Here's the setup: We were running an informal mini-tournament at the local store. I was running a 4 green list all with PtL and 3 with concussion missiles. I played against a guy running 4 golds with ion turrets and whatever droids he could fit in the list. Initial contact happens and all four of my greens are at range 3 on one of his golds. I took it out with 2 concussion missiles and primary fire from the other two A-wings. Only 2 of his remaining ships have a range 3 shot at me. They knock a total of one shield off of one greens.

At this point, I realized that if I could avoid confronting the remaining Y-Wings in a group, I was pretty much assured of a win. I was already up by enough points for a full win. I knew that my maneuverability could keep me away from their turrets if they all stuck together. The only way my opponent could cover enough board for the turrets to hit me would be if he split the remaining ships apart.

So, I figured my opponent had two choices. He could keep the ships together and I would avoid contact thereby giving me a win when time ran out, or he could split them up in an attempt to engage me and I could pick his ships off one by one.

He chose to keep his ships together. I successfully avoided contact with him for 6 or 7 turns before my opponent decided to concede the game. He was generally gracious about his defeat, but suggested that winning by running away wasn't exactly sportsmanlike.

I felt that since we were playing a strategy game, I had found a perfectly viable strategy to win in the given situation. Obviously, my opponent disagreed.

What do you think?

It's called "playing defensively" by FFG and they changed the rules specifically to facilitate it. If you're actually flying out of reach of him to force him to split up to take your ships down, that's completely fair and a legitimate strategy.

If you were actually stalling though, planning maneuvers slowly and taking your dear sweet time, then that would classify as poor sportsmanship.

A win is a win

It's called "playing defensively" by FFG and they changed the rules specifically to facilitate it. If you're actually flying out of reach of him to force him to split up to take your ships down, that's completely fair and a legitimate strategy.

If you were actually stalling though, planning maneuvers slowly and taking your dear sweet time, then that would classify as poor sportsmanship.

Can you provide a reference for the "playing defensively"?

I think in a competitive setting what you did was within the rules and fair. He did have the option to split his force to try and hunt you down and chose not to so he can't complain that your superior strategy beat you.

On the other hand if it was a casual game or weekly game night I probably would have wondered why you bothered to come, or I might have just conceded and asked someone else for a game.

Different situations I guess.

That strategy is perfectly valid.

You did destroy more points than your opponent. So you were better at killing than him. In addition to that, you were also able to run away better than him. So you were better at staying alive than him as well.

Mobile ships like the A-Wing have one advantage: They are mobile. They are not supposed to fly straight into the teeth of the enemy. Don't let anyone accuse you of bad sportsmanship because you use that advantage.

It's called "playing defensively" by FFG and they changed the rules specifically to facilitate it. If you're actually flying out of reach of him to force him to split up to take your ships down, that's completely fair and a legitimate strategy.

If you were actually stalling though, planning maneuvers slowly and taking your dear sweet time, then that would classify as poor sportsmanship.

Can you provide a reference for the "playing defensively"?

Indeed I can.

"Under the new rules, a player only needs to destroy at least 12 squad points (the lowest squad point cost of a single ship) more than his or her opponent, which means players no longer have to build their lists with total annihilation in mind and can opt for a slightly more tactical, defensive game if they wish." ¹

1: "New Pilot Regulations" http://www.fantasyflightgames.com/edge_news.asp?eidn=4750

It's a perfectly fine, valid tactic to use at any level of the game. You played to the strength of the A-Wing, being fast and agile.

Well done.

In a tournament? Really, all is fair in love and war. Even informal, folks should be playing their best, and trying to win. Honestly, he should have taken it as an opportunity to practice against an unorthodox strategy. Using the rules to win is the name of the game.

Personally, I'd argue that he was being a little less then sportsmanlike with the way he handled it. At the very least, he should bring it up with FFG, not you. Gaining a lead and maintaining it to win isn't that different then playing an HSF list against an elite interceptor build. You had his number, and you ran with it.

