Well guys we got a little off track, I was looking at more ideas around builds that counter wes, or tactics. I know focus fire is the key solution but what do you do about the token removal?
Also someone mentioned that a soft counter is whipser with VI and ACD, this doesn't work as wes is ps10 and whisper ps9.
Yes, but Whisper shoots after Wes and gets back her focus token.
Well guys we got a little off track, I was looking at more ideas around builds that counter wes, or tactics. I know focus fire is the key solution but what do you do about the token removal?
Also someone mentioned that a soft counter is whipser with VI and ACD, this doesn't work as wes is ps10 and whisper ps9.
Yes, but Whisper shoots after Wes and gets back her focus token.
ture, just having init will be a big deal with her so you don't get shot from wedge on a follow up.
PtL interceptors, whether 3 elite or 4 semi-elite (like 4 royal guards) should also beat three X's with Wes. You have to fly carefully and avoid giving the x's good shots, but as long as you: a) set up an asteroid clump somewhere towards the middle of the table & b) avoid formation flying, there's nothing the X's can do to stop you from getting behind them. Yes you will lose at least one interceptor, most likely two, but once Wes is out of the picture, your opponent will never get Opportunist off again because you've got 2 tokens. Fel is even harder for this list to deal with because he can take 3 tokens (which negates effectiveness of Wes' ability) and as long as you go for an initiative bid and give it to the x's, only Wes will get to move before him (and moving last with interceptors is a big advantage....except Turr - he always wants to shoot first).
PtL interceptors, whether 3 elite or 4 semi-elite (like 4 royal guards) should also beat three X's with Wes. You have to fly carefully and avoid giving the x's good shots, but as long as you: a) set up an asteroid clump somewhere towards the middle of the table & b) avoid formation flying, there's nothing the X's can do to stop you from getting behind them. Yes you will lose at least one interceptor, most likely two, but once Wes is out of the picture, your opponent will never get Opportunist off again because you've got 2 tokens. Fel is even harder for this list to deal with because he can take 3 tokens (which negates effectiveness of Wes' ability) and as long as you go for an initiative bid and give it to the x's, only Wes will get to move before him (and moving last with interceptors is a big advantage....except Turr - he always wants to shoot first).
Good luck with that plan. Wes often takes 2 tokens off of Interceptors as they have to spend one to keep from blowing up. PTL interceptors are very good at getting out of firing range and arches with boost barrel action. This is largely due to the ability to move after the enemy. Since the X's move after you won't get that much benefit out knowing where they are to better position them. But by all means give it a shot on the table.
Took on Turr, Fel and Jax with the list in the last round of our 1st Imdaar tourney, was definitely the hardest battle I had, all 3 of them had stealth device, targeting computer and PTL. They were bloody hard to target and did some damage but it always seemed to be on Luke and he kept regenerating his shields back with R2, I took down Turr early with concentrated range 1 fire then chased the other 2 till they ran into stuff and couldn't do their actions, they really were doing beautiful jobs staying out of arc when they had their actions.
Against a 4 bomber fleet of Jonus and scimitars loaded to the gills with missiles and bombs I messed with them so much they never got to fire a single missile and only managed to let off 1 seismic charge. I was taking out the bombers very easily.
2nd round was Biggs, Wedge and Kyle, I killed Biggs so **** fast then Kyle, his Wedge killed mine then Luke and Wes took him down.
Took on Turr, Fel and Jax with the list in the last round of our 1st Imdaar tourney,
How have you already played in an Imdaar tournament?
Took on Turr, Fel and Jax with the list in the last round of our 1st Imdaar tourney,
How have you already played in an Imdaar tournament?
Because it's Friday, thus counting as the weekend...
Took on Turr, Fel and Jax with the list in the last round of our 1st Imdaar tourney,
How have you already played in an Imdaar tournament?
Because it's Friday, thus counting as the weekend...
Did he play the tournament at 8 a.m. and just got back from it?
Good luck with that plan. Wes often takes 2 tokens off of Interceptors as they have to spend one to keep from blowing up. PTL interceptors are very good at getting out of firing range and arches with boost barrel action. This is largely due to the ability to move after the enemy. Since the X's move after you won't get that much benefit out knowing where they are to better position them. But by all means give it a shot on the table.
Wes 'can' take 2 tokens off, but I wouldn't say its super high odds...not sure the math but that's assuming Wes gets a shot - even with Wes moving last, a good player can predict where the x-wing formation is headed and worse case scenario is R3 I would think.
Also, keep in mind that in this case, interceptors should not be flying in formation. Sure the x-wings will bag an interceptor early on....they will corner it and kill it, but while doing so the others are moving in on the flanks and will be getting shots. It shouldn't take more than maybe 4 decent shots to kill Wes, not that hard to do in 2 rounds and then the x-wings are at a bit of a disadvantage because no more token stripping means opportunist is unlikely to trigger.
