Hi all,

While working through a slow day, I began thinking of how I got into WH40k. Years ago, I somehow stumbled onto the table top skirmish game, Necromunda. I'm sure most of you have heard of it. For those who haven't, it is a model-based skirmish game set in the Underhives of the Hive world Necromunda. Players are in control of gangs made up of a handful of members, who duke it out over territory and all.

My friend and I couldn't make heads nor tails of the rules on our own and gave up the game. I played a little WH40k table top with a friend all last year, and he got me into Only War.

To make a long story short, I made a connection between Necromunda and Only War. The more I thought about it, the more I realized Necromunda could quite easily be adapted to Only War. Players could either be members of a gang, or run different gangs; the comrade system would work well for NPC gang members; territories could be house-ruled, or adapted from RT colonies perhaps?

Anyways, what do you guys think? It could be a fun change from the restricted battlefields of the Imperial Guard Astra Militarium. I don't think the house rules would really require much work, either.

Absolutely!

I think someone actually already did this, but I'm not sure. Either way, I know this idea has several supporters here.

Necromunda ftw!

Do you know what section of the forums it's been discussed? I would be interested to see what work has been done.

Apologies, my memory can be quite a bit leaky. I would suspect either this general discussion forum, or the house rules section! Maaaybe the GM board, but that'd be less likely. This is just taking a guess, mind you!

Someone else might remember better.

I recall it having been about some file on google docs, which I was unable to view at the time as I still refrain from creating a google+ account.

The only real change you'd have to make it to remove the regimental standard gear, and maybe give the players the option of having an autogun. It might be worth changing the requisition mechanics to hard currency, but that might take a lot of work without some Dark Heresy material.

That's the thing - there's enough material in DH and RT that could be borrowed for the "campaign" portion of the game to make it work. I just can't seem to find anything on the forums about it being done before!

Even if it has been done before, don't let that stop you from making it yourself. It actually seems like a fairly easy conversion. Remember to share it when you're done

I've actually been running a game (on hiatus now), using a hybrid of OW and BC, with the PCs as underhive gangers / hired guns. It's been fun.

Some of the DH stuff I've run have been so inspired by Necromunda we decided to just forget about the inquisition.

The only real change you'd have to make it to remove the regimental standard gear, and maybe give the players the option of having an autogun. It might be worth changing the requisition mechanics to hard currency, but that might take a lot of work without some Dark Heresy material.

I hate hard currency in Dark Heresy , but it would definitely be the way to go for an acquiring-loot-based game like a Necromunda rpg. Just change 'Throne Gelt' to 'Guilder Credits' and you are good to go.

I ad been pondering the mechanics of a necromunda conversion along the lines of BCs classless system and OWs base mechanics.

My solution for guilder credits issue was the whole thing could be abstracted as a logistics style trading skill representing both raw wealth and shady connections. of course you could just use this skill as a method of "finding" the items and then pay with tracked hard creds.

Also as with my old semi-abandoned Inquisimunda project I`d champion the idea of playing scummers not house affiliated gangers that way you haveno pre-defined bosses or status and can accept jobs freelance or undertake tasks of your own devising.

The only real change you'd have to make it to remove the regimental standard gear, and maybe give the players the option of having an autogun. It might be worth changing the requisition mechanics to hard currency, but that might take a lot of work without some Dark Heresy material.

I hate hard currency in Dark Heresy , but it would definitely be the way to go for an acquiring-loot-based game like a Necromunda rpg. Just change 'Throne Gelt' to 'Guilder Credits' and you are good to go.

Simplified system like the Profit Factor seems to work with Rogue Trader so I'm not sure if the system would need hard currency for requisition.

After all, much like in Rogue Trader the gang needs a steady supply of income to cover running costs such as food, guns and ammo (not to mention paychecks and booze and wenches for the gang members.) Wether the credits comes in form of protection money from businesses or some illegal trade that they've taken over it needs to be a steady supply or the gang needs to go robbing consistently for the money. (I always assumed that Necromunda fights were about controlling the territory more than anything else. Any extra loot is just a bonus.)

The only real change you'd have to make it to remove the regimental standard gear, and maybe give the players the option of having an autogun. It might be worth changing the requisition mechanics to hard currency, but that might take a lot of work without some Dark Heresy material.

