Basically I'm just wondering if you can buy the reinforced shield generator twice or the enhanced armor twice or something like that.

Woah, wrong forums. Sorry guys

I don't think so, but with the mod options you still get to a similar level of boosted protection.

Nothing in the book says you can or cant do that.

The book does say that you can't have more than 4 points of defense in any one zone. That and the increased cost and drawbacks of multiples of the same attachment indicates to me that I let it happen in my game.

Nothing in the book says you can or cant do that.

The book does say that you can't have more than 4 points of defense in any one zone. That and the increased cost and drawbacks of multiples of the same attachment indicates to me that I let it happen in my game.

By the same token, the RAI of normal weapon attachments seems to be you can't install 2 of the same thing twice on a weapon even if there are sufficient HP to do so. Sure, you can install two different scopes to a gun or edges to a vibroblade (by the RAW, because there are not strict "upgrade slots" unlike in Shadowrun) but I wouldn't read that into "can install the same scope or edge twice."

Hence why I think the intent with something like the shield generator is "install it once, mod it if you want it to be better and angle your shields so you have rating 4 somewhere."

Personally, I feel that you generally can't install the same exact attachment twice.

So for starships, you couldn't install a hyperdrive generator attachment twice, nor could you install a retrofitted hanger bay twice or smuggling compartments or high-output ion turbines. The only starship attachment that could be taken multiple times to me would be adding weapons, because what's happening there is that each weapon is a unique item, even if you're installing two sets of quad laser cannons on your light freighter.

Yeah, I'm with Donovan on this. One attachment of any one type on one item/vehicle. Just because the rules don't explicitly forbid it doesn't mean you can't use some common sense. For example, putting two barrels of the same type on the same blaster rifle makes absolutely no sense.

Yeah, I'm with Donovan on this. One attachment of any one type on one item/vehicle. Just because the rules don't explicitly forbid it doesn't mean you can't use some common sense. For example, putting two barrels of the same type on the same blaster rifle makes absolutely no sense.

Now here's where I'm going to disagree. I don't see the problem with two different barrel types, just like two different scopes - assume a tech hybridization to get the best of both worlds. Like having a monomolecular serrated edge.

Now if you have two different sensor systems that do different things, or two different engine upgrades (one that increases, say, speed, and one that replaces handling) - yeah I would be fine with both of those being installed for the same reason.

To me that's different than attaching two serrated edges (or installing two of the same shield generator), which doesn't make sense.

Krieger22 did say, "two barrels of the same type", BTW...

To me it makes sense that you can only have one barrel, scope, etc. on a gun, but I'm not asking about personal scale attachments, I'm specifically asking about starship upgrades.

Krieger22 did say, "two barrels of the same type", BTW...

H, whoops. Maybe we agree more than I thought!

To me it makes sense that you can only have one barrel, scope, etc. on a gun, but I'm not asking about personal scale attachments, I'm specifically asking about starship upgrades.

Only 1 barrel/scope/etc isn't the RAW (nor has it been clarified to be the RAI) and I can't see ship mods being treated substantially differently than personal scale attachments.

To me it makes sense that you can only have one barrel, scope, etc. on a gun, but I'm not asking about personal scale attachments, I'm specifically asking about starship upgrades.

Well, having multiple barrels (even of different types) on a personal-scale weapon could be construed as odd to some GMs while being perfectly allowable for other GMs.

But yeah, starship upgrades seem a lot more specific as there's not more than one type of engine attachment or more than one type of armor attachment. You purchase that one attachment, and can then modify it if the option exists, but you can't stack the same attachment onto a ship, no matter how fast you want your YT-1300 to go in realspace.

But yeah, starship upgrades seem a lot more specific as there's not more than one type of engine attachment or more than one type of armor attachment. You purchase that one attachment, and can then modify it if the option exists, but you can't stack the same attachment onto a ship, no matter how fast you want your YT-1300 to go in realspace.

The more propulsion a given craft (e.g. - automobile, jet, TIE fighter, etc) can produce, the faster it can go. Now, I'm not saying the rules should allow stacking attachments, but, strictly speaking, installing more and bigger engine components would make a ship go faster.

Personally, I think it depends on the nature of the attachment. For example, I don't see a problem with players installing multiple smuggling compartment components if the base ship's encumbrance can accommodate it.

A single smuggling compartment on a YT-1300 should be about the limit for a silhouette 4 ship, but are you really going to hold a silhouette 6 Nebulon-B frigate to the same standard? If you do, you have to accept that makes absolutely no sense in context (i.e. a much larger ship being able to smuggle the same amount of material as a much, much smaller ship).

Oh, one more thing, not to mention that doubling up or tripling up on the same attachment still takes up hardpoints, and most starships don't have a huge amount to work with. Want to throw double shield generators on your freighter? Okay, fine, but realize that means you're using 4 hardpoints and eliminating a lot of other potential.

I really don't see an issue.

To me it makes sense that you can only have one barrel, scope, etc. on a gun, but I'm not asking about personal scale attachments, I'm specifically asking about starship upgrades.

Well, having multiple barrels (even of different types) on a personal-scale weapon could be construed as odd to some GMs while being perfectly allowable for other GMs.

But yeah, starship upgrades seem a lot more specific as there's not more than one type of engine attachment or more than one type of armor attachment. You purchase that one attachment, and can then modify it if the option exists, but you can't stack the same attachment onto a ship, no matter how fast you want your YT-1300 to go in realspace.

To clarify, I'm not saying you should or shouldn't be able to stack the same ship attachment (within the limits of common sense, you clearly shouldn't be able to benefit from more than one targeting computer for instance), but unlike a personal weapon, where, in most cases, you're replacing original parts with improved ones, on the ship you're generally augmenting original parts with new ones. The reasoning being, if you can layer additional armor on top of the ship's original armor (which is what the upgrade does, at the cost of handling), why can't you add a second layer? If you can add a second, more powerful shield generator, provided you have the space (hardpoints), why can't you add a third? I'd appreciate it if someone could address this argument.

I think in certain situations, I would allow duplicate items on ship hardpoints. Ships have a limited number, and weighing heavy on one stat means another suffers. How did the Falcon get so fast?

How did the Falcon get so fast?

If this must be viewed through the lens of game mechanics: Pilot talents + high-output ion thrusters.

If not, then Plot.

How did the Falcon get so fast?

If this must be viewed through the lens of game mechanics: Pilot talents + high-output ion thrusters.

If not, then Plot.

I mightily agree - but sometimes it's a fun exercise and if you can bend the mechanic to the story, so much the better.

If I am not mistaken, there are things in the rules that specifically say that you can do this x times, or that it can be repeated. If something doesn't explicitly say something along those lines, then it's one time only.

I think in certain situations, I would allow duplicate items on ship hardpoints. Ships have a limited number, and weighing heavy on one stat means another suffers. How did the Falcon get so fast?

The way it did in every prior RPG system.. it cheats.

The Falcon is an NPC craft and has never followed the ship modification rules presented in any version of Star Wars RPGs, from d6 through the various d20 games up to FFG's system. It's not supposed to be something the players can actually replicate, but rather is akin to something of a "holy grail' in that players will seek to get their ships to perform as far above the norm as they can, but they'll never be able to pull off the Falcon's all-around level of performance within the rules structure.

A perfect example of this was the light freighter modification rules found in Galaxy Guide 6: Tramp Freighters by WEG. It was next to impossible to get a YT-1300 customized to the point of being able to equal the Falcon without sacrificing the bulk of the ship's cargo capacity or making the ship likely to suffer catastrophic system failures that would make the Falcon look like a well-tuned machine. Again, the Falcon cheats because it's an NPC ship and thus isn't held to the same standards and rules that PC owned & operated ships are.

It's possible that rules will be implemented in the eventual Technician sourcebook to allow for further customization of the party's ship, possibly through an expanded attachment/modification system or maybe even through new talents to reflect "custom modifications" of the sort that Han claimed to have made to the Falcon over the years.

Of course, the Upgraded Hyperdrive Generator (I include the word Upgraded from the first line of its description since the ship already has to have a Hyperdive Generator just to take this Attachment) can allow any ship starting with a Class 2 or better hyperdrive to match the Falcon's hyperdrive if they can make one successful Mod and pay <7,500 credits (including the Attachment and the Mod). That's not really very hard to do or even very expensive for the 'totally awesome' Class 0.5 hyperdrive.

Perhaps I should have chosen a less inflammatory example. My point being that FFG's stance on these issues has historically been left to the discretion of the table. If you don't think it'll be a problem, there's not much reason to disallow it. What else is that mechanic who now has 4 proficiency dice in mechanics and regularly rolls two triumphs at a time going to do with his spare time?

What else is that mechanic who now has 4 proficiency dice in mechanics and regularly rolls two triumphs at a time going to do with his spare time?

Hopefully there will be more options in the Technician book. As of right now there really aren't many downtime options for anyone.

What else is that mechanic who now has 4 proficiency dice in mechanics and regularly rolls two triumphs at a time going to do with his spare time?

Hopefully there will be more options in the Technician book. As of right now there really aren't many downtime options for anyone.

True. My ultimate concern is that nigh impossible tasks are within the realm of even reasonably seasoned characters. Another poor example on my part....

Of course, the Upgraded Hyperdrive Generator (I include the word Upgraded from the first line of its description since the ship already has to have a Hyperdive Generator just to take this Attachment) can allow any ship starting with a Class 2 or better hyperdrive to match the Falcon's hyperdrive if they can make one successful Mod and pay <7,500 credits (including the Attachment and the Mod). That's not really very hard to do or even very expensive for the 'totally awesome' Class 0.5 hyperdrive.

However, as the Falcon hasn't gotten an official write-up in this system (and from the looks of things probably never will for some time), we've got no idea if once again the Falcon will "cheat" to get the kind of over-the-top performance it's had in other systems. So it's pretty hard to say "well yeah you can recreate the Falcon in this system" when this system has yet to display what the Falcon is even capable of.

Getting the x0.5 Hyperdrive was also possible in Sage Edition without too much fuss provided you have the credits and a competent mechanic. Even with the YT-series of ships getting a lot of extra emplacement points to install upgrades, those only went so far before you had to start sacrificing cargo capacity to get more emplacement points, something the Falcon notably didn't do in its write-up.