Besides, never let Canon get in the way of good gaming...Its all fantasy anyways.

I'm reading the Beta inbetween stabs of the F5 button, building a character - and I found Table 2-2, the "What Can You Spend XP on and How Much Everything Costs" table.

FINALLY! Seriously, it took them two editions to finally get around to putting in a simple 'raising stats costs you X, raising skills costs you Y' table? That right there is worth the 60 bucks for the CSB for me!

Note that it's " Table 2–2: Spending Starting Experience ", starting XP, it doesn't apply for during-play expenditures. Right above the table it says " [c]haracteristics may only be purchased with experience points during character creation, not at any later time. (During gameplay, however, characteristics can be increased by purchasing specific talents.) "

That very same table is on page 92 of the EotE corebook, and page 102 of the AoR corebook.

-EF

Having the Lightsaber forms as actual Specializations is odd to me. Wouldn't they better serve as Universal Specializations? Or is the point about Balance and XP spending in order to pick up multiple forms?

As has been previously said by others, Improved Reflect seems not only difficult to get to but overpowered and rare. ...3 threat or 1 despair (Unless you invest in Sense) is hard to get

Second, there are numerous ways to increase a character's range defense: armor, cover, weapons with a Deflection rating, Sixth Sense talent, the new Forewarning talent, . These can all provide Threat.

Third, there are numerous ways to upgrade attacks against a character: Sense power was mentioned, and there are also the Side Step and Dodge talents, Destiny Points, Advantage generated, and I'm sure I'm forgetting something.

And of course we shouldn't forget other ways to add Setback dice to pools: fear checks, Advantage generated, environmental effects, some talents.

Eventually, you pick up on a few of these things (Sense power and defense rating seem to be the best bang for your buck) and you will be redirecting blaster bolts back at mooks in no time. Either that, or they'll just flat out miss you

It is simple, which is fine, but seems odd to me that you could just use a baddies minions to whittle down the BBEG's wounds without an attack roll against him. (And how can a ranged "short" blaster shot go beyond it's own initial range? Am I being pedantic?)

2) The range limitation is (IMO) obviously an accuracy issue, not a physical-limitations-of-the-blaster-bolt-issue. Take for example the Sniper Shot talent. Now, you get a skilled enough dude deflecting a blaster bolt, he could arguably put it wherever he wants. Same as an expert marksman.

That's just a hypothetical argument, but I think it holds up as a sensible reply against the range objections.

Clarification about Morality, does it apply to non-Force Sensitives? I REALLY want to port it over to my Edge game ASAP.

Given that there aren't any non-Force-sensitives in F&D on its face no. If you wanted to though it is by no means a leap of faith to go ahead and do it. You'd simply be ignoring the converting dark pips issue of creating Conflict, but could still hold players actions in the game as a source.

I also ask because FFG has said the typical progression is you start with characters in Edge, move them to AoR, then into F&D. So if you follow that progression I am wondering if the Dev's intend for the mechanic to be applicable to all characters? Seems odd they would exclude non-Force sensitives in that way, but I guess it kind of fits with RotJ...

My excitable players are creating initial drafts of their characters. They particularly love the Seeker class and it's animal companion, a kind of Force-sensitive Druid...

I'm happy with the reimagining of the Guardian/Sentinel/Consular split and the lightsaber forms.

That very same table is on page 92 of the EotE corebook, and page 102 of the AoR corebook.

. . . I see no table in EotE. I don't know what you're talking about!

[throws smoke bomb]

[runs out of thread]

It takes awhile for the attraction of the non Lightsaber specs to sink in. When you really start contemplating the Lightsaber trees you come to realize that is their deal and pretty much only that. Nothing wrong with it, but it begins to set in in those trees you really need to pay attention to skills.

I like Sentinel Shadow a lot. I like Warrior Aggressor a lot, the Batman spec I think. I think I'd probably go with a Sage/Niman Disciple thing myself.

It takes awhile for the attraction of the non Lightsaber specs to sink in. When you really start contemplating the Lightsaber trees you come to realize that is their deal and pretty much only that. Nothing wrong with it, but it begins to set in in those trees you really need to pay attention to skills.

