Ive only been playing a couple of months but I am already addicted, and yesterday I decided to stop playing low-ps multiple ships lists and branch out with some more "trick" pilots. So after watching episode IV (1977 version - yeah Im oldskool) earlier in the week, I'm up for having fun with Vader and two ties. Did my research and discover that the two ties are Backstabber and Mauler. So that's one crew sorted. Then I spend all the remaining points on carnor jax all souped up.

So I bring the gear along yesterday evening to have a game with a guy I don't know too well. And well assuming you read the title of this thread you can guess what happened.

All the fun I thought I was gonna have with Vader and Carnor dodging around (plus barrel-rolls with the ties) didn't happen. No dogfighting really, just being shot at with 360 degree turrents.

I thought this was a dogfighting game? He had loads of Ywings and a Mouldy Crow, ALL with turrets.

I wasn't expecting my list to be particularly competitive. I was going for a "cinematic" experience chiefly. But I DID expect to be dogfighting and having fun. :-(

It really took the shine off of the game.

Am I alone?

Those Turrets only work at range 1-2. They make the game different, but it can still be fun and dogfighty. He couldn't have had more than 3 Y-wings with a Hawk. Beyond that, I've never seen more than two Turrets in a game and Blaster Turrets are really easy to mess with.

Those Turrets only work at range 1-2. They make the game different, but it can still be fun and dogfighty. He couldn't have had more than 3 Y-wings with a Hawk. Beyond that, I've never seen more than two Turrets in a game and Blaster Turrets are really easy to mess with.

Especially when you have Carnor Jax around. Ions still hurt though.

Just focus fire and move to the next.....Ys and HWKs don't exactly evade well.

In this case you're definitely gonna wanna rush carnor right at them, out of primary arc. No focus tokens spent means no blaster turret for them, and the rest of your guys can focus fire and destroy them

Agree with everyone, Turrets suck but like they said, they can be managed well at least the small ship variety.

Just be glad you didn't run into a falcon, you cant stay out of range of his 360 arc

Just practice

When I play something new it may take a game or 2 to get the feel for it. How should I set up? Where should I place asteroids? How do I want to fly? Which formation? All this may not get figured out first game and also depends on what I'm up against

Learn from your mistakes

Think what you could have done better

Like other mention, get Jax right in their face action denial, and try to keep at max range.

The game is very well balanced, but the tie advanced is not very good, and well to be fair we saw how it ended for vader and his wing men in the movies

Lastly, four ships is pretty light for an imperial small base list, before phantoms and defenders. You would have had a hard time focusing down y's with so little offense. Next time you try that list get the other guy to run the three amigos, Luke Biggs and wedge, then you can have cinematic awesomness.

When what you want to run happens to run into what is just about the perfect thing to counter it the game isn't going to be a lot of fun. If X-Wing is like rock-paper-scissors you happen to throwing scissors at rock which doesn't end well.

There are things you can do to mitigate the turret advantage but that may require a playstyle you're not used to playing. I'm not entirely clear on the contents of each squadron but if you can poke away at R3 there isn't much turrets will do to you unless they happen to be the primary on a YT.

Don't forget that 4 ion turrets cost a total of 20 points. That is a whole ship. Also Ion turrets can't kill a ship very fast with only 1 damage a turn. I find Ion Turrets are more worth their points if you fully take advantage ion effect as well 360 turret. That means the turret is a suport weapon more than just a turret.

Oh and the blaster turret sucks.

I agree. Turrets take a lot of the fun out of flying interceptors. I went through a period where it seemed that every time I decided to fly elite interceptors, my opponent would field the Falcon. It sucked.

That's why I really like the idea used in the new Team Covenant tournament, where you have 2 squadrons and pick which to fly after seeing your opponent's 2 squadrons. If they have a Falcon, you can pull out you other squadron.

I agree. Turrets take a lot of the fun out of flying interceptors. I went through a period where it seemed that every time I decided to fly elite interceptors, my opponent would field the Falcon. It sucked.

That's why I really like the idea used in the new Team Covenant tournament, where you have 2 squadrons and pick which to fly after seeing your opponent's 2 squadrons. If they have a Falcon, you can pull out you other squadron.

It works the other way too. I found the falcon incredibly dull to fly the first time I used it because there was no real need to maneuver. Still do but not to as great an extent.

Well now that the imperial aces brings the royal guard upgrade card into play you can increase your squints durability by equipping hull and shield upgrades making them almost as durable as an xwing but with an extra evade. Technically they would be equal hit point wise with the hull and shield upgrade except crits will hurt quicker on a squint.

Y-wing and HWK turrets can be dealt with. The trick is to stay at Range 3, as they've only got Range 1-2 on them, and HWKs and Y-wings aren't particularly maneuverable anyway. Even easier with Barrel Roll. That's why I don't mind Ion and Blaster Turrets. They usually come on less maneuverable ships and they interact fairly well with the game's main mechanic of positioning. Skill still comes into fighting them. They've got a circular arc but its shorter than yours.

