Not sure if this has come up yet. When dual wielding superior weapons, do they both generate the free advantage, or do they not stack like that?
superior dual wielding advantage
The rules aren't completely clear. The rules say pick one weapon to determine the success of the attack, however, Advantages don't determine success so you could say they do both count. You could also say since one weapon is selected the second's cant' count for that purpose but should be allowed for other Advantage uses like Strain and crits. Probably a pretty good rules question really.
I'd go with only the advangage generated from the first weapon being allowed. Then, if that check generates enough advantage by itself to allow the second weapon to hit, you could get one advantage from that too and use it for something else.
That's one school of thought but allow me the use of the proverbial monkey wrench. Superior is a kind of ambiguous term applied to weapons, and then the idea of an Advantage is fairly abstract. However, with the laser sight attachment it's far more specific and those add an Advantage. Now, realistically it seems to me a laser sight on 2 pistols would be probably not only a good way to insure you can shoot two pistols accurately together, but probably the single best way to do so. So if that way works, should it be the lone way, should Superior count as well if the player can provide a good narrative reason why? Like I said good rules question, but then again they may have left it a touch vague on purpose for everyone to decide at their tables.
One thing I can see from 2P's argument is if you can use both advantages from each Superior pistol, you've already generated the 2 advantage to activate the second shot... but maybe that isn't a problem? We're already talking about 10k credits worth of mods.
Hmm. The guy with a matched pair of extremely well-balanced fighting knives (both are Superior) should have some advantage over the guy wielding just one + a meat cleaver. I'd say yes.
Edited by Col. OrangeI'm really liking everyone's train of thought, here.
Drew, you owe me a few Advantage. ![]()
My position on this is based on the wording in the book on two weapon fighting: you pick the weapon you attack with, to me this means that is the weapon which qualities are applied to the initial check. So I'd only allow 1 auto-advantage even with two superior weapons.
I'd have to think a bit more on the laser sight auto-advantage, but even here I think 1 auto-advantage should be the limit. Particularly since the attachment text reads:
Gain automatic Advantage on successful combat check with this weapon.
You basically aim and attack with one weapon when two weapon fighting, and the attachment text tells me that the bonus can only come from one weapon at a time. The combat check is made for one weapon.
I understand the rules like this: you attack with one weapon, if you produce two advantages on a successful check, you get to apply the damage of the second weapon - any excessive advantages can be used to activate qualities or critical for either weapon as the player chooses. I'd also allow the second auto-advantage to be generated if the initial check produced a total of at least 2 advantages.
While 10k credits is quite a lot, I don't think it should allow two automatic advantages, that would basically mean that as long as you go two weapon fighting and succeed on your check you'll always hit twice and I do not think that is the effect desired by the designers. I also think the Laser sight attachment text limits itself so as not to produce 2 simultaneous auto-advantages.
Edited by JegergryteSo, since my Scoundrel dual wields a pair of H-7's (being superior) with laser sights, some of you think I should be getting 4 free advantage added to my attack roll?!
I've commented before that the 2-weapon rules have a few quirks and glitches that scream to be exploited. Ideally, the way the rules work, you are better off shooting with a high accuracy pistol (like the accurate HL-27 with both superior and laser-sight added) as your primary weapon, while using an inaccurate/high damage weapon (like a DL-7H heavy blaster pistol with maxed out blaster actuating module) in your off hand.
Like I said, good rules question, because absent an official ruling there are good solid justifications for both ways of doings things imo.
So, since my Scoundrel dual wields a pair of H-7's (being superior) with laser sights, some of you think I should be getting 4 free advantage added to my attack roll?!
I've commented before that the 2-weapon rules have a few quirks and glitches that scream to be exploited. Ideally, the way the rules work, you are better off shooting with a high accuracy pistol (like the accurate HL-27 with both superior and laser-sight added) as your primary weapon, while using an inaccurate/high damage weapon (like a DL-7H heavy blaster pistol with maxed out blaster actuating module) in your off hand.
So either way you rule it, there's a benefit to be exploited.
Is one method significantly more effective than the other? Enough to make a GM nervous?
Edited by Col. OrangeAgreed.
Maybe. Yes (IMO).
To address the overall issue in a different manner, we've toyed with a houserule to that end.
Much like you use the worst of either skill/ability when using two weapons, and just as you use the worst of any/all defenses of multiple targets, likewise you use the worst of any beneficial/detrimental mods to your attack.
So in order to benefit from accurate, both weapons would have to be. Same with superior. Same with laser sight. If even one of the pistols has a blaster actuating module, you'd add the requisite setback die to your pool. And so on.
Sure its a little harsher, but it keeps the cheese away, I think.
Superior weapon also adds one to base damage so no matter how you rule it, the second weapon gains some advantage. It's not worth 5K of advantage, but it's something.
I like the idea that you can only gain the second free advantage if you first purchase that second hit. That way you have to actually roll one advantage and can use your free advantage to buy the second hit. Then you have the second free advantage to spend on whatever you want.
To me that seems the most fair compromise and isn't such a big deal at a point in the game where players can afford that kind of weapon stacking. We're already talking about some competent PCs.
I've gone back and forth and at the end of the day given the way Autofire works and in conjunction with Jury Rigged, which has been confirmed by the devs, I don't bother with dual wielding. Seems wrong to screw the Gunslingers and Samurai imo but give the Commandos a pass.
This!
Also I feel it's important to note that 2 free Advantage doesn't necessarily mean automatic 2 net Advantage on every check (though it much more likely): Threat rolled can still outnumber your Advantage.