I like Sentinel Shadow a lot. I like Warrior Aggressor a lot, the Batman spec I think. I think I'd probably go with a Sage/Niman Disciple thing myself.

There is nothing I see about the Sentinel that I don't like. Tinkerer? Check! Tailor? Almost check. Soldier? Check. Spy? CHECK! What's not to like?

-EF

They'll probably add the section about integrating the games to the final release of F&D.

"...all crystals used in lightsabers are some form of Kyber crystal." Hmmm... is this a break from lore? I thought they were mostly Adegan or Synthetic, with the Kyber being a sort of "super crystal". I don't remember seeing Adegan listed at all (though Ilum fits, right?)

I also ask because FFG has said the typical progression is you start with characters in Edge, move them to AoR, then into F&D. So if you follow that progression I am wondering if the Dev's intend for the mechanic to be applicable to all characters? Seems odd they would exclude non-Force sensitives in that way, but I guess it kind of fits with RotJ...

"...all crystals used in lightsabers are some form of Kyber crystal." Hmmm... is this a break from lore? I thought they were mostly Adegan or Synthetic, with the Kyber being a sort of "super crystal". I don't remember seeing Adegan listed at all (though Ilum fits, right?)

EDIT: The "super crystal" you're thinking of might be the Kaiburr crytal?

So it's just pick one from the chart: more XP, more money, more money and XP, or more (or less) morality - without a string attached?

That appears to be the case: there's no default.

Although, if I had to choose one to be the closest "baseline", I'd go with the Morality of 70.

I have a question for any kindly person with the books - Force Lightning! How deadly is it? And how far up the tree is it?

The basic Protect/Unleash spend 2 pips and succeed at average Discipline check to make a ranged short with base damage = your Willpower, Critical 2. Costs 20 xp. It just gets more nasty from there as you descend the tree (more damage, range & targets).

You DO need a FR of 3+ to learn it, however. So if you start with (for example) the Sage spec and pick up both +1 FR, you can get it by the time you fill-out your first talent tree.

Thanks for taking the time. Well it's not the preserve of absolute masters, but it's not a novice power which I appreciate. And it sounds like you can really fill it out and make it completely awesome. Great news for me!

One of the players REALLY likes the Mastery power that lets you kill someone using the Force and resurrect someone else!

The new powers look awesome, but the sense of balance is there too. It will need HUGE amounts of XP to get to the levels where you can do a lot of the really powerful stuff. The careers feel balanced with only six career skills each, and the talent trees with trade-offs between a Force dice and Dedication offer different ways to progress...

Starting characters certainly don't outstrip EoE or AoR ones, but the potential is there for Force users to be incredibly powerful... 1000- 2000 XP down the line.

"...all crystals used in lightsabers are some form of Kyber crystal." Hmmm... is this a break from lore? I thought they were mostly Adegan or Synthetic, with the Kyber being a sort of "super crystal". I don't remember seeing Adegan listed at all (though Ilum fits, right?)

This is the new lore, new canon, straight out of the Clone Wars season 5.

EDIT: The "super crystal" you're thinking of might be the Kaiburr crytal?

I forgot about that! They do have the Mephite Crystal from the Adega system so my feels over the cut scene from ROTJ and Shadows of the Empire are cool. Really, the only thing that I am hoping they add is a Synthetic Crystal. Compressed and Unstable would be fun but probably too many special words with Superior and Burn already out there. From what I remember, Synthetic were pretty powerful, almost every darksider made them that way, and Luke made his green one that way.

I just want to say thank you to everyone posting from GenCon or about their playtest experiences.

We have been playing EotE since GenCon's beta give away two years ago and the whole time I have been waiting to get these rules. One more month!

I have a question for any kindly person with the books - Force Lightning! How deadly is it? And how far up the tree is it? I always liked the idea from TCW and movies that it was something only the real masters managed to achieve - it was the impression I always got. And also that it was pretty lethal, especially if you weren't a Sith/Jedi yourself. Dooku manages to fell Maul's brother with it pretty easily in TCW and he was nearly unstoppable normally. Also in the movies, I think we only ever see Sidious, Yoda and Dooku actually use it (may be remembering wrongly).Does it have suitable stature in the rules?

