Same thread whining about the cost of miniature wargaming, different day.

Sigh.

If you bother to read my previous posts I am not whining about the cost at all, I am questioning the content.

Can I request you read a thread properly before making unhelpful comments, or better still, read the thread properly and make helpful comments.

Klutz post above is an excellent one. It shows FFG are obviously aware of concerns like the one I raised in my OP and are addressing them as far as they can, within the scope of their need to ensure business success of course.

I am a happier camper☺

It sounds more like your real issue is the need to buy multiple expansions, possibly of ships you don't want, just to get particular upgrade cards (a legitimate, if unavoidable complaint BTW) rather than the fact that each expansion comes with 25 cents worth of redundant cardboard.

I do not think Op is whinning over price ; just the content...Opening up a diff ship and finding same cards along with a new one...The way FFG is doing it now is probably on the pretense of the stand alone add on to the core set...I have no complaints that would deem a change , to what they are doing now...Keep the juggernaught rolling and bring on the Dogs of war

Ok, question the content, but I'm happy with what we get, and for the price... Meh.

As its been said other miniature games costs a small fortune, and requires a lot more time, effort, and dedication. Plus I don't need a huge area to play on. My kitchen table works great.

To anyone who feels this is expensive, then may I suggest try playing warhammer. Or you could just not buy the pieces.

I like how the is no upgrade packs without ships.

If there is one card you want but don't want to buy the ship, then look at eBay, or kijiji, or whatever local markets are near you

In response to Forgottenlore, TBH I am so new to the game I don't really know what upgrade cards are out there so I can't really agree with your assessment there but.... your comment about a couple of cents for some pieces of card made a lot of sense and to be honest in that light my OP is probably a bit of a whinge.

Same thread whining about the cost of miniature wargaming, different day.

Sigh.

If you bother to read my previous posts I am not whining about the cost at all, I am questioning the content.

Can I request you read a thread properly before making unhelpful comments, or better still, read the thread properly and make helpful comments.

Oh I read it. This game is cheap as hell compared to every other miniatures game I own and you'd like to be able to purchase everything ala carte. That's great, so the company will sell lots of Bwings and individual Advanced Sensors cards - try making a profit on that after a few weeks.

The way FFG is doing this is VASTLY preferable to random blister packs (Magic) or $50 army books or $85 rulebooks that get replaced after two years (GW, PP). Don't give them any crazy ideas.

I have spent thousands of dollars on 40k over 20 years of playing it. I have spent hundreds on xwing in just 2. X-wing IS the best miniatures game on the market right now when you take all the factors in. You get the most bang for your buck by far over any other game. GW is a dinosaur waiting to die. FFG created a monster game in a small box, tight rules, customization, popular theme, great minis, great customer support, very affordable(the core set was on shelves at TARGET) terrific play value etc. There is always ebay for buying parts out of nearly any game. FFG has this line down cold, lets just enjoy it while it lasts.

Ditto...but my 40K was ten years, and I have spent over $1,000 on glorious wonderful beloved bad assed X-WING.

i rather they make a booster of just cards so I can get some of the upgrades that come with ships I am not really interested in buying

$15 for random boosters or $15 for a ship with that card?

There are a few things I would like to see for X-Wing that would be nice to haves. I am sure all of these have already been said a number of times.

Posts. I would like to see 10 pack or 20 pack posts for sale. I haven't lost of broken one yet, but having spares would be good. I know you can write them for replacements, I know I have extras from the ships I am not running, but still it would be nice.

Acrylic templates and tokens that are not third party or just for winners of tourneys. Yes, I can get them 3rd party, but they are not officially sanctioned. Yes I will probably order from Cog'o'Two in the very near future. However, it would be nice to procure what FFG has shown they are capable of producing. My comment isn't meant to cheapen other's achievements at winning the special goodies, just a wish that they were available for purchase.