All that said, I'm not sure I'm a fan of the fact that strategies like this work, but you are basically always gonna haveta make some sacrifice in order to make a tournament system work. I haven't played enough to make a strong opinion about this one.

It's a perfectly fine, valid tactic to use at any level of the game. You played to the strength of the A-Wing, being fast and agile.

Well done.

It may not be valid in most casual play, as they don't tend to have time limits, and stalling is ACTUALLY unsportsmanlike. That said, if the maneuvering eventually wins the day, sure, that is great. This sounds like a slightly different situation, however.

While it may not seem particularly sporting or fun, I think more onus needs to be put on the "losing" side.

1. During the game, he employed a strategy (keeping his ships close together) that was to his advantage and refused to change tactics that would have forced an engagement. It would have been to his disadvantage to do so, but he was essentially asking the OP to do the same thing with his ships -- fight at a less advantageous situation.

2. He built a less maneuverable list that would be susceptible to such tactics. It's not much different than building any list that has a glaring weakness, it's just that when someone takes advantage of such a weakness it's "less fun." I'm all for fun matches, but I don't expect an opponent to make purposeful mistakes in a tourney situation for the sake of that.

The new 12 points for a match win will allow for A-wings and Tie swarms to have an opportunity to get a full win.

A-wings can alpha strike and dance around (like they are supposed to) and dodge their opponent and can get a full win. (when it was 33 points the best they could do is get a modified).

Swarms can now go at it, and if one person has 1 academy more, they can get the full win without having to kill every ship.

Absolutely 100% legal, valid, and acceptable. It may not be very fun to play against a list that can run circles around yours, but that is the game. Some ships are tough and sluggish, others are fragile and nimble. Players need to take that into account when list building and when at the table. If FFG wanted everyone to just throw ships on the table and shove them forward at each other, EVERY ship type would have 5 shields and 3 hull. This is a maneuvering game, and if you can destroy the other guy while avoiding being hit in return, you are doing well!

I think it comes down to if you were a jerk or not about it. FFG made the game in a way it's about risk and reward and the ships can move in the way you did them. I think it's cheesy as all get out but I don't think you did anything wrong.

I think what you did is perfectly valid. He could have come to get you, he chose not too. He will hopefully learn from that to diversify his list or strategy a little more next time

I'll be the voice of dissent here. What you did was rude. Not against the rules, and not wrong. But it is rude to play the run around the map game that early on. It means you're going to be doing so for the next 40+minutes. I get that it's a sound tactical decision, but you're not doing yourself any favors as far as keeping people interested in the game or interested in playing you by making your games boring. Tournaments are social things. The prizes aren't important enough to matter 99% of the time for this kind of play to be socially acceptable during the setting. Be prepared to be the least liked person in your tournament group if you keep this kind of play up.

It may not be the most exciting game, but it is a valid stratey. VERY risky, but valid. In fact, the risk is what will keep it from being a winning strategy. Even with A-wings and Interceptors, it is really, really difficult to avoid combat the whole game. In that game, all he really had to do was get an A-wing Ioned, and it would be game over for that A-wing, especially if he wasn't being judicious about his PTL usage.

Rant about the strategy if you want, but realize you are ranting about something that is never going to be big in actual tournaments. There is too much luck involved to ever make it a valid strategy.

I think Im 50/50 on this.

Totally legit tactic and well done on the successful implementation of it. Tezzasgames has it right that you were playing to the strengths of your ships, and it sounds like that he continued to play to the strengths of his ships... to his detriment.

However, I also agree with Aminar that playing against the "come and get me" strategy has the potential to be less than fun. But that is why you will either live by changing your strategy or die by sticking to it. The game is as fun as you make it.

This is also why I prefer not to run full spam lists, or at least do my best to shore up any weaknesses that my list might have. Sucks when you place you ships on the table, look across and go, "Sh*t."

