So, I just finished playing several games with A-Wings and Rebel Aces proxies, and, unfortunately, it still seems that the A-Wing is a poor choice in a 100pt list.

Here is my results / experience so far.

I ran three separate games.

Game One/Two -

Red Squad X-Wing / R3-A2

Red Squad X-Wing / R3-A2

Green Squad / Test Pilot / Refit / PTL / Wingman / Stealth Device

Green Squad / Test Pilot / Refit / PTL / Wingman / Stealth Device

So the A-Wings (as always) make fantastic fast flankers, especially with PTL to boost and keep an evade or focus.

The Wingman pair is incredibly mobile due to never retaining any stress tokens, also, fairly difficult to anticipate their movements since the dials are never constrained to greens.

However, without barrel roll, they aren't nearly as elusive in the firing arcs as a Squint.

I briefly experimented with Expert Handling on one, but eventually the Wingman becomes less effective because one ship has to clear stress, moving away from the other who was barrel rolling into position.

Focus / Evade / Stealth Device with no stress, however, is a pretty potent combination, with the exception of their attack power.

I found the best use of the A-Wings to be run-and-gun in the backfield of the opponent. Fly through, take a few potshots, and GTFO of dodge. They will hopefully break off a few ships to deal with the A-Wings, in which case, you zip the A's out to help the X-Wings while they reset their ranks.

The major problem however, is still the red dice. All of the survivability and speed is still severely hampered by the fact that range 2-3 shots are essentially shooting pellet guns at armored vehicles.

If you can get legitimately behind them and zing a few dice at range 1, the odds still don't generally fall in your favor fighting Imperials, since all you have really done is turn yourself into a Range 2 X-Wing, which you could have had 4 of, flying in a formation, slinging a cone of 12 raw red dice.

Essentially, if they refuse to mess with your A-Wings and just go full bore after the pair of X-Wings, you have a problem. (AKA - Game Two).

My opponent literally said out loud - "I hope your A-Wings can kill me before I ROFLStomp your Reds and then K-Turn."

Turns out - they could not. I had two turns of the A-Wings behind the TIE Swarm and they managed to kill one straggler in the left rear of his formation before the TIE's caught the X-Wings in the asteroids and summarily obliterated the Reds.

It did take him a long time to finally catch and kill the A's, and I got two more TIE's before it was all said and done, but still. Ignoring the A-Wings entirely was a successful strategy.

2 Red dice is just not a threat to TIE Fighters without some really helpful dice rolls.

Game Three -

Wes / Flechette / Wingman

Wedge / R3-A2 / Predator

Hobbie / R2-D6 / Flechette / PTL

Green Squad / Test Pilot / Refit / PTL / Stealth Device / Outmaneuver

Well, the goal here was to make the X-Wings intimidating, so that they would hopefully ignore the A-Wing. This game was played against a different opponent.

My strategy worked perfectly. After seeing the pilot names and upgrades on the X-Wings, he basically forgot about the A-Wing, which was much to his chagrin later in the game.

I will admit that the X-Wings did a majority of the work in this game, with Hobbie doing his Focus, PTL, Target Lock, drop stress dance, Wedge doing his usual, with Predator making him a freaking monster against academy TIE's.

In this case, the single A-Wing was just flying around like an idiot until the jousting started, at which point he started pulling his weight.

Granted, in this case, he was more of a distraction and random-damage card distributor, but outmaneuver **almost** makes up for the lack of red dice, especially at range 1.

I did manage to one-shot an Academy from behind with my Greenie, due to his rolling all blanks, at which point I was like "DAYUMMMMMMM BOYYYYYY."

I did, however, find myself wishing for that Wingman pair of A-Wings, because their maneuverability is just ridiculous with basically no stress, ever.

So, anyways, I think the A-Wing is still better served as a single ship flanker / squad-breaker-upper, but the upgrades are interesting and at least make them fun again.

R3-A2 is unique.

great write up and appreciate you sharing. There will be tons of more options as more EPT's come out which will no doubt help keep the A-wing relavent. Green squad is the only ship (and still cheap) that can take 2 EPTs. Opens up lots of options...

So, I just finished playing several games with A-Wings and Rebel Aces proxies, and, unfortunately, it still seems that the A-Wing is a poor choice in a 100pt list...

...The major problem however, is still the red dice. All of the survivability and speed is still severely hampered by the fact that range 2-3 shots are essentially shooting pellet guns at armored vehicles

Two issues:

• It's always been true that 2 Attack is a frustrating experience against TIE Fighters, so that's evidence of a bad matchup rather than a problem with A-wings.
• In your first list, you had 16 points of upgrades on a pair of 17-point ships. If I posted a playtest report that said X-wings were ineffective because I played a pair of Rookies with 20 points of upgrades between them, we'd all understand that it's because there's a point of diminishing returns on upgrades; why wouldn't that be true for Green Squadron?

• In your first list, you had 16 points of upgrades on a pair of 17-point ships. If I posted a playtest report that said X-wings were ineffective because I played a pair of Rookies with 20 points of upgrades between them, we'd all understand that it's because there's a point of diminishing returns on upgrades; why wouldn't that be true for Green Squadron?

To extend this a bit further and bring the analogy closer, suppose I run this list:

Omicron Group Pilot (21)

Fire-Control System (2)

Gunner (5)

Tactician (2)

Omicron Group Pilot (21)

Fire-Control System (2)

Gunner (5)

Tactician (2)

Black Squadron Pilot (14)

Predator (3)

Hull Upgrade (3)

Black Squadron Pilot (14)

Predator (3)

Hull Upgrade (3)

And I play it against a TIE swarm, and my opponent focuses entirely on the shuttles and then cleans up Black Squadron as an afterthought. I think about the game later and conclude that TIE Fighters are just not effective in 100-point lists. Does that conclusion follow logically from my experience?

We know TIE Fighters don't have very good offense individually, so we run lots of them together and limit the upgrades in order to keep them efficient. And I think the A-wing, particularly with the Refit, is going to work best if you think about it in the same way.

You may also want to take a look at Predator on the A-Wing if you want to stay the upgraded route. It in effect gives you a free TL so you can freely focus and evade. Its like the Howlrunner buff which makes the firepower 2 of Ties respectable.

We know TIE Fighters don't have very good offense individually, so we run lots of them together and limit the upgrades in order to keep them efficient. And I think the A-wing, particularly with the Refit, is going to work best if you think about it in the same way.

Yeah, I will admit that running a bunch of A-Wings like a TIE Swarm, with the ability to break off and be very hard to kill is appealing.

I considered this list:

Prototype Pilot / Refit x7 (SEVEN!) And you could add another Mod or two to a few of them.

That's a TIE swarm with shields!

EDIT - Hang on, Voidstate is doing weird math - NVM it's only 6 possible.

Or:

Greenie / PTL / Refit x5

Greenie / Refit / Outmaneuver or Wingman x5

I want to try the seven ship Proto squad just for fun.

Also, I know the greens are upgraded heavily, but I do personally believe that without those upgrades, it's pointless to use one. Without a way to modify the dice, they are subpar ships. Feel free to prove me wrong or argue, it's just an opinion.

X-Wings don't require a lot in the way of upgrades to be great ships. Heck, Rookies do well with none at all most of the time.

An un-upgraded A-Wing is like an annoying gnat. Even in my example above - two fully upgraded A-Wings are ignorable gnats. Now, had I strapped Assault Missiles in there, maybe a different story. Also, I did not realize that droid was unique, and did play with both, so I guess I owe someone an apology, lol.

Have you considered Opportunist? It would make them 3 attack ships.

Have you considered Opportunist? It would make them 3 attack ships.

Yeah, but I wonder about the effectiveness as a flanker in terms of the ship having no tokens on it.

That's why I chose Outmaneuver?

Have you considered Opportunist? It would make them 3 attack ships.

Opportunist + Expose for phantomesque attack? Just so many points on a green and loss of an action however.

Green Squadron Pilot + A-Wing Test Pilot + Chardaan Refit + Predator + Opportunist (24)

Green Squadron Pilot + A-Wing Test Pilot + Chardaan Refit + Predator + Opportunist (24)

Green Squadron Pilot + A-Wing Test Pilot + Chardaan Refit + Predator + Opportunist (24)

Green Squadron Pilot + A-Wing Test Pilot + Chardaan Refit + Predator + Opportunist (24)

I'm curious to try something like this. With rerolls and a deadly 4 dice range one attack. This could be a deadly A-Wing.

Green Squadron Pilot + A-Wing Test Pilot + Chardaan Refit + Predator + Opportunist (24)

Green Squadron Pilot + A-Wing Test Pilot + Chardaan Refit + Predator + Opportunist (24)

Green Squadron Pilot + A-Wing Test Pilot + Chardaan Refit + Predator + Opportunist (24)

Green Squadron Pilot + A-Wing Test Pilot + Chardaan Refit + Predator + Opportunist (24)

I'm curious to try something like this. With rerolls and a deadly 4 dice range one attack. This could be a deadly A-Wing.

I want one of these to work so badly, I love the A-Wings thematically as well as I just think they are cool ships.

The 5 Greenie squad I listed above I am going to try tonight. I think though, against swarm pilots, you will have to do some absolutely flawless flying because if you get furballed AT ALL and take concentrated fire, your journey will come to an explosive, tearful halt, lol.

I'm thinking 5 Greenie w/Wingman.

Essentially, you can run and gun and joust if absolutely necessary, but as long as you stay in formation, you never get stress.

Honestly having 2 a's in a squad in my experience has always been bad not saying you can't win with that but just in my games they don't do well. Your second list with xxxa was a lot better however IMO the flachette torpedoes are not very good. I'm my imdaar tourney I faced a guy with xxxx and loaded up every single one with flachettes. While they look intimidating they didn't do much to me, he stressed 2 of my ships twice each and did a total of 3 damage. I ended up winning 100-0. IMO opinion it was a waste of points. I understand the point of stressing your opponent but in my game just didn't work out and other games I saw too.

Honestly having 2 a's in a squad in my experience has always been bad not saying you can't win with that but just in my games they don't do well. Your second list with xxxa was a lot better however IMO the flachette torpedoes are not very good. I'm my imdaar tourney I faced a guy with xxxx and loaded up every single one with flachettes. While they look intimidating they didn't do much to me, he stressed 2 of my ships twice each and did a total of 3 damage. I ended up winning 100-0. IMO opinion it was a waste of points. I understand the point of stressing your opponent but in my game just didn't work out and other games I saw too.

I am in full agreement, despite the fact that I wish so hard it was not true.

Adding the single A for a flanker was MUCH more effective than trying to play "see if you can shoot me" games with a pair of them in the backfield.

You need a solid distraction to keep the A-Wing un-molested.

I used to run 2 PTL Green A's with 2 B's with AS. I can't recall all the times the Greens saved my butt since no one ever went after the A's with the B's on the table. Placed fairly well in tourney's too (2nd mostly).

The one that's currently 19pts (green pilot?) with ept slot, mate tried five of them with push the limit for a laugh, man that was hilarious.

Bit close for a 1 hour game but 75-90 minutes and you'll just run rings round your opponents until you eventually get enough range 1 3 hit shots to win.

I think people are trying to make the A-wing into the rebel version of the interceptor. Its really not its role. It isn't going to be the offensive juggernaught in your list. What its going to do is be ignored and let you slowly chip away at the enemy ships or use it to block them. They are really more like faster, more manueverable Tie/IN than anything else.

So, I just finished playing several games with A-Wings and Rebel Aces proxies, and, unfortunately, it still seems that the A-Wing is a poor choice in a 100pt list.

No, the A-wing is not a poor choice. You're just outfitting it wrong. Excessive upgrades are not worth it, they never have been. You spent 8 points on upgrades, on a ship that costs only 17 points. That's 32% of the point cost of the ship, in upgrades. That would be like spending 11 points in upgrades on a Red Squadron Pilot.

Three Prototype A-wings (45 points) are almost always going to be more effective than two Green Squadron Pilots (46 points in your example). It's just simple math: more ships is better.

2nd point: Most of the useful Rebel Ships to this point are slight glass cannons. A-wings are tanks. So in a mixed group you need to be inventive about finding ways to bait your opponent into shooting at the A-wings and not your X's and B's. Edit: That means NOT using them as flankers. Glass cannons get used as flankers. Tanks get used as blockers at close range. Incidentally Prototype A-wings are PS1 so they fill this roll perfectly. And if one gets down to 1 hull, you can potentially still fly away with it, with that amazing dial + boost, and come back for another round.

Here is a much more competitive list that revolves around having tanky ships, and having lots of them.

Tarn + R7 (25)

5x Prototype Pilot + Refit (75)

It's not sexy, but it should wipe the floor with your list above every time.