What about 'You can go to the Academy next year'... 'But that's a whole other year!'... I think that kind of counts as mentioning it...

True. But they never actually call any of the Tie Fighter's an "academy pilot", and the criteria that Black Knight seems be using is that unless it's named on screen it doesn't count.

For example he says that the only astromech's that can be used are R2-D2, because no other astromech is named on screen. He makes it quite clear that any named squad that didn't get mentioned on screen is non-canon and can't be used. So I'm pointing out that based on that the Academy Pilot is non-canon as well.

Don't get me wrong, I think his idea is clearly misguided, and his criteria is completely screwed... I'm just pointing out that he's not being consistent.

I love that every time I read a post by BKL I know it's going to be some outrageous troll even before I read it. This whole argument is ridiculously stupid.

As for me. I loved the EU. We grew up together. But I'm definitely okay with it being gone - as long as they keep some of the better characters: Jaina, Thrawn, Karrde, etc...

(Plus Chewie is back and no Vong, and no dumb Jacen arc.)

If you guys hank it's bad now just wait till the book police come to your house and confiscate all your EU material.

As far as I'm concerned, everything EU I've read was, at best, entertaining. I know everyone loves the Thrawn trilogy but all I could think while reading it was, should Star Wars really move so slow.

I'm a comic book fan though. I've been dealing with rectons and reboots since I was in grade school. This is really no big deal.

The EU is dead. All hail the EU.

I have some great experiences with the old books, and will keep them. And the fact that they will keep the old books in print is a great sign. And some of the upcoming books look to be really good.

I was reading something someplace else and someone made a good point.

How is this really any different then before?

Before we had G-Canon and C-Canon and S-Canon, ect... Now we have Canon and Legends. Both are still official Star Wars properties, just that what we currently think of as the EU no longer matters in terms of the movies.

But that was always true, so really this is little more then a rebranding of the EU.

I was reading something someplace else and someone made a good point.How is this really any different then before?Before we had G-Canon and C-Canon and S-Canon, ect... Now we have Canon and Legends. Both are still official Star Wars properties, just that what we currently think of as the EU no longer matters in terms of the movies.But that was always true, so really this is little more then a rebranding of the EU.

Right. But Canon Crises are athing, so people flip out.

I was reading something someplace else and someone made a good point.How is this really any different then before?Before we had G-Canon and C-Canon and S-Canon, ect... Now we have Canon and Legends. Both are still official Star Wars properties, just that what we currently think of as the EU no longer matters in terms of the movies.But that was always true, so really this is little more then a rebranding of the EU.

While I see your point and agree with you completely, I've never heard of differing types of canon. What does the G- S- and C-canon stand for?

But this is ultimately how I see it. Disney isn't 'Lucasing' the EU books by destroying them so nobody can ever know of their existence again. All the material is still there and the stories are still as enjoyable (or not) as they ever were.

Personally if you're going to make the leap to say that, "yes, Luke fell to the dark side and Han and Leia had kids" while not caring how George Lucas felt about it 'existing' in the canon universe he created, why would you care what Disney thinks?

Many of the truths we cling to depend greatly on our own point of view. So cling to whatever the hell you want. And please, don't get all crazy and talk about Star Wars being truly dead. Star Wars will never go anywhere and if this really does crush your view of the SW universe, I have to question how much it meant to you in the first place.

I'd like to emphasize a point that the talking heads at Disney/Lucasfilm are making, namely:

EU information is in force (no pun intended) until overwritten by a canonical source (movies or TV).

What does the G- S- and C-canon stand for?

G stands for George Canon, T for Television Canon, S for Secondary canon, ect... Here's a link to the Wookiepedia page about it. Scroll down about 3/4th of the way to see the list and what each stands for.

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Canon

The part that really made me shake my head is this :

"While the universe that readers knew is changing, it is not being discarded. Creators of new Star Wars entertainment have full access to the rich content of the Expanded Universe. For example, elements of the EU are included in Star Wars Rebels. The Inquisitor, the Imperial Security Bureau, and Sienar Fleet Systems are story elements in the new animated series, and all these ideas find their origins in roleplaying game material published in the 1980s."

Phew, we get to keep the ISB. I was worried we'd lose that. This paragraph is obviously included to assuage the fears of fans of the old EU and all they can point to is some very basic concepts that were introduced in an 80s RPG. I really do not expect to see any characters such as Mara or Thrawn in the movies. At least not in any meaningful way or behaving anything like the characters we already know.