As for the cards, I can fully agree with what people are saying. FFG has pioneered the living card game, so applying that to X-Wing would be a very nice addition. All the upgrade cards in one set from each wave as a purchase option. I think that would be something people would buy based on what I read in this thread. I think it would be fair for them to offer that yet leave the pilots as ship only.

Lastly on my nice to have wish list, all the missions in PDF format. I like to use my ipad for all the rules content, and I would love to see FFG publish the missions in PDF as well. I have at least one of everything, and as they introduce more missions, it would be nice to see it collected and posted.

Posts. I would like to see 10 pack or 20 pack posts for sale. I haven't lost of broken one yet, but having spares would be good. I know you can write them for replacements, I know I have extras from the ships I am not running, but still it would be nice.

Yes! I want some so I can glue them into a box somehow and use that to store my minis!

Acrylic templates and tokens that are not third party or just for winners of tourneys. Yes, I can get them 3rd party, but they are not officially sanctioned. Yes I will probably order from Cog'o'Two in the very near future. However, it would be nice to procure what FFG has shown they are capable of producing. My comment isn't meant to cheapen other's achievements at winning the special goodies, just a wish that they were available for purchase.

The third-party templates are officially accepted in FFG events. I must admit that I'd be more likely to buy templates if FFG made them.

As for the cards, I can fully agree with what people are saying. FFG has pioneered the living card game, so applying that to X-Wing would be a very nice addition. All the upgrade cards in one set from each wave as a purchase option. I think that would be something people would buy based on what I read in this thread. I think it would be fair for them to offer that yet leave the pilots as ship only.

FFG has applied the LCG model to X-Wing. That's why you don't get random cards with your minis. You know exactly what's going to be in the box. Even in their LCG's like Netrunner, if you want all the cards you need to buy all the packs. You can't just get the 3-4 most useful cards from all previous packs in a box.

Lastly on my nice to have wish list, all the missions in PDF format. I like to use my ipad for all the rules content, and I would love to see FFG publish the missions in PDF as well. I have at least one of everything, and as they introduce more missions, it would be nice to see it collected and posted.

Yes. This would also be great. I hope they some day make either a PDF or even an actual book with all the missions compiled in it, and a way to link them together into a large campaign. I know many people are working on campaign systems but a lot of the stuff people come out with is too convoluted for me, with pilots "leveling up" and what not.

Card packs would be welcome and I wouldn't mind paying £5 for a decent sized set of cards.

But I do like you know what's in the pack, a heroclix style booster would put me off too often you get unwanted duplicates.

My imps are pretty much where I want them and I am tempted to start a rebel force, not a big force just a few x-wings or something.

Don't even talk about random boosters.

That would be the death of this game.

$15 for random boosters or $15 for a ship with that card?

Random boosters isn't really an option here. It goes against FFG's mentality.

However the issue isn't $15 for a ship with card X, it's the $120 for 4 copies of Advanced Sensors so you can run a 4 B-Wing list in a tournament.

Sure they're coming out with the E-Wing. I also don't think they quite expected the AdvSen to so popular, and yes it helps them sell Shuttles. But $120 for 4 ships you may not even want, so you can field a list with upgrades you want isn't an option for many people.

However the issue isn't $15 for a ship with card X, it's the $120 for 4 copies of Advanced Sensors so you can run a 4 B-Wing list in a tournament.

Sure they're coming out with the E-Wing. I also don't think they quite expected the AdvSen to so popular, and yes it helps them sell Shuttles. But $120 for 4 ships you may not even want, so you can field a list with upgrades you want isn't an option for many people.

Then run a different list !

4x B-Wings + Advanced Sensors is one of the most expensive lists to run.

You'd need: Core set + 4x B-Wing + 4x Lambda = ~200$ MSRP

I'm not sure you could actually think of a more expensive competitive list, without purposefully selecting upgrades to require purchases...

I always have fun building lists with what I have available, and try to learn to fly what I have before buying more stuff.

