(Name TBD)

Turret Slot (Y-wing only)

Cost: -1 (maybe -2)

This ship gains the Bomb slot and 1 Crew slot.

This somehow costs negative points in your mind???

Well it does cost your Turret the reason 90% of people play Y-wings

Think about the interactions, though.

You have the following potential upgrade slots on the Y-Wing with your proposed upgrade.

Crew -=- Bomb -=- Astromech -=- Modification -=- Torpedo -=- Torpedo

And the generic pilots cost 16 and 18.

This is functionally identical to taking the two Missile slots away from a Bomber and giving it a Crew and an Astromech slot for the favor (while removing 1 agility die and 1 hull for 3 shields as well).

Crew + Bomb is already available on the massively expensive Firespray-31. However, some of these combos could be fielded up to 5 times with your cost-reduced Y-Wings (Int. Agent + Seismic Charges actually leaves you 5 points to spare this way).

Crew + Astromech is... incredibly broken. R5 Astromech annihilates the drawback to R2-Dcrew's drawback, for instance, as does Nien Nunb for R3-A2. R7-TI + Tactician on "Dutch" is just... no.

Even sticking with the generics of both cause problems: Weapons Engineer + R7 Astro, anyone?

Astromech + Bomb is fairly innocuous, assuming such an expansion doesn't introduce Thermal Detonators to the mix too. Still, Regeneration droids make Bomb-chucking substantially less risky.

Now, if you liked the Crew + Bomb section, you'll LOVE the fact that you can swap 1 Astromech for an EPT!

You have the full upgrade suite of the Firespray-31 now, sans the Cannons, but you can do it for half-price!

I would be all for a 19 point PS5 Bomber with an EPT provided it had some valid background material, but game mechanically the TIE Bomber really needs this fix:

Modification (TIE Bomber only)

Cost: 0

All Missiles and Torpedoes have their cost reduced by 1, to a minimum of 0.

I'd say reduce the cost by 2 to a minimum of 1. Some of the ordnance out there is hilariously expensive for an unreliable one-shot weapon, and a 2-point cost reduction around the board would let the bombers actually use the numerous slots they have.

Thank god none of you are designers.

I'm sorry, reducing ordnance by 2 is insane. For 4 pts, the Bomber becomes THE ultimate control piece. Hell, thanks to the Ion Pulse Missile and the Flechette Torpedoes (and likely the Proton Rockets) reducing the cost of missiles/torpedoes is a really bad idea. It doesn't change the situation at all, because the cheap stuff only gets cheaper, and the more expensive stuff is still more expensive. And as usual, the TIE Advanced fixes just makes me shake my head.

Modification (TIE Bomber only)

Cost: 0

All Missiles and Torpedoes have their cost reduced by 1, to a minimum of 0.

This would make missiles and torpedoes useful on the Bombers. Since Bombers are fundamentally not useful UNLESS you put Missiles / Torpedoes / Bombs on them (otherwise just get TIE Fighters), I think this would be a good way to buff their usefulness while still keeping the paper/rock/scissors dynamic. Given that missile carrying bombers are essentially non existent in the meta, I'm not too worried about this breaking their balance.

Or How about a modification instead of cheapening the Missiles/Torps rather let you fire them 2x for the same price? Before people get worked u I am NOT talking about a Cluster missile type attack I am talking about, you fire proton torpedoes (for example) in round 2 and again in round 3 then you discard the card call it "Expanded Ordnance Bay" Modification slot Y-wing/Tie Bombers only (Y-wings for being "Bombers" sure don't use torpedoes a lot either) for 1 point.

Edit: Text wording could read instead of discarding a Missile/Torpedo card when you perform an attack you may discard this card instead of the Missile/Torpedo. You may equip one EOB(it would be written out on the card) per missile/torpedo equipped no other modifications can be taken

So for an extra point you can fire a Missile/Torpedo a second time (If FFG got ambitious maybe apply it to Bombs as well and maybe add a Y-wing only Astromech that adds a bomb slot)

Well theoretically the munitions failsafe would let you fire the missiles infinitely as long as you keep missing, mine would have the hard cap of 2 tmes

Also the version I suggested would be a modification and not stack with Failsafe also, you could just equip more than one of them

Thank god none of you are designers.

I'm sorry, reducing ordnance by 2 is insane. For 4 pts, the Bomber becomes THE ultimate control piece. Hell, thanks to the Ion Pulse Missile and the Flechette Torpedoes (and likely the Proton Rockets) reducing the cost of missiles/torpedoes is a really bad idea. It doesn't change the situation at all, because the cheap stuff only gets cheaper, and the more expensive stuff is still more expensive. And as usual, the TIE Advanced fixes just makes me shake my head.

And the bomber becoming the ultimate control piece (debatable, by the way, given that the double tactician + ion cannon shuttle is a thing now) is bad, how?

I would be all for a 19 point PS5 Bomber with an EPT provided it had some valid background material, but game mechanically the TIE Bomber really needs this fix:

Modification (TIE Bomber only)

Cost: 0

All Missiles and Torpedoes have their cost reduced by 1, to a minimum of 0.

I'd say reduce the cost by 2 to a minimum of 1. Some of the ordnance out there is hilariously expensive for an unreliable one-shot weapon, and a 2-point cost reduction around the board would let the bombers actually use the numerous slots they have.

I look at this, and I look at Major Rhymer with 2x Adv. Proton Torpedoes, and I still think he's overcosted

Screw it. Reduce the cost of all Missiles and Torpedoes by 4, to a minimum of 2.