What about the Ship you are given in The Old Republic when playing a Sith charachter.

Its easily comparable to the YT in size but has obvious TIE family connections.

SWTOR occurs about 3500 years before Episode IV. You don't want to open that door.

There are even more TIE variants than you think.

http://www.menswearhouse.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/SearchDisplay?searchTerm=ties&categoryId=&storeId=12751&catalogId=12004&langId=-1&pageSize=16&beginIndex=0&sType=SimpleSearch&resultCatEntryType=2&showResultsPage=true&searchSource=Q&pageView=&orderBy=0

Good God No!! Scout is a small freighter which could almost fit "large" being 24m. and that MF is is 34m x 25m

Wookieepedia's length lists lie to you because they're inconsistent. That's the troop transport variant of the TIE bomber next to it. Wookiee claims that's 7.8m.

Don't believe me? Look at the HWK length.

While that artist (or those artists) makes really good-looking drawings (IMO), he (she/they) leaves some room for improvement when it comes to sizes/scales/etc. The 24m is canon as far as I'm concerned, given that those who came up with the ship (West End Games) specified it as being 24m, and to my knowledge that has not been contradicted by the other sources that have included it.

That said, either that cockpit is much larger than the standard TIE's cockpit, or it looks really out of shape, ie. much too long. I prefer the interpretation that it's just a lot larger and should be classified as a 'large' ship.

What about the Ship you are given in The Old Republic when playing a Sith charachter.

Its easily comparable to the YT in size but has obvious TIE family connections.

And is over 3000 years old. I'd stick very large amounts of money on us not seeing that one.

The 24m is canon as far as I'm concerned, given that those who came up with the ship (West End Games) specified it as being 24m, and to my knowledge that has not been contradicted by the other sources that have included it.

Empire at War and the picture posted above contradict 24m.

The ship, assuming it's the West End Games one, is conceptually actually one of Timothy Zahn's creations. West End Games may have statted it, but unless they gave a picture Empire at War gives the image and model of the TIE/sr. It's also possible this is possibly Wookieepedia or even Lucasfilm clumsily combining EaW's TIE/sr (pictured above) with an old sourcebook craft.

X-wing, which uses official scales, clearly tells us that the TIE bomber is not 24m, it's 8m-ish. The TIE boarding craft above is the TIE bomber with the bomb pod replaced with a troop pod. It's the same size as the TIE bomber.

The proportion of the cockpit to the rest of the ship is correct. I cannot find a single reference picture not using those proportions for it.

Figure 2

(For those looking at the Tartan Patrol Cruisers in confusion, EaW's fighters aren't to scale with the capital ships)

The TIE/sr is pictured above in that hanger picture and again here in this EaW screenshot. The two craft are in the correct scale to each other. Look at the cockpits. Were that a 24 metre ship it would be three times the size of the TIE bomber in every dimension. It would fill the entire area of the hanger depicted and have a laughably big TIE cockpit. To put it in perspective, here's what it would look like.

Figure 3

EDIT 1st June: Just to clarify, unlike the hanger picture, this isn't an official picture. I made it to illustrate the silliness of the size disparity.

Still sticking with 24m?

While it took a while to grow on me while i was making it i have learned to like the Phantom and Avenger but some of those are just completely ridiculous with no logic given to the actual tech process (yes, i know, fictional tech but still) TIE Experimental Mk2 and TIE Starcruiser im looking at you

the star cruiser looks like a cross between a TIE and the space winnebago from spaceballs.

for most of the TIEs their main distinguishing feature to the standard TIE seems to be "being ugly and/or useless"

No, you are factoring the overall size, canon has listed the length. Plus, defeats the purpose if they don't continual use the TIE pilot sphere.

That is the whole principal for their design, is that they base it off this, so why would they make that cockpit 3x larger?

That cockpit is about as laughably big as the one on the Firespray.

Lone Scout A - Original Canon

However, its large passenger and cargo compartment made it much larger than those later starfighter designs, stretching it out to a length of 24 meters.