The YT has a Range 1-3 360 turret. Fighting can quickly become a game of rolling dice, which is just plain boring IMO. It could well be that I simply don't how how to apply skill fighting the Falcon though beyond sitting at Range 3 and crossing fingers and thus blame the game instead.

When what you want to run happens to run into what is just about the perfect thing to counter it the game isn't going to be a lot of fun. If X-Wing is like rock-paper-scissors you happen to throwing scissors at rock which doesn't end well.

Amen brother

Turrets are generally only mounted on low agility ships, it is part of what makes them viable as combat units, in the same way that high agility and Evade/Barrel Roll, etc... combine to make the TIE series viable. Different ships...different abilities/advantages/disadvantages... different tactics.

As Already mentioned, the Ion and Blaster turrets have rang limitations... they also have to be purchased with Squadron Build Points.

But, in a nut shell... They're here... they can be annoying... get used to it!

When what you want to run happens to run into what is just about the perfect thing to counter it the game isn't going to be a lot of fun. If X-Wing is like rock-paper-scissors you happen to throwing scissors at rock which doesn't end well.

Amen brother

Just need bigger scissors.

Or you just wait until someone throws papers paper and laugh maniacally at their misery!

CSB: I ran an Ion build in a tourney recently. What I didn't want to face (big ships and high agi ships - basical Firesprays and TIE/Ints) I faced in 3 of my 5 matches. But the very last match was against some B-wings. I walked two of them straight off the table.

I went 3-2 in the tournament and finished out of the prizes, but I got to crush some B-wings which is all that mattered.

Personally I think it's kinda tasteless to bring an all turret force. As much as it sounds good to "stay at range 3" it's also very impossible because your opponent will endeavor to bring you closer.

I think a turret (maybe 2) is a great equalizer against high mobility lists that would otherwise pick rebs apart, but going all in on them establishes that you are trying to win at the expense of your opponent's enjoyment. The community suffers when that becomes a list-building strategy.

I guess you could keep in mind that a turret force can be at a disadvantage to ships that can "take it" but deliver it back with more force. A turret ship may hit a B-Wing but then that B-Wing will still get to unload on the turret ship.

Thanks for the input everyone.

"they are here, get used to it" - I suppose this is pretty good advice!

"stay at range 3" - kinda awkward. You have to fly backwards to pull that one off really. On a 3x3 map you are either bombing away at full pelt then koigren turn getting one hit before getting shot as you run, or you are skirting the edge keeping away but not getting any shots in. Well thats how it seemed on the night. Believe me I was trying to stay at range 3 or further..

"you can deal with them" - well yes I can I suppose, and would have "dealt" with them a lot better with a more competitive list. But my point was not that I lost, but that the playing lost a lot of it's enjoyment.

I've had a lot of games that I have lost but were awesome fun none-the-less. This wasn't one of those games.

Seems to me that the game was designed a "dogfight in space" game. With turrents you are losing a big part of the game, the bit where you and your opponent are making decisions designed to outmanouver each other, to get shots where the other cannot or to get dice advantage.

"turrents make sucky ships more playable" - well I guess so. But the points system seems to be well balanced I think. A sucky ship might be just what your list needs to fulfil more overall "hull" or whatever. Tie fighters are rubbish. They are also cheap and 3 agility is awesome. Y wings might be rubbish, but you get a lot of ship for your points.

I have only played one tourney and didnt see anyone play such a list during that so it probably isnt that competitive - which means I wont have to endure it again very much.

This game is great because it is Star Wars (which is cool!) plus it is a fun game to play, whether you win or lose. I think I am complaining because Ive had a game that wasnt as fun as I am used to. Ok I'll stop complaining now.

The turrets in this game are balanced. I have no issues going up against a them, it just requires a change in tactics. First, all turrets but the YT only have a range of 1-2. While ships with a turret might be high on HP, they are low on agility. Focus fire will bring them down. Blaster turrets can't be used if the ship can't focus. There are many ways of denying this action.

Big ships and ships with poor maneuver dials are susceptable to asteroid placement. Become an expert at the asteroid placement strategy and you will notice a great improvement. No lanes, make the Ys and Falcons maneuver, don't let them just fly lazy circles and blast at you all day!! And learn to barrel roll though the asteroid gaps, make them follow you for a while and get hung up on obstacles...

Personally I think it's kinda tasteless to bring an all turret force....

...going all in on them establishes that you are trying to win at the expense of your opponent's enjoyment. The community suffers when that becomes a list-building strategy.

I can see your point, because personally I feel the same way about no name tie swarm lists. On the other hand, some people might actually enjoy fielding these lists and it fits their idea of what the game should be.

OP, there is some good advice as how to deal with turrets, but basically, there is no easy button against them. The best advice I saw was to make them fly through asteroids and other traffic. People who fly turrets (myself included) can get lazy with the maneuver dials and this leads to mistakes.