I think there is a big difference between taking multiple movements to try to get that optimal range 3 shot for your remaining concussion missiles and just fleeing for 30+ minutes without any pretense of trying to get a shot off.

Obviously, your opponent wasn't having any fun. Was that strategy fun for you? For 30+ minutes? While you got a legal win in a casual mini tournament, I'd put forth that perhaps you are missing the whole point of X-wing Miniatures at large, to have fun with other people in real life. If you prefer to win no matter what, and don't feel bad about annoying your opponent, there are all manner of online video games where at least you don't have to sit face to face with someone.

If I were your opponent, II'd be temporarily annoyed and frustrated with my loss. If you showed up with that strategy on a regular basis though, I'd find a different group of players where I could enjoy my miniature gaming.

It is neither rude nor poor sportsmanship to play to your list strengths, or to your opponents weakness.

Your opponent built a squad with a blind spot, and his play compounded that blind spot. If your opponent found the game boring just point out that he contributed to that as much if not more then you by never adapting.

Social pressure should never be exerted in an effort to make you play stupidly. He had options, he chose not to utilize them.

It's a valid strategy, but it's also a **** move that's not going to make you well liked.

Actually no, running the clock and frustrating your opponent into conceding isn't a valid strategy, it's just a jerk move. You sound like one of those kids who runs the clock in MTG as soon as you are a bit ahead.

This has been a very interesting thread to read. At all the tournaments I've been to (including some of games I played and watched 2013 worlds) people seemed to really frown on winning by running away, especially for any length of time (and it sounds like you ran away the entire game after the first round). Based on things I've seen and heard people seemed to pride themselves on not doing this. They often try to maneuver so they can shoot at you and you can't shoot back, but to try to make it so no one can shoot very often because you are ahead doesn't seem fun to play or play against. And, based on what this and my own experiences playing against this tactic, I would have probably called it (or at least fealt like it was ) unsportsmanlike, too.

But now the consensus seems to be that this is ok. Based on what I'm reading I guess it is technically ok, but I would give up the game if I had to deal with this sort of thing on a regular basis as winning or losing in this way would be very boring to me. So, I can see why your opponent was upset even if you technically didn't do anything wrong. I'm still not sure I agree with the consensus, but even if they are correct I wouldn't like it very much either.

Combat during more than the first round or two takes some of the luck out of the game as it gives things a chance to even out. If you are going to only fight for a bit and then run away, a single lucky or unlucky round would make or break a game.

The good news is that I don't think this would be a viable strategy at a big tournament. A very good player might be able to deal with it even if they have an inferior squad, an average player with a great squad might be able to counter it, or your luck would run out.

I'm curious to know how you did in the tournament overall (what was your placing out of how many players)? Did you rely on this strategy a lot, or just in this or a couple of games? Did you have fun PLAYING that game (or was the fun in winning the game)?

Of course I'd rather have fun AND win, but I'd rather have fun and lose than not have fun and win.

100% legal while not very sporting. Nothing matters but winning? The ends justify the means? I would rather avoid tournaments than play in a community with that mindset. Last time I checked, this was a game for enjoyment and leisure.

The feeling you get when playing against the "I am winning acording to the rules, so I'm going to run away now, come and get me" stategy is similar to the feeling you get when you hurry up to catch an elevator when the doors are closing, and there is plenty of room on board, and the person on board looks you in the eyes as he does not hold the door for you .

Yes, he technically has done nothing wrong because you can catch the next one, but you still think, "D*ck."

100% legal while not very sporting. Nothing matters but winning? The ends justify the means? I would rather avoid tournaments than play in a community with that mindset. Last time I checked, this was a game for enjoyment and leisure.

So flip side to this, he should be expected to fly as his opponent want him to, even if that isn't fun for him? Is it unsporting that his opponent bought a list of 4 turrets? 4 ion turrets to be specific. A list specifically designed to take maneuvering out of the game. Isn't that just as unsporting under your view?