Yea I wouldn't hold out hope for Thrawn or Mara. Maybe Luke made the Jedi Order like of old, and made them celibate (a concept I find ironic when you're supposed to be connected to everything but you can't connect with anyone).

Yea I wouldn't hold out hope for Thrawn or Mara. Maybe Luke made the Jedi Order like of old, and made them celibate (a concept I find ironic when you're supposed to be connected to everything but you can't connect with anyone).

Others have criticized Lucas about this aspect of the Jedi code but he was using real-world ascetics as archetypes. Look into the rationale for why some monks take vows of celibacy and I think you'll see that it makes perfect sense for Jedi.

Yea I wouldn't hold out hope for Thrawn or Mara. Maybe Luke made the Jedi Order like of old, and made them celibate (a concept I find ironic when you're supposed to be connected to everything but you can't connect with anyone).

Others have criticized Lucas about this aspect of the Jedi code but he was using real-world ascetics as archetypes. Look into the rationale for why some monks take vows of celibacy and I think you'll see that it makes perfect sense for Jedi.

It's also a good reason for why the Jedi failed. They were too rigid, too set in their code and too detached from the people in the galaxy. I think that was a big point in the EU as well, I recall discussions between Luke and Mon Mothma about his setting up a new Jedi Order that touched on this and Luke dwelling a lot on this.

It's also a good reason for why the Jedi failed. They were too rigid, too set in their code and too detached from the people in the galaxy. I think that was a big point in the EU as well, I recall discussions between Luke and Mon Mothma about his setting up a new Jedi Order that touched on this and Luke dwelling a lot on this.

This is also touched on in the KotOR Era book Revan (a very good book BTW). It adds a lot of sense to why he Jedi Order slowly bloated and died. It was dead long before the Trade Federation blockaded Naboo and events were set in motion. The Order was run and staffed by hypocrites (love was both forbidden and a central tenet of their Order). Regrettably none of this shall ever be told, since it would mar the Jedi's status as "Ermegerd sooper good guys" that Disney will probably portray them as.

Well, the way I see it, Anakin's actions going to the dark side and wiping out both the Jedi order and eventually the Sith threat was him fulfilling the prophesy on bringing balance. Without his downfall, the Jedi counsel would be alive and well and just as broken. I agreed with Luke's decision to allow love and companionship back in the order. I felt as if it grounded Jedi to the very humanity they were trying to protect.

Deep stuff when you consider that Anakin's fall was fulfilling the prophesy, not failing it. Obi Wan's lament in Revenge was clouded by an organization that he had bought in too deeply to. Only time revealed that the Jedi were flawed and like some bones, needed re-breaking before they could truly heal.

But, you know, flying around little plastic spaceships is pretty cool too...

Yeah. There's a reason I like the novelizations of the prequals. I just wish they hadn't had Anakin kill the younglings. It really mars the whole tragic figure storyline with some clear evl versus just doing the right thing making him look like the badguy. If he'd been Sith for longer and the Dark Side had had more time to corrupt him I'd buy it more.

Regrettably none of this shall ever be told, since it would mar the Jedi's status as "Ermegerd sooper good guys" that Disney will probably portray them as.

Cut Disney some slack, they are very capable of dark stuff and always have.

I found the whole Jedi Council being portrayed as stuck up, incapable of change, arrogant organization very reminiscent of for instance the whole church thing in Dragonlance.

Or really just the biblical Pride goes before Destruction which has been adapted into dozens of stories where the protagonist is needed to rebuild and sometimes break. To bring back balance.

That's part of the blindness of the council by the way: if they thought Anakin was the one to bring balance to the force, couldn't they just have looked around and realized that the good guys seemed to be in the majority?

Agreed. It was what I found most interesting about the prequels. On the outside there was this utopian organization, but if it was so perfect, how did it crumble so easily and quickly? I seem to remember something about Jedi dwindling in numbers because of their rigid acceptance qualifications ('too old, yes, too old to begin the training'). Peace was their enemy.

That's part of the blindness of the council by the way: if they thought Anakin was the one to bring balance to the force, couldn't they just have looked around and realized that the good guys seemed to be in the majority?

Peace was their enemy.

Nah, not so much peace as too much focusing on the organization instead of what it was supposed to achieve. You see that in the Catholic Church as well, it was the reason for the Reformation, it is what the current Pope is trying to achieve, to go back to the people.

Fair enough. I'll give you that concerning the organization. I do believe peace did make them complacent and blind to the rising threat under their noses. Rust breaks blades more often than other steel.

Jedi are just magical space elves. .