Hey, I'm not saying interceptors are the paper vs. your specific rock list. But still, I think x-wings are an ideal matchup for interceptors, so it could go either way. Player skill will of course be the biggest influence, possibly, which is cool.
Took on Turr, Fel and Jax with the list in the last round of our 1st Imdaar tourney,
How have you already played in an Imdaar tournament?
Because it's Friday, thus counting as the weekend...
Did he play the tournament at 8 a.m. and just got back from it?
I'm assuming he's outside the U.S.
So, I have been thinking about this squad and I have really liked it since I saw it reported on the Regionals thread. I also really like Keyan Farlander. So here's an idea that swaps out Wedge for Keyan, and ups the damage from Wes
Wes Janson + Push the Limit + R2 (33)
Luke Skywalker + Opportunist (32)
Keyan Farlander + Advanced Sensors + Push the Limit (35)
I'm not saying this is better than Wes + Wedge + Luke, but it looks like a very good alternative. This squad should, in theory, be able to handle Swarms slightly better.
for me, and here I'll admit I have an unnatural obsession over Opportunist, to not have Opportunist on Keyan. PTL sure gives him focus and target lock, but so does Opportunist. By using a natural target lock action with Keyan and then Opportunist giving him the stress to use as a focus. Now he is rolling 4 dice with target lock and focus.
Major, there are so many variations once the rebel aces comes out to this type of build. Here is one thing to consider
Wes /w Wingman
Luke /w Opportunist + R2-D2
Keyan Farlander /w Opportunist
could be really interesting as Wes can allow a Kturn from Luke or Keyan and not take away the Opportunist shot. Right now I like my list of 3 X's in the current meta but everything is sson to change once the wave 4 releases. I've already moved on to different build ideas.
edit: nevermind. Right, so actually you REALLY want Opportunist on Keyan.
Further edit: So, an even more insane version would be:
PS 10: Wes Janson + Veteran Instincts (30)
PS 9: Wedge + Opportunist + R2 (36)
PS 7: Keyan Farlander + Opportunist + Advanced Sensors (34)
That is downright terrifying. Basically swapping out Luke for Keyan exactly, to get even more damage. Keyan should be rolling 5 dice with TL + F on almost every turn, even if he K-turns!. That should still be better than Wedge's (range 1) 5 dice with focus and -1 agility on the defender.
Edit: he can't use Opportunist if he K-turns, since Opportunist triggers before Keyan's ability text, and he will still have stress.
Edited by MajorJuggleredit: nevermind. Right, so actually you REALLY want Opportunist on Keyan.
Further edit: So, an even more insane version would be:
PS 10: Wes Janson + Veteran Instincts (30)
PS 9: Wedge + Opportunist + R2 (36)
PS 7: Keyan Farlander + Opportunist + Advanced Sensors (34)
That is downright terrifying. Basically swapping out Luke for Keyan exactly, to get even more damage. Keyan should be rolling 5 dice with TL + F on almost every turn, even if he K-turns!. That should still be better than Wedge's (range 1) 5 dice with focus and -1 agility on the defender.
Thanks Major, now Im going to have trouble sleeping over that nightmare of a squad! 
It's like an alpha strike every turn. An alpha strike, a beta strike, a gamma strike, a delta strike ... and then there are no more ships to strike.
Wes + Swarm Tactics
Keyan + Opportunist
Etahn + Opportunist
Wes strips tokens.
Etahn gives everyone free crits
Keyan is a monster.
You loose the advanced sensors on Keyan and -1 agility on Wedges attack, but I think this has the potential to be much harsher, thats 3 crits a turn...
Minor update, Keyan can't use Opportunist if he K-turns. He's still nasty good though.
Wes + Swarm Tactics
Keyan + Opportunist
Etahn + Opportunist
Wes strips tokens.
Etahn gives everyone free crits
Keyan is a monster.
You loose the advanced sensors on Keyan and -1 agility on Wedges attack, but I think this has the potential to be much harsher, thats 3 crits a turn...
Etahn would be a good hitter in this, almost making it impossible not to take a critical hit.
Wes + Swarm Tactics
Keyan + Opportunist
Etahn + Opportunist
Wes strips tokens.
Etahn gives everyone free crits
Keyan is a monster.
You loose the advanced sensors on Keyan and -1 agility on Wedges attack, but I think this has the potential to be much harsher, thats 3 crits a turn...
Personally I'd rather have Wedge. The goal is to kill one ship a turn. Extra crits don't matter if the ship is destroyed. Plus, with Wedge you have better PS (10/9/7 vs 8/8/7). Makes it more of a true alpha strike 
Wes
Porkins + Opportunist
Farlander + HLC + Opportunist
Minor update, Keyan can't use Opportunist if he K-turns. He's still nasty good though.
If you give Wes Wingman he can!
Took on Turr, Fel and Jax with the list in the last round of our 1st Imdaar tourney,
How have you already played in an Imdaar tournament?