Limitations drive creativity, no? ;-)

Or go with my method and borrow some stuff. I ran 4x Blue w/ Adv Sensors a couple of weeks ago even though I only had 2 B-Wings and 2 Adv Sensors. It is unfortunate the the B-Wings don't come with Adv Sensors though... at least the E-Wings do which would bring down the cost required to play the squad without borrowing to Core + B-Wing x4 + E-Wing x4 (MSRP ~$160).

I'm not sure you could actually think of a more expensive competitive list, without purposefully selecting upgrades to require purchases...

That's the whole point behind using it as an example. It's the most expensive list to run, because it required 4 shuttles, a ship that many people don't want 4 of, for the sake of 1 upgrade card.

I don't have a better system in mind, other then them releasing cards with other expansions, which they are doing. I'm just saying that the system they use creates situations like the one above.

$15 for random boosters or $15 for a ship with that card?

Random boosters isn't really an option here. It goes against FFG's mentality.However the issue isn't $15 for a ship with card X, it's the $120 for 4 copies of Advanced Sensors so you can run a 4 B-Wing list in a tournament.Sure they're coming out with the E-Wing. I also don't think they quite expected the AdvSen to so popular, and yes it helps them sell Shuttles. But $120 for 4 ships you may not even want, so you can field a list with upgrades you want isn't an option for many people.

This is how they're selling so many shuttles, it's part of the business model and profitability of this game for FFG. I have zero problem with the current business model, it's not like the FFG staff are eating caviar from platinum spoons in their company Ferraris with massive profit margin they're making.

If you can't afford to buy 4 advanced sensors either from shuttles or people selling them on the secondary market then run a different list. There's tons of Warhammer lists I'd like to run but I'm not blowing $1,000 and painting 9 tanks to play it in a tournament.

For the record, having read all the responses in this thread and now having a better understanding of how FFG are releasing upgrades in more than one ship, I withdraw my original post criticism.

I'm not sure you could actually think of a more expensive competitive list, without purposefully selecting upgrades to require purchases...

That's the whole point behind using it as an example. It's the most expensive list to run, because it required 4 shuttles, a ship that many people don't want 4 of, for the sake of 1 upgrade card.

I don't have a better system in mind, other then them releasing cards with other expansions, which they are doing. I'm just saying that the system they use creates situations like the one above.

Still cheaper than something like 40k, it's annoying only certain ships have the cards but it seems they have heard the complaint and are doing something about it.

OK, you have the basic game and want to expand your number of x wings. You buy one expansion, get a lovely model and some cool new cards and pilots. You buy another expansion, get another sweet model and,...all the same cards you got last time. As most of the pilots are unique you now have a load of duplicate cards you don't need and can't use. If you want a TIE swarm that's gonna be even worse. It should be possible to buy miniatures without the cards.

Seriously?

OK, you have the basic game and want to expand your number of x wings. You buy one expansion, get a lovely model and some cool new cards and pilots. You buy another expansion, get another sweet model and,...all the same cards you got last time. As most of the pilots are unique you now have a load of duplicate cards you don't need and can't use. If you want a TIE swarm that's gonna be even worse. It should be possible to buy miniatures without the cards.

Seriously?

Read exactly 2 posts above yours.

I think in every case that there is a named pilot there is a non-named pilot on the other side of the cardboard cut-out, so it is multiples of the non-names that are useful. After all, you could also argue that the Core is a 'rip-off' because you are paying for IIRC 8 different TIE cards and cardboards, but you can only ever use 2 at the same time!

So it doesn't really matter that if you buy 3 TIE expansions that you have 2 more howlrunners and 2 more winged gundark and 2 more backstabbers than you could ever use...what you DO have is the ability to fly 1 of each of those on the table at the same time.

The only other way they could have done it is to have 3 separate Tie expansions, one for each named pilot. But then for the person who only buys 1, they get a lot less options for their money. It's not like the price point would move more than a few cents with the removal of a couple pilot cards. In fact the logistics of handling 3 SKUs of Ties vs 1, the issues with 1 pilot selling out faster than the other two, etc. it may be MORE expensive that way.