150 tons cargo

TIE/sr Starfighter - "Post Lone Scout A"

25 tons cargo

The Empires at war is later and would be the discrepancy versus initial canon for SW:EU

Lone Scout is 24m in length, light freighter / exploration, but the cockpit is based of universal production of most if not all TIE production.

TIE/sr is the smaller version, which is represent in the picture. It was a starfighter size.

I have most the WEG stuff to reference from

That cockpit is about as laughably big as the one on the Firespray.

However, the Firespray is a ship unto itself, whereas the TIE ball cockpit is a constant across all other TIEs. Why would one TIE cockpit mysteriously be three stories tall?

No, you are factoring the overall size, canon has listed the length. Plus, defeats the purpose if they don't continual use the TIE pilot sphere.

That is the whole principal for their design, is that they base it off this, so why would they make that cockpit 3x larger?

They wouldn't. That's exactly my point. I'm saying the picture of the hanger with the Bomber and Scout next to each other is correct, that the Scout is the same size as the Bomber. The 24m TIE scout would be three times the size of the bomber. My argument is that the TIE scout being that big next to the bomber is just silly. It's a small base 8m ship like the TIE bomber, not the size of the Falcon or Lambda.

No, you are factoring the overall size, canon has listed the length.

I'm scaling up the consistent canonical proportions of the ship (its aspect ratio in every single picture of it I've ever found) to a 24m size to show how silly a 24m size is with the given model.

EDIT:

Lone Scout is 24m in length, light freighter / exploration, but the cockpit is based of universal production of most if not all TIE production.

TIE/sr is the smaller version, which is represent in the picture. It was a starfighter size.

I think I follow. But if you just stretch it out you get this.

Figure 4:

Look back at the hanger picture (figure 1). It would stretch almost to the very end of it, past the back of the Missile Boat at least. Plus that looks like it would maneuver like your average oil tanker. The TIE scout isn't bad far as EU TIEs go, but that giant stick is no recon fighter.

Wookiee's also listing the default TIE/sr as 24m, the one with the unstretched proportions. Wookiee is claiming it's that jumbo TIE in Figure 3. (Backediting all posts to have figure names to make this discussion easier.)

Sorry to say this but if half of these Tie are produced, I'll switch to Rebels, wow, they are ugly and dumb....

Agree with everyone else that we need are large ship, or an "evil" cousin expansion for the Rebel large ships.

I'm not seeing how all Tie's have to have the same ball cockpit to exact specs matters. I mean, the Advanced has a different cockpit. The Defender has a different setup that would need a different manufacturing process, in much the same way the Advanced is different. The Tie Phantom is totally different. The Bomber, which is movie cannon is 100% different.

There's no reason, fluff or otherwise to make every ball cockpit exactly, or nearly the same size.

Im actually more amazed they havent expanded the Universe to include any of the Prequel ships. I mean, theyve included EU so why not Old Republic, Jedi Starfighters, Clone Fighters, Droid Fighters and the like?

Im actually more amazed they havent expanded the Universe to include any of the Prequel ships. I mean, theyve included EU so why not Old Republic, Jedi Starfighters, Clone Fighters, Droid Fighters and the like?

Because the game is about the Rebellion Era. Jedi Starfighters won't happen since there aren't any jedi left around to pilot them. Droid Fighters have gone out of service for the most part. Clone fighters we might see as some of them were still in use at that time period by both sides of the conflict. Naboo N1's are extremely unlikely.

Well id at least like to see...

LAAT Gunship (Would this count as a large ship?)

ARC-170 (X/Y Wing cross but with a rear firing arc)

V-19 (Because the B-Wing needs company)

...as theyre all legitimately possible of still being around somewhere in the Rebellion era.

I agree, we need "a" large imp ship asap. I expect sometime during gencon we will find out more...

On another note, i dug threw all my old star wars decipher cards for anything that could be a possibility. I did see scouts, avengers and vanguards (discounting everything that is already out obviously). Avengers have a heavy cannon upgrade available, not sure if that means anything but hopefully that option will remain consistent if released. Didn't really see any big ship possibilities there (my collection is large, though I am missing cards from a few sets). I just have tons of star destroyers and dreadnaughts.

we have enough TIE's at the moment, we need better imperial support ships

a gunship or missile boat would be cool

a missile boat that can target lock and fire a missile at 2 ships in 1 attack would be kick ass.

i have brought this up in several different threads and here i am again

i would love to see the assault shuttle that drops space troopers like a bomb. then the space trooper is a stationary mini-proton torpedoe turret, range 2 of course.

then later on if the shuttle is within range 1 of the trooper he can pick him back up to redeploy later.

I second the Assault Gunboat idea.

But I like your shuttle idea far more...while i am not certain of the scale that shuttle sounds like a good starting point (it would need to be improved upon so it would be worth it on a HUGE ship) for the Arc Hammer.

I'm not seeing how all Tie's have to have the same ball cockpit to exact specs matters. I mean, the Advanced has a different cockpit. The Defender has a different setup that would need a different manufacturing process, in much the same way the Advanced is different. The Tie Phantom is totally different. The Bomber, which is movie cannon is 100% different.

There's no reason, fluff or otherwise to make every ball cockpit exactly, or nearly the same size.

All the cockpit windows are roughly the same size. They're all ball cockpits for one guy, no TIEs have cockpits big enough to be flown by an AT-ST. No TIEs have a TIE cockpit three times the size of all the others. That's not a cockpit, that's a bridge.

Are you saying JumboTIE as depicted in Fig3 is sensible, or simply trying to make a point about cockpits?

I'm not seeing how all Tie's have to have the same ball cockpit to exact specs matters. I mean, the Advanced has a different cockpit. The Defender has a different setup that would need a different manufacturing process, in much the same way the Advanced is different. The Tie Phantom is totally different. The Bomber, which is movie cannon is 100% different.

There's no reason, fluff or otherwise to make every ball cockpit exactly, or nearly the same size.

All the cockpit windows are roughly the same size. They're all ball cockpits for one guy, no TIEs have cockpits big enough to be flown by an AT-ST. No TIEs have a TIE cockpit three times the size of all the others. That's not a cockpit, that's a bridge.

Are you saying JumboTIE as depicted in Fig3 is sensible, or simply trying to make a point about cockpits?

I think your argument based on the cockpit being different as proof the pic is wrong is... Odd.

I want to go up against a Yt-1300 on this bad boy!!!

I second that, however, it does have 2 turrets, it'll throw some players into fits if the Imperials get turrets...

Lone Scout-A

I'll spare you the huge picture, but essentially it's a TIE Adv w/ 150 ton cargo space slapped in the middle.

It's not too much of a concept stretch. The other variant is the much smaller size closer to the Bomb reference picture!

PS:

Imperials had turrets "Hellooo, it's called a Lancer "

The 24m is canon as far as I'm concerned, given that those who came up with the ship (West End Games) specified it as being 24m, and to my knowledge that has not been contradicted by the other sources that have included it.

Empire at War and the picture posted above contradict 24m.

The ship, assuming it's the West End Games one, is conceptually actually one of Timothy Zahn's creations. West End Games may have statted it, but unless they gave a picture Empire at War gives the image and model of the TIE/sr. It's also possible this is possibly Wookieepedia or even Lucasfilm clumsily combining EaW's TIE/sr (pictured above) with an old sourcebook craft.

I'm not saying that WEG didn't make some whoppers. However, I do think they got there first, or at least they worked hand-in-hand with Zahn. Did Zahn really stat the ships out with lengths and all that? I doubt it, but it doesn't really matter. That said, being first is not necessarily the highest form of canon IMO. Sometimes stuff that's bad needs to be fixed.

I'm going to take more convincing that this ship's concept is so broken that it needs to be fixed. I do think that the absurd length that the 24m would imply if the cockpit is the same size as that of the standard TIE.

The TIE/sr is pictured above in that hanger picture and again here in this EaW screenshot. The two craft are in the correct scale to each other. Look at the cockpits. Were that a 24 metre ship it would be three times the size of the TIE bomber in every dimension. It would fill the entire area of the hanger depicted and have a laughably big TIE cockpit. To put it in perspective, here's what it would look like.

I'm not sure what to do with your screenshot, given that the TIE/sr craft are in the foreground. Maybe I'm missing the point you're making with it.

Even if they're at the scale you suggest, they'd have no problem fitting into the main or secondary hangars of a Star Destroyer. They wouldn't be able to fit into the TIE racks, however. In that you are correct.

Reply to Aminar:

Are you aware that Fig 3 (the white picture) is a picture I made? It's not an official picture, I put it together in Paint.NET to illustrate the silliness of scaling the TIE up that much. I haven't found a single picture of the TIE scout in that scale.

To clarify, what I'm asserting is that the TIE scout is not 24m, that it's about 8m long, and that this picture shows it in the correct scale.

Reply to Mikael Hasselstein:

I concede the EaW screenshot's not particularly informative, but I can confirm that EaW has the TIE scout scaled to the TIE bomber as in the picture above.

On the 24m issue. Are we in agreement that there is no other existing official visual depiction of the TIE scout other than the appearance above? That the TIE/sr looks like this?

There are only two ways to make this 24m. We can go all stretch-limo on it, a la Post #34 and #45's pictures. This asserts that the above picture is of the TIE/sr, that the TIE/sr is 8m, and that the Lone Scout has a different hull that makes it look like the TIE Limo. While not as silly as the depiction that is to come, I've only seen two pictures of it like this, neither is official and one of them I made. That, and if the Lone Scout and TIE/sr look the same, then there are a hell of a lot of images to disprove the stretch TIE. There are two in this post alone. It only works if the Lone Scout is longer than the TIE/sr.

Alternatively, we upscale the whole thing. That would look like this.


Made this in Paint.NET, it's not an official picture.

This is the TIE scout next to the TIE bomber, an increase in volume of 27x. This just looks silly. Once again, no official picture to back up this size.

So either the book that hanger picture of the TIE scout came from, Empire at War and every other picture of the TIE/sr I've seen is wrong, or West End Games' length is inconsistent with the depiction of the craft. That, or Wookieepedia is wrong about the Lone Scout and TIE/sr having the same hull at all. It's not as if Wookieepedia's got a good track record on lengths, given the HWK and the TIE model next to the bomber above.

To conclude, I could believe the Lone Scout (the civilian model quoted as 24m) is the stretch limo TIE, and the TIE scout, the one we see all the pictures of, is 8m. I cannot accept the TIE scout as the limo TIE, and can accept neither as the 27x bigger (3 in all dimensions) jumboTIE with a cockpit so big that you could fit a couple of A-wings inside it. Not without any evidence to support either apart from a number in an old sourcebook.

I don't think we'll see many of these (thankfully). Maybe the Hunter or the Avenger (possibly as a title card for Advanced) ... I think republic prequel ships playable in both factions are more likely as a last step before ships from Rebels and VII.

If we're going to bash on the Lone Scout I just want to say there are, and have been, plenty of problems with it since the beginning. WEG was often nice enough to illustrate vehicles; unfortunately they weren't always nice enough to illustrate them with any kind of scale and that frontal view of the Lone Scout really doesn't help give it a sense of size. Another problem then and now is "how can that thing hold half again as much stuff as the Falcon and be so much smaller?" That has always irritated me about it.

When it come to cockpits that "round" design the TIE uses seems to me like a simple enough choice that it could be used many places. A bigger ship could have more glass just to increase visibility. While I think that RECG image is pretty I don't think it makes the Scout big enough by a large margin; ok, maybe for a 25 ton cargo capacity but certainly NOT for 150 tons of cargo. I'll mention that the TIE Scout entry in the RECG lists crew as 1 to 3 and enlarging the viewing window and putting a couple more seats in some triangle configuration makes plenty of sense.

compare schematics .. YT1300 has very little space for it's cargo hold. Rest of it originally, has 2 escape pod tubes, living quarters etc.

W/ the Scout .. take in consideration that all you have to do is split the TIE Adv in half then put large room in between it, the TIE/SR is the discrepancy. Previous link of mine shows a proposed schematic concept.

Think I'll tinker w/ AutoCAD with some basic designs, it can calculate area of objects.