WELCOME TO THE LAND OF TOMORROW!!*
*Australia
Took the squadron for a spin again today at a different store with a very different meta. I was slaughtered repeatedly, the place was full of TIE swarms and rebel swarms also the dice were decidedly against me much of the day continuously leaving ships with 1hp left and then preventing me from finishing them off as they quickly minced through my lack of HP oh well.
I'm contemplating a couple of similar Wes-based builds myself. High PS Rebel squads seem like fun to fly, but **** they can be fragile. Movement, as always, is key - so that said:
I'm torn between DTF and VI for Ibitisam, Or possibly giving Wedge AR and Ibitisam PTL.
So I ran a wes squad today and went 3-0 for our Immidar Tournament (then won the final match)
It was
Wes, VI, R5-K6
Wedge, Opp, R2 Astro
Ibistam, Opp, FCS
The list ran as well as expected.
Round 1 my opponent accidentally overshot with vader and landed on an asteroid, Wedge put a range 1+oppo and wiped him out. I was able to ping away and kill Jax the following round, cleanup on the rest of the Ties, I did loose wes but not until the main threats were dead
WIN
Round 2 was against an three X squad with the synergy of the new "focus" shield droid and garvin with the new PS droid and VI. Wedge came with firepower. We simply jousted and my ability to kill biggs in 2 turns made a huge difference in our game. I lost wedge this time but my ability to kturn and having wes left him tokenless and dead.
Round 3 was against xxbb. Jousting again, killed biggs on first pass. Killed tarn, and followed up with killing the b-wings 1 at a time.
Overall I found that ibi with FCS is a better choice that another x-wing. Multiple times it helped me having that reroll on evade and on attack, especially when FCS hadn't kicked in yet. I got lucky and rolled 100% (8/8) for my r5k6 droid and kept my target lock through all my games. Ibi was the bench player and usually was putting damage on another ship after wedge killed the hopeless target or finishing off a ship that survived wedges attack.
Before I started reading this forum, I had already prepped a similar list to the variations discussed on here, but I have a few pointers based on play testing experience and winning the recent AIA tournament. My list was the following:
1. Wes, VI, R5-P9
2. Wedge, Opportunist, R2
3. Ibtisam, Opportunist
Total: 99
First off, I see having initiative as a benefit in a list full of high PS pilots. Asteroid placement is key and I have a couple of theories on that, but getting the first placement immediately give you the edge of the opponent because they will often build off of what you put down. Conversely, your placement can drive them to put asteroids where they wouldn't normally. Asteroid placement in general is often under utilized as the 6th man.
Secondly, Wes is the VIP. If he gets whacked, then the list suffers (but can certainly still perform). This is why I chose R5-P9. I found that having the focus available to spend or not spend on the shield was great, because Wes is not there to deal damage. If he does deal damage that is an added bonus to the stripping. Wes is like a setter in volleyball and his team mates do the spiking. R5-P9 has the added advantage of being unpredictable. The opponent can't bet on which direction Wes will go, unlike R2-D2.
Third, I debated for some time about the merits of PTL over Opportunist on Wedge. Certainly in the advent of losing Wes, he would be at a disadvantage, but I felt the extra dice and a focus really compounded Wedge's ability to do damage. It's a crit producing HLC after all.
Ibtisam is the anchor. Many Wes lists feature Luke as the third man, but I find he is still to squishy and encourages opponents to focus their fire on easier targets. A B-wing does just the opposite! What's even better is that the B-wing isn't even the star player, but in this meta has developed such a reputation for heavy hitting that few want to ignore it. Also remember that everything which could destroy a B-wing will likely destroy that Skywalker X-wing twice as fast. Ibtisam also makes the most of Opportunist and Stress, so I don't think having FCS is beneficial, especially considering that the whole squadron is likely to melt an enemy fighter each round, as was my case at the latest event. The final advantage of Ibtisam over Luke is that she brings a slew of maneuvers that X-wings cannot perform. This forces your opponent to take her maneuvers into account and adds unpredictability to yours, a benefit in a game where you are constantly guessing what your opponents next move will be.
In conclusion, the list has all the tools necessary to defend through offense. It reliably destroys a ship per turn, even up to 10 HP. The liability that it doesn't possess effective counter measures is something that needs to be offset by the players deployment and dogfighting abilities. Refused flank deployments are critical to its success. Asteroids need to be deployed to break up formations. Once the initial clash is made and formations break up, you as the pilot need to be able to capitalize on your superior aces. I'd rather rely on my flying over green dice any day for defense. This list is so single minded, yet flexible! Needless to say, it is powerful and will remain a favorite of mine for the foreseeable future.
PS. I played Imperial in the final round and won with a PS 1 Defender, Whisper w/ VI, Advanced Cloak and FCS, and Maarek w/ Opportunist. The Phatom is a meta shaker and will eat fighters for breakfast. I don't think I'd ever run one any differently than what I had with Whisper. Only real weakness is turretted vessels. Dual falcon or Y's will have some list strength here.