Force lightning is actually called out in the Protect/Unleash power as the bottom upgrade, costing 25XP (in addition to the 60XP it costs to get there). It allows you to spend a Force point to reduce the critical rating by 1 per FP spent. Also, the Duration upgrade just before Force lightning says that if no light side pips are used in the activation of the power, it also gains Burn with a rating equal to your Willpower.

So Force lightning is Damage [Willpower], Crit of 4, range of Short (upgrades can increase this), with the Burning [Willpower] quality if no LS pips were used. Oh, and there are two Strength upgrades that let you spend Force points to add successes or advantages (your choice) equal to the number of Strength upgrades, which can be activated multiple times! Granted, non of the Strength upgrades are on the way to Force Lightning, but still.

As has been stated, it requires a FR of 3+, so it's not something you're going to be starting with. All in all, it's a bad-âss and scary power!

-EF

I wonder at using the Mechanic Skill to Mod the Lightsaber Crystal Attachments. It seems strange. I understand that modding is in the nature of the game and I enjoy it, but modifying a crystal after the fact (especially with mechanics) is out of place. Maybe that is what "synthesizing" a crystal is now? If so I would suggest a crystal furnace as gear!

but the potential is there for Force users to be incredibly powerful... 1000- 2000 XP down the line.

That basically means no one is ever going to get to actually play with the cool toys.

I also think it is pretty unliky that the system will still be remotely playable at that point.

Start a game and give the players 1000 xp and whatever eq they want and vooila the game you want appears.

Is there a post buried back there somewhere that explains the Morality mechanic a bit more thoroughly? Specifically, what happens when you roll the exact same number as your conflict score (nothing?), how much does your morality drop or go up after the roll, what is the lower threshold to become 'fallen' (zero I assume?), what happens when you go over 100? And what can you do to redeem yourself after you have fallen below threshold?

Thanks!

*edit - I have a force sensitive in both of my running campaigns that I would like to start using this on right away...

but the potential is there for Force users to be incredibly powerful... 1000- 2000 XP down the line.

That basically means no one is ever going to get to actually play with the cool toys.

I also think it is pretty unliky that the system will still be remotely playable at that point.

Every RPG involves buy in at the table among the players and the GM.

If you want to recreate The Force Unleashed then you'd need buy in for that no matter which system you were using.

With F&D you can recreate The Force Unleashed. You just need high powered characters. The system does in fact support that. It is an option.

But the issue here is not the system - the issue is buy in at the table with your fellow players.

It seems like you want the system to force buy in at the table for you by din of the system fully supporting what you want right out of the gate or soon after character creation.

Of course this also wouldn't solve your problem because you've only shifted the arena in which the issue is discussed - from getting buy in at the table for the type of game you want to have (The Force Unleashed) to which system people want to play and if this mythical Only Jedi All The Time Super Force Unleashed system did exist you'd still have to talk people at the table into playing it.

So no matter what you do you're still sitting at a table saying "Hey - I want to play a high powered crazy force power Jedi game - who else does?".

In other words you're not going to trick people into playing the game you want to have just by having the perfect system for the kind of game you want to have.

FFG supports the game you want to have. Now you just need to find a group that wants that kind of experience at the table.

Also, which system could possibly be "remotely playable" when your standard is throwing star destroyers around?

Is there a post buried back there somewhere that explains the Morality mechanic a bit more thoroughly? Specifically, what happens when you roll the exact same number as your conflict score (nothing?), how much does your morality drop or go up after the roll, what is the lower threshold to become 'fallen' (zero I assume?), what happens when you go over 100? And what can you do to redeem yourself after you have fallen below threshold?

Thanks!

*edit - I have a force sensitive in both of my running campaigns that I would like to start using this on right away...

If you roll equal to your Conflict score, nothing happens: no gain or reduction.

The fallen threshold is under 30—so 29 or less. Conversely, above 70 is the redemption threshold—or if you haven't fallen, it's the "paragon" threshold. The maximum morality is 100.

-EF

I have been thinking about lightsaber redirecting blaster fire etc. I think to cover what we see in the movies I will say the threat they generated on their combat checks was used to cause them strain. Since most of the characters we see getting their fire sent back to them are stormtroopers or battle droids they do not have strain threshold which means they would take wounds if I understand properly. What do you think?