I thought the rules for barrel rolling and boosting were nice and clear. You declare the roll side, if it doesn't fit, the player may declare the other side or a different action. Same with boosting, declare which template and if it doesn't fit, declare another action. I haven't read anything in the FAQ that says once you've declared a barrel roll to one side, and if it can't be done, you now HAVE to roll to the other. It says you may do that or you may decalre another action. The option is still there. You're only locked into it if the ship can perform it legally.

When it comes to the slippery maneuverability of Echo, I'd be surprised if there wasn't SOMEPLACE he could decloak, but on the absurdly remote chance that there's nowhere legal, then I guess he can't decloak.

The issue is stemming from the bank templates for echo and lorrir. They are asking if you can't decloak/roll to the left with the bank templage facing forward, are you forced to change it to pointing backwards, as your directionnwas left or right.

My position is that deciding which way fhe template will sit is part of determining side (you say left/back for example, and if that doesn't fit, then left/forward is a different direction, but others are disagreeing.

Going right forward to right back is two different directions. They put echo facing in two different directions, therefore they are different.

If someone is trying to say " well if echo can't go right forward, then HE HAS to move right back" (since his first choice was right forward) because you think that is the same direction, should give their head a shake. Sorry, but they are different direction. Forward and back is two direction. Or North east, south east. Again Two different directions.

So again, it's just the same as a barrel roll. If echo had decloaked, and can't the initial direction, then choose something else

So again, it's just the same as a barrel roll. If echo had decloaked, and can't the initial direction, then choose something else

I agree, you shouldn't be forced to pick a different direction at all. When you barrel roll, you can put the template on the front or back of the base, but I've never heard anyone say that if there were room to BR right, but only if you select the back of the base to start and front of the base to end, meaning you end up about a base backwards... That you'd have to do it that way.

Either you can BR or in this case decloak with the side and direction you want, or you chose a different option.

When you barrel roll, you can put the template on the front or back of the base, but I've never heard anyone say that if there were room to BR right, but only if you select the back of the base to start and front of the base to end, meaning you end up about a base backwards... That you'd have to do it that way.Either you can BR or in this case decloak with the side and direction you want, or you chose a different option.

Then, he measures to see if the ship is able to perform a barrel roll action from any legal area on the declared side.

If you want to barrel roll edging ahead and can't, but can if you edge backward, you have to go backward even if you don't end up where you want.

If you want to barrel roll edging ahead and can't, but can if you edge backward, you have to go backward even if you don't end up where you want.

Ok I stand corrected

Another factor here that seems to be overlooked is how strictly the rules are being enforced. The tournament document talks about how the rules might be enforced at higher level events (such as regionals). In casual play (this can incldue tournaments if they are local events etc.) for example, it would be more like this :

There seems to be some confusion amongst some people posting on here:

If you declare an action (boost/barrel roll) you measure to see if you can do it. If you can, you MUST do it. If you cannot, then you are free to choose a different action. You are not forced to do a barrel roll/boost in the other direction.

The same must go for decloak, choose a direction and attempt to do it. If you cannot, you can either not decloak, or decloak in another direction.

but at a higher level event it could be more like:

So if I choose forward - and forward right with Echo and there is an asteroid in the way I must then go forward left if I can?

Another factor here that seems to be overlooked is how strictly the rules are being enforced. The tournament document talks about how the rules might be enforced at higher level events (such as regionals). In casual play (this can incldue tournaments if they are local events etc.) for example, it would be more like this :

There seems to be some confusion amongst some people posting on here:

If you declare an action (boost/barrel roll) you measure to see if you can do it. If you can, you MUST do it. If you cannot, then you are free to choose a different action. You are not forced to do a barrel roll/boost in the other direction.

The same must go for decloak, choose a direction and attempt to do it. If you cannot, you can either not decloak, or decloak in another direction.

but at a higher level event it could be more like:

So if I choose forward - and forward right with Echo and there is an asteroid in the way I must then go forward left if I can?

Even under the strictest competitive rules, if you cannot roll in a given direction you're free to choose another action.

Yes, and forward right is different than backwards right.

Just think North East, South east.

Same side,however it is two different directions. So if you can't do the way forward, your not entitled to go backwards

Yeah, the real question here is whether echo (and Lorrir) have extra directions they can BR, left forward, right forward, left back, right back, or if they are still just doing left or right and have more placement options in those two directions.

I'm fairly confident that it is the former, but we'll see.

Well under the boost rules, if you can't boost forward left, you can choose another template (or swap the bank to the other side), direction or action. I would say Echo and Lorrir can declare rolling forward left, and if they can't, then they can choose something else. They're only committed if they can actually do the declared action legally.

Because Echo and Lorrir are using a bank template for rolling, if they swap it around, that's the same as using another template, and therefore it's a different option. I don't believe that if you declare rolling forward-right and can't do it, that you must go backwards-right, simply because you declared 'something'-right. It just seems wrong within the other mechanics of the game.

The problem I'm seeing is those players that are sticking to the barrel roll rules as the only way to rule on this. The flaw in the logic is that the standard barrel roll uses one template only, and Echo and Lorrir are using a bank which can be placed in four different ways, and that's before sliding it up and down the base's side.

I'm looking forward to my Phantom arriving in NZ soon, and can't wait to play with it and against it, just to see how effective (and fun) this beast is going to be.