Has this been discussed yet? I assume BC doesn't contain any of this. Has anybody come up with any of those yet? Any ideas - in particular for legions/warbands that are prominent in the Jericho Reach?

Alex

This is a great idea. We'd need chapter specific ones, plus a generic one (Legion?)

The tactics are supposed to be from the close working brotherhood of the astartes chapters. The chaos legions fractured and have troubles cooperating with eachother which is why black crusades are so rare.
An ultramarine sergeant would give his own life to save 4 squad mates. A chaos sergeant would sacrifice 4 teammates to save his own skin.

> "close brotherhood"

> Space Wolves, Flesh Tearers and Black Templars in the same squad

Sorry, couldn't resist. Squad Modes are a feature of the Deathwatch RPG - they feel a bit weird and don't really make a lot of sense, but since they're there, I can understand why they should be added to other forces of the game.

The tactics are supposed to be from the close working brotherhood of the astartes chapters. The chaos legions fractured and have troubles cooperating with eachother which is why black crusades are so rare.

An ultramarine sergeant would give his own life to save 4 squad mates. A chaos sergeant would sacrifice 4 teammates to save his own skin.

Alright, that rules out Soak Fire. It doesn't rule out a whole bunch of other stuff, especially attack patterns. And legions like the Word Bearers maintain certainly enough cohesion and intelligence to be able to muster a well-coordinated and vicious attack on a squad-level. Their specialty seems to be the ruthless advance.

> "close brotherhood"

> Space Wolves, Flesh Tearers and Black Templars in the same squad

Sorry, couldn't resist. Squad Modes are a feature of the Deathwatch RPG - they feel a bit weird and don't really make a lot of sense, but since they're there, I can understand why they should be added to other forces of the game.

I think they make a lot of sense - but the execution seems to be a bit flawed in that some things should be rather traits or talents (Wulf Senses, Feel No Pain) or less unrealistic (share reactions or even damage over 25 meters distance between brothers?).

They should have made a better distinction between physiology and philosophy of a chapter.

Alex

The home-brew Eldar rules give options for Squad Mode-like activities for specialist squads. Just as a point of reference.

Honestly a lot of Codex stuff is perfectly applicable to Chaos Marines. They still form brotherhoods and war bands, and aren't so completely stupid that they know if all their buddies die they can't accomplish their goals. Particularly groups like Alpha Legion have loyalty to other members like loyalists do. You can probably also steal loyalist modes for things that are particularly fitting.

Yeah and if we accept the more individualistic attitude of some CSM, that sounds like an extra Solo Mode!

The problem is that I don't find the Index Astartes articles on, for example, the Word Bearers very helpful in that regard. They have a doctrine of ruthless advance (in the open it seems) that has been apparently largely adopted by the Stigmartus. That's it. To me, that sounds more like an Attack Pattern. Or maybe a combination of both...

Attack Pattern (Word Bearers)

Action: Free Action

Cost: 1

Sustained: Yes

Must make an immediate Half Move directly towards the enemy (the only movement allowed this turn). May make an additional SIngle Shot attack while doing so.

Improvements: ?

Defensive Stance (Word Bearers)

Action: Free Action

Cost: 1

Sustained: Yes

Must make an immediate Half Move directly towards the enemy (the only movement allowed this turn). Immune to Pinning and Fear. Gets +10 Toughness and Willpower. Halves all damage. May not Dodge.

Improvements: ?

Not sure if it's balanced but the basic idea is that both abilities work together to form this relentless, fanatical advance in the open. The Warband may switch freely back and forth between modes as needed but each time it costs 1 Cohesion.

Alternatively, you make the ruthless advance a Defensive Stance and add a Furious Charge- or Bolter Assault-equivalent for Attack Pattern.

Alex

When I was running a game I was thinking about giving Word Bearers something like BoM Sororitas Faith Talents, obviously refluffed appropriately for their Chaos devotion.

Not a bad idea. Ah, I always tend to think of actual combat tactics when I look at Squad Modes...

Alex

> "close brotherhood"

> Space Wolves, Flesh Tearers and Black Templars in the same squad

Sorry, couldn't resist. Squad Modes are a feature of the Deathwatch RPG - they feel a bit weird and don't really make a lot of sense, but since they're there, I can understand why they should be added to other forces of the game.

Thats why you have so limited pool of cohesion. Its hinted that an unified chapter would have a lot more if not infinite amounts.

Thats why you have so limited pool of cohesion. Its hinted that an unified chapter would have a lot more if not infinite amounts.

Possibly, but the game doesn't make a distinction between the different Chapters, nor does it care for how mixing individuals from different Chapters might affect group cohesion, as opposed to a party from the same or a more "compatible" Chapter. I chose those more extreme examples for a reason!

In terms of game mechanics, the obvious explanation would be simplification. I suppose with a bit of handwaving you could also find an in-universe excuse in that the Marines seconded to the Deathwatch are all exemplary individuals who not only have no problem fighting side by side with brethren from a different Chapter, but who are also capable of adapting to their way of fighting. That is quite a feat, if you consider that it's not only a matter of conflicting Chapter cultures, but may even incorporate utterly alien (no pun intended) combat doctrines!

I know the RPG isn't exactly following the original DW fluff very closely, but the old White Dwarf #258 already contained a sort-of loophole in this regard that might be inspirational when looking for explanations concerning this matter:

"Deathwatch members are primarily volunteers from Space Marine Chapters that rigidly adhere to the Codex Astartes. Because teams are made up of battle brothers from several Chapters, it is essential they follow a similar doctrine. [...] In truth, the Deathwatch are recruited from all different Chapters including Space Wolves, Blood Angels, etc. However, the discipline and training of such individuals is legendary , so for this article we've only covered Codex Deathwatch - other Chapters with their own codexes get plenty of extras already!"

- Chapter Approved: Deathwatch Kill-teams

Anyways, don't take that remark up there too serious - it just thought it was funny as I immediately had to think of the more .. wayward Chapters when you mentioned "close brotherhood".

Back on topic, I found in the meantime this here:

http://community.fantasyflightgames.com/index.php?/topic/61257-dornian-heresy-deathwatch-work-in-progress/

I just need the time to work this through to see if anything can be extracted for use here. It might take me a while...

Alex