I hate hard currency in Dark Heresy , but it would definitely be the way to go for an acquiring-loot-based game like a Necromunda rpg. Just change 'Throne Gelt' to 'Guilder Credits' and you are good to go.

Simplified system like the Profit Factor seems to work with Rogue Trader so I'm not sure if the system would need hard currency for requisition.

After all, much like in Rogue Trader the gang needs a steady supply of income to cover running costs such as food, guns and ammo (not to mention paychecks and booze and wenches for the gang members.) Wether the credits comes in form of protection money from businesses or some illegal trade that they've taken over it needs to be a steady supply or the gang needs to go robbing consistently for the money. (I always assumed that Necromunda fights were about controlling the territory more than anything else. Any extra loot is just a bonus.)

I thought of doing it as a Profit Factor sort of deal, as if I recall correctly, that's kind of how it was handled in Necromunda? It was either that or influence or something. Either way, it would work out. The question then is how would the gangs work? As regiments? There would also be the weapon lists, as each gang had a different set of weapons and items that were favored.

As for making the conversion, I would love to as it would move away from the restricted, battlefield and rules of engagement sort of thing present in Only War. Finals and all are coming up, so when summer hits, I might work on it as a project.

It was guilder credits, as Adeptus-B mentioned, and the pool was simply called "cash reserve" or "stash".

That being said, of course this doesn't mean this has to be transplanted into an OW mod the exact same way.

Personally, I could see it working both with hard currency on a per-person basis, as well as with a group/gang stash similar to Profit Factor.

I'd say which of these options is chosen should depend on whether you want to make this Necromunda RPG focus on the characters as individual gangers low in the foodchain (perhaps beginning as juves, but with the option of working their way up), or as leaders/lieutenants of their own gang section right from the start, where they not only get to run "missions" within the Underhive but also decide about administrative issues, with a side order of diplomacy and economy.

I've tried running my game using Influence/Profit Factor simply because I find counting coins boring. Unfortunately, it hasn't worked terribly well. It simply doesn't "feel" right and seems to give them a lot more resources than a rag-tag group of underhive scum should have.

I've tried running my game using Influence/Profit Factor simply because I find counting coins boring. Unfortunately, it hasn't worked terribly well. It simply doesn't "feel" right and seems to give them a lot more resources than a rag-tag group of underhive scum should have.

Yeah, hording coins is an artifact of D&D that doesn't work well in non-treasure-hunting rpgs, but one of the themes in Necromunda is 'more money = more guns = more power', so I think hard currency would work best here.

I had been pondering the mechanics of a necromunda conversion along the lines of BCs classless system and OWs base mechanics.

My solution for guilder credits issue was the whole thing could be abstracted as a logistics style trading skill representing both raw wealth and shady connections. of course you could just use this skill as a method of "finding" the items and then pay with tracked hard creds.

Also as with my old semi-abandoned Inquisimunda project I`d champion the idea of playing scummers not house affiliated gangers that way you have no pre-defined bosses or status and can accept jobs freelance or undertake tasks of your own devising.

Sorry for the self quote but nobody even acknowledged these points and I felt they help resolve the currency/abstract mechanic issue that is still being discusssed by removing the complication of income from of a pre-existing gang structure.

Isn't this exactly how it was done in Dark Heresy? I'd have to take another look at the books, but I thought there was a skill for helping with Availability of items.

As for playing Scum ... it's just not an idea I'd be a fan of. Yes, you would have more potential for diversity, but I feel that a setting like Necromunda just screams "gangs!", and it'd be a shame not to make use of it. The whole culture and the turf wars are something where Scum could at best participate as a bystander rather than getting truly immersed in it.

That's just my opinion, tho! When looking at Necromunda, I'm thinking Orlock, Escher, and Arbites. Scummers would be the last thing on my mind - although I do believe it'd be possible to offer them as a Specialist class, similar to Storm Troopers in OW. I'm sure the "never staying too long in one place" bit can be worked around.

Sorry for the self quote but nobody even acknowledged these points and I felt they help resolve the currency/abstract mechanic issue that is still being discusssed by removing the complication of income from of a pre-existing gang structure.

I'm sure your system is functional, Askil- we're mostly debating 'taste' here. Both abstract and hard currency are viable options, it's just a question of 'tone'. I hate hard currency in Dark Heresy because it tends to turn PCs into money-grubbing looters first and agents of the Holy Ordos of the Inquisition second , and personal wealth becomes a disproportionate component of combat power. In Necromunda , however, that's exactly the effect I want- greedy gangers who would slit your throat just to use your pocket change to buy one more bullet!

As for playing Scum ... it's just not an idea I'd be a fan of... When looking at Necromunda, I'm thinking Orlock, Escher, and Arbites. Scummers would be the last thing on my mind...

In DH terms, Orlocks and Eschers would be Scummers! That's what the 'Gang Lord' branch of the Scum Rank progression is supposed to represent. That said, I wouldn't be interested in having a single Career option in an all-gang-based game. Having each House have their own set of Aptitudes, plus other Aptitudes of Specialties (Ganger, Heavy).

Should Juvies be considered Comrades, or should that be a PC option...?

Scum can be gangers in DH, but that's just because there the career is meant to be so open that you can interpret a ton of different things into it, and Scum would be the best option. Similar to how Guardsman is the career you pick if you want to play a Feral World barbarian.

From the Necromunda book:

"Underhive Scum, or Scummers, prefer the carefree, wandering life of a mercenary to that of a ganger. They travel from town to town, making few friends or commitments, earning whatever easy money is around before moving on. Scum are too wild and independent to submit to the leadership of anyone for very long, and they hire out their services as they feel like it. Despite their carefree lifestyle and happy-go-lucky attitude, Scummers are good fighters, so their services are always in demand. Many end up working for the Guilders, but there are always a few willing to tag along with a gang for a share of the spoils."

In an actual Necromunda RPG, however, I'd expect the different careers to be somewhat more nuanced!

Perhaps something like this:

HIRED GUNS (Specialists)

Ratskin Scout

Scum (<- could later progress into Bounty Hunter?)

... at first I thought about a progression from Juve to Ganger, in order to offer some sort of advancement for the player characters, but since this is also a bit of an age thing it might feel weird. Besides, young age or rather an age difference can also be an interesting aspect of a character concept. So instead, how about making Juves more useful? They might get a penalty in their combat stats, but perhaps their younger age makes them more agile, granting them a speed/mobility bonus? Maybe making them harder to hit? They could also be useful for various non-combat actions such as stealing, sneaking or eavesdropping, and get some sort of "I know a guy who knows a guy" perk. You know, like those cliché newspaper-selling boys from the Chicago gangster movies.

In this light, I'd favour making Juves both Comrades and PCs - in that the PC is simply an unusually talented or already experienced Juve. Or should Comrades be normal Gangers? Or make this something people can "upgrade" by spending XP? (spend XP to increase your Comrade, at the risk of losing him/her in a fight)

Scum can be gangers in DH, but that's just because there the career is meant to be so open that you can interpret a ton of different things into it, and Scum would be the best option. Similar to how Guardsman is the career you pick if you want to play a Feral World barbarian.

From the Necromunda book:

"Underhive Scum, or Scummers, prefer the carefree, wandering life of a mercenary to that of a ganger. They travel from town to town, making few friends or commitments, earning whatever easy money is around before moving on. Scum are too wild and independent to submit to the leadership of anyone for very long, and they hire out their services as they feel like it. Despite their carefree lifestyle and happy-go-lucky attitude, Scummers are good fighters, so their services are always in demand. Many end up working for the Guilders, but there are always a few willing to tag along with a gang for a share of the spoils."

In an actual Necromunda RPG, however, I'd expect the different careers to be somewhat more nuanced!

Perhaps something like this:

GANGERS

Juve

Ganger

Heavy

Leader

HIRED GUNS (Specialists)

Ratskin Scout

Scum (<- could later progress into Bounty Hunter?)

... at first I thought about a progression from Juve to Ganger, in order to offer some sort of advancement for the player characters, but since this is also a bit of an age thing it might feel weird. Besides, young age or rather an age difference can also be an interesting aspect of a character concept. So instead, how about making Juves more useful? They might get a penalty in their combat stats, but perhaps their younger age makes them more agile, granting them a speed/mobility bonus? Maybe making them harder to hit? They could also be useful for various non-combat actions such as stealing, sneaking or eavesdropping, and get some sort of "I know a guy who knows a guy" perk. You know, like those cliché newspaper-selling boys from the Chicago gangster movies.

In this light, I'd favour making Juves both Comrades and PCs - in that the PC is simply an unusