So, I decided to take a look at where all a phantom could go via decloaking... as well as what could it do regarding advanced sensors. I also looked at engine upgrade + AdvS... and I was planning on putting PTL in there as well, but I started to get overwhelmed with the number of options that I stopped. I did this all just to get an idea of where it can end up before it even does its maneuver... and I gotta say, I'm a little overwhelmed with the possibilities.

First... Just decloaking.. Note that the yellow circle indicates the starting position.

I decided to represent the barrel rolls by the max and min possible location, knowing that it could actually be anywhere between there.

Then, I pretend the ship had advanced sensors and thus could barrel roll before/after decloaking. Note that I did not represent the possible decloak advS cloak immediately decloak again that the legality has been discussed on the forums.

Note, I actually realized a slight error when I went to go do the boosts... you can't end up directly above/below your starting position, please ignore those two. There are multiple ways to end up at the top... BR + DC (decloak) or DC + BR. There is also no way to get back to the original spot, though you can end up a base behind (and to the side).

Finally, I added engine upgrade. I hope that once you look at this and get completely confused and overwhelmed, you agree with me that adding PTL to this would just be too much to track. Maybe another night I'll track it my systematically and figure it all out, but in the meantime...

Yeah... so all I can say to this is good luck predicting where the heck the phantom is going to be. It's ridiculous how many different places the Phantom can go without even using a maneuver. At some point, I might decide to add DD to this matrix, and/or PTL to just completely make it mind boggling. Note... If you're cant't decipher each location individually, you're not alone in that shortcoming... A few of the bases are ghosted that I missed on unghosting to figure out every path.

No real point besides just holy (*@#&$, and info sharing.

It might be easier to plot where it's NOT going to be...

Kidding aside, one strange artifact of this new craft is that if it wants to fire, it HAS to decloak. It will close fast...

Now let's see Echo. (I'm mostly kidding. Fantastic work. So many amazing options. I can't say I see PTL as the best idea on a Phantom though, so it's unnecesary.

But just think, that's all pre manuever dial.

So, when you add PTL to the chart, make sure it's on echo.

(I wasn't ninja'd, I'm just echoing him

I'm looking forward to flying at least 3 of those puppies!

Well, I was wondering about how to possibly combat the Phantom. You cannot barrel roll into a ship or obstacle. I shall have to ponder this.

Holy balls, man.

Well, I was wondering about how to possibly combat the Phantom. You cannot barrel roll into a ship or obstacle. I shall have to ponder this.

The De-cloak can collide forward. I don't think it can sideways, though. Still, though, colliding BEFORE your maneuver is an incredibly unpredictable thing.

Would a phantom without advanced sensors, who overlapped a ship with his decloak 2 forward maneuver, be allowed to perform an action in the perform action step, in spite of his actual dial maneuver leaving him free and clear?

Would a phantom without advanced sensors, who overlapped a ship with his decloak 2 forward maneuver, be allowed to perform an action in the perform action step, in spite of his actual dial maneuver leaving him free and clear?

Well, he didn't collide during his maneuver...

I suppose it would be like if a ship got a free-action, used Daredevil, and followed that with a green maneuver.

The Decloaking rules card says that the forward move IS a maneuver. If you overlap during a maneuver you skip your perform action step.

I bet this gets FAQed as well to say that the forward move doesn't count as an actual maneuver.

Hi,

The Decloaking rules card says that the forward move IS a maneuver.

actually the rules say: "Decloaking is not an action or a maneuver."

So no colliding while decloaking.

Hello folks. If you are interested in Phantom mobility, I might suggest you read this article over at TC. Echo's positioning shenanigans are looked at.

http://teamcovenant.com/tuskenraider/2014/05/05/it-is-far-harder-to-kill-a-phantom-1/

So, there seems to be a positive response from this. I'll take a look at Echo later tonight, and if I'm brave, might try the PTL+EU+AdvS combo for the base/echo. It's scary just thinking about it!

Nice! That's some crazy amount of final positions! How you kept it straight up to the last image boggles my mind. I would have said: "okay, I get the point, there are a lot of positions"

My only worry with all these options is you are still subject to turn the direction of the dial. If I select a hard turn right, thinking I will decloak to the left or straight, but find my opponent has lots of guns pointed in that direction, i really dont WANT to use the roll right manuever since it will take me out of the fight and force me to K turn next turn, which sort of sucks. I suppose this DOES create some counterplay options for your opponent. Even if you cant shoot it, at least you can force the Phantom out of the fight for a while, turning the fight into a 100pt match vs 65pt match for a few rounds.

Of course, it DOES depend on the support ships i have with the Phantom and whether my opponent can shoot at them instead. This is one flanker that I'd never want to turn my forces towards and expose my rear to the main force. Be really tough to catch that bigger!

Nice! That's some crazy amount of final positions! How you kept it straight up to the last image boggles my mind. I would have said: "okay, I get the point, there are a lot of positions"

My only worry with all these options is you are still subject to turn the direction of the dial. If I select a hard turn right, thinking I will decloak to the left or straight, but find my opponent has lots of guns pointed in that direction, i really dont WANT to use the roll right manuever since it will take me out of the fight and force me to K turn next turn, which sort of sucks. I suppose this DOES create some counterplay options for your opponent. Even if you cant shoot it, at least you can force the Phantom out of the fight for a while, turning the fight into a 100pt match vs 65pt match for a few rounds.

Of course, it DOES depend on the support ships i have with the Phantom and whether my opponent can shoot at them instead. This is one flanker that I'd never want to turn my forces towards and expose my rear to the main force. Be really tough to catch that bigger!

All the more reason to fly the named pilots with VI. It'd be much easier to decide where to end up, and even without PTL, you can see that there are plenty of options.

As for keeping it straight, I basically dealt with the three areas independently of each other. You can decloak L/F/R, but from there, the BR/Boost all do the same thing, so thinking back on it, I could have just done 1 set, and copied it into the other two locations =/.

actually the rules say: "Decloaking is not an action or a maneuver."

They say that decloaking itself is not a maneuver, but the rules for decloaking explicitly say that the one option is a maneuver and that is where the confusion come in. It comes across the same as expert handling. EH is not a barrel roll action itself, but it does cause you to perform a BR action. I agree with you, I don't think they intend for you to be able to overlap with the forward move, but it's going to require errata in order to keep people from getting confused because it says both things.

So, I decided to take a look at where all a phantom could go via decloaking...

Pretty sure you divided by zero in that last image LOL

Mann, now I'm imagining what Echo can do! HURRY up and do figure it out for me so I can save my brain power!

Mann, now I'm imagining what Echo can do! HURRY up and do figure it out for me so I can save my brain power!

My 5pm meeting just got cancelled, so I should be able to head home at a normal time tonight, so I'll work on Echo and post that up right away. That is assuming I don't stumble into a GC match first =P

By request, here is Echo...

And here is Echo w/ AdvS...

It might take me awhile to add EU and PTL to him... I'm actually goign to go back and do a standard phantom with PTL first

And PTL (+ AdvS + EU) for a standard Phantom. This is all I'm going to do... My head is still spinning looking at Echo... and really, the main thing I'm learning from doing this is that there's multiple ways to get to basically the same spot, with small variations of final position. Well, that and that they can move quite the distance... Almost a full R3 (in each direction) before he does a maneuver.

Think I'm just going to RAM him with 2-3 transports.

Or Tie/Z95 swarm block.

Fantastic work though, Khyros.

Definitely deserve an Elite Pilot Medal for that