I do love to read a thread filled with reasoned friendly and supported argument.

ThreadS. It's even spilled over to another one.

Hey, I am not part of that one! But seeing that Sylpheed/aluminumwolf/Erik B is involved I'll pass...

@knasserII; I hope you'l pardon me as I did have a lot of supported arguments earlier on in the thread but saw them ignored as apparently you can only be strident if you are against Disney and hate what they done to the EU (which you have only read 5% of.)

Of course I shouldn't have gotten so sarcastic but I'm only human...

That seems to be directed at me. How much of the EU did you read? Is there some sort of threshold we need to reach until we are allowed to care, which I wasn't told about?

And ... just a hint, labeling your own posts as "supported" and complaining how they get ignored in spite of your supposed wisdom doesn't really change anything about their content. I think it's safe to assume that everyone here believes what they post; you don't have to specifically point out that you believe your opinion is the right one.

Enough, good grief, how many threads need to be locked by the mods before people get it.

You're right. I'm way too easy to bait.

I apologise for the sidetracking and will refrain from further reactions to such posts.

Just for the record, I do not feel my opinion is worth more than yours. It is like all opinions pretty much unimportant in such matters. The problem I had with your posts was the entitled nerdrage that eventually turned out to be fuelled by absolutely nothing when it turned out that you had no dog in the fight at all and had hardly gotten into the same EU you were protecting so indignantly and made a big stink about the way the owners of the legacy chose to deal with it and stepped over "you the serious long time fans" in doing so.

It pretty much confirmed what I had been saying all the time (and why you refused to answer the majority of my earlier post) that your posts seemed to be angry for angry's sake and that was all a matter of trying to portray yourself as the bigger fan fighting a wrong that in all fairness didn't even touch you.

If being open and honest about what I saw was "baiting" then your whole shtik on these boards here were even beyond that. So don't try to make it out like your the bigger man here because you are not. You made a stink about something just for the heck of it and got what you were after.

In all fairness 2P51 is right, this needs to stop so; after you, Sir!

Just reporting that my Google-fu failed me. I couldn't find a, "can't resist to get the last jab in" meme.

I am really interested in seeing what everybody has to say after Star Wars: Tarkin comes out.

I read this completely wrong the first time. I read it as, "what everybody has to say after Star Wars: Tarkin Comes Out". I thought what the heck, that's gotta be a joke, then re-read your sentence.

Now that would be a good read!

Just reporting that my Google-fu failed me. I couldn't find a, "can't resist to get the last jab in" meme.

Just reporting that my Google-fu failed me. I couldn't find a, "can't resist to get the last jab in" meme.

Will you take this instead?

ok

I hope its just minor changes. It wont be Star Wars without Luke being married to Mara Jade

This is where you and I disagree....

We can all agree that Vader was the end result of a Jedi (Anakin), having a relationship/love. That is exactly what was used against him to force his turn.

So Luke... his dad killed his mom, eradicated and executed the entire Jedi order (the one he so adores and is hoping to re-start), murdered his adopted family, caused him to grow up an orphan on some back-water planet with no contact with his siblings, etc. etc. etc... and he is going to turn around and repeat the actions???? And an assassin for the emperor, no less? He is either so smug that he believed himself better then Anakin (against jedi code), or he has an IQ slightly under that of a common house plant. Either way, the lack of thought and logic that went into that whole story line is only a part of the reasons why the EU for the most part was poop.

Don't get me wrong, there are some gems in there. I liked the Thrawn stuff too... I also liked the stuff that had nothing to do with the "royal family", like rogue and wraith squadron... the comic with the skywalker that was like 5 thousand years in the future and he was a no-good pirate was pretty cool as well. I don't mind the solos having kids, wasn't so keen on one of them becoming a sith lord (again, lack of sight on the bloodline). The tales from the cantina and jabbas palace were pretty cool too, but again, those were background characters.

But Boba, was pretty much a dud. Not sure how he got so "iconic" when he didn't do a darn thing... Heck Bossk was a better bounty hunter then he was in canon. He took Han, AFTER vader captured him. Then he was killed by a blind, disoriented, recently awoken coma patient and an immobile, landlocked octopus. Good grief, that spells AWESOME all over it. He had cool armor, that's all he had, too bad he didn't know how to use it. Maybe if his daddy hadn't been beheaded so early in his life he could have taught him something. I'm so glad that Disney is keeping him dead (the announced movie for him is a pre-jabba octopus ordeal... maybe they can figure out a way to make him cool so his death really was something to care about. That's another screw job for the EU, as he was the one that put an end to some big event there, after teaming up with the new republic.

Then again, the new movies are 30 years in the future, and there isn't a "new republic" in them. The Empire is still around too.

That messes up all the continuity.

I do hope they keep Winter though, she was pretty cool.

In all fairness Boba was the reason Vader knew where Han was going but yeah he's overrated. What did Bossk do in canon besides show up on Executor and play a minor part in a couple of Clone Wars episodes though?

Anakin's failure wasn't because he fell in love, it was because it became an obsession and he was in an Order that didn't prepare him for such things at all. Luke OTOH, grew up in a loving family and had attachments to others (friends) both growing up and as an adult. This was what made him stronger than the old Order Jedi.

In all fairness Boba was the reason Vader knew where Han was going but yeah he's overrated. What did Bossk do in canon besides show up on Executor and play a minor part in a couple of Clone Wars episodes though?

He hissed at the IT guy. In other words nothing.... that's the point.

Anakin's failure wasn't because he fell in love, it was because it became an obsession and he was in an Order that didn't prepare him for such things at all. Luke OTOH, grew up in a loving family and had attachments to others (friends) both growing up and as an adult. This was what made him stronger than the old Order Jedi.

The reason they didn't prepare him is because they knew it was the easiest way to corrupt a Jedi. Thus it was disallowed and no need to prepare someone for something they can't do in the first place. (Kinda the same line of thinking that goes into these school systems that think by teaching abstinence they don't have to teach sex-ed... and we all see how that works out) These dudes didn't make that rule just to have it, it's happened before and someone somewhere learned that lesson.

Obsession or not, it was used against him as the proverbial straw(s). In fact, the more I think about it, love was all his straws because his mother was the reason he went bat-shizzle on the raiders. That's why they said he was too old to train, that's why the take the younglings from the parents at such an early age, in the first place.

The quickest way to make someone lose their shizzle, is to threaten their kids/wife/husband/etc... emotional attachments aren't a good thing for people wielding that much power, especially when said power if fueled by said emotions.

I'm not saying jedi shouldn't be allowed to visit a cat house once and again and work the kinks out... I can completely see that. But to go and tempt fate, finds one on the loosing end, every time.

Anakin's failure wasn't because he fell in love, it was because it became an obsession and he was in an Order that didn't prepare him for such things at all. Luke OTOH, grew up in a loving family and had attachments to others (friends) both growing up and as an adult. This was what made him stronger than the old Order Jedi.

The reason they didn't prepare him is because they knew it was the easiest way to corrupt a Jedi. Thus it was disallowed and no need to prepare someone for something they can't do in the first place. (Kinda the same line of thinking that goes into these school systems that think by teaching abstinence they don't have to teach sex-ed... and we all see how that works out) These dudes didn't make that rule just to have it, it's happened before and someone somewhere learned that lesson.

Obsession or not, it was used against him as the proverbial straw(s). In fact, the more I think about it, love was all his straws because his mother was the reason he went bat-shizzle on the raiders. That's why they said he was too old to train, that's why the take the younglings from the parents at such an early age, in the first place.

The quickest way to make someone lose their shizzle, is to threaten their kids/wife/husband/etc... emotional attachments aren't a good thing for people wielding that much power, especially when said power if fueled by said emotions.

I'm not saying jedi shouldn't be allowed to visit a cat house once and again and work the kinks out... I can completely see that. But to go and tempt fate, finds one on the loosing end, every time.

And yet, in the end, it was Anakin's love - brought out by Luke - that won the day...

I personally think if Anakin hadn't been having to hide his love from the order he wouldn't have fallen. Of course the Order taking a little out of their budget to buy something they could trade Watoo to get his mother freed would have helped too. Hell they didn't even need to let him interact with her after freeing her just set her up with a nice job on Naboo or maybe Alderaan suited to her talents.

The TCW shows at several points how out of touch with the people the Order is. The best examples are in Season 6 with Mace and Jar Jar.

They come of as arrogant, fixated on their traditions and hypocritical.

Sadly the show does not show us the first years of Anakins training, only what happened during EP II and III. It would have been interesting to see what they taught him, and how they feed him the 'Chosen' stuff.

Yeah in Legends Jedi who were members of endangered species were allowed to have mates and childern but I doubt they will ever confirm that in canon. Which IMO is dumb because it assumes that members of endangered species somehow won't fall to the dark side due to it, and proves that Jedi can have such attachments without falling.

Anakin wasn't driven to the Dark Side by love. He was driven by fear.

If not his love for his mom or Padmé, it would have been being passed over for Jedi Master. I mean, come on, Palpatine was pulling his strings and manipulating him from early on. He used Anakin's fear to turn him, in desperation, to the Dark Side.

Fear of loss was too much for him to bear. Fear led to anger, anger led to hate, and hate led to suffering.

BOOM. Yoda'd.

I thought this was a pretty cool idea, that will be a part of my canon:

----------

The real reason Clones are no longer used by episode 4.

Cloning proved to be against the natural law of the universe, one of the most wicked forms of science to be excercised on any sentient being.

After a few years, clones always go insane. Their behaviour eventually becomes unpredictable at first, but always in the end becomes immoral and wicked, like the science to create them.

The clones didnt turn on just the Jedi by order (Order 66), they turned on everybody and a new army - stormtroopers needed to be recruited to eliminate the massive clone army that was randomly attacking ships all across the core worlds.

Order 66 was just a story created by locals to explain the unlimited power the Emperor possesses.

---------

One of my PC's are going to uncover this in a really exciting and personal way...if they survive.

Something I've always wondered about the pre-Clone Wars Jedi Order is what did they do when they found Force sensitive babies whose parents didn't want to hand them over to the Jedi, or cases where one parent wanted to give the baby to the Jedi but the other didn't? That really has some disturbing possibilities if you think about it.

I believe it was (in the EU, anyways) decreed by law that the children are handed over to the Jedi Order. Hence the Jedi sometimes having been called "babysnatchers" by critics.

And whilst that does seem harsh, I imagine it's also pretty dangerous to have a Force-sensitive child grow up without training in a controlled environment. Imagine a kid going through puberty with the ability to choke others to death or throw them through a wall, discovered and triggered by pure accident...

You probably don't have too many serious incidents in the grand scheme of things simply because most Force-sensitives may never learn to actually manifest their powers, but still enough to label it a publicly acknowledged risk where Non-Force-sensitives might feel threatened, in turn creating a fairly unpleasant environment for the child, as well as a public call for "appropriate" legislature to deal with such risks to public safety. Which might be how that law came into being.

It's a tricky situation where you can't really win either way. Regardless of how you decide, the result will be criticised by someone. Jedi stealing babies would be called cruel, Jedi not teaching them would be called reckless.

Honestly IMO given that all or almost all of the dangerous Force abilities require training to use it wouldn't be that reckless to not train them. That sounds more like an excuse to justify what would normally be considered an abominable act than a real threat. Luke and Leia were among the strongest Force Sensitives ever and they manage to make it through puberty without killing or injuring anyone with their abilities. Hell after Leia watched her home planet be destroyed she would have almost certainly Force choked everyone around her, or start using the Force to throw any handy hard and heavy objects if it could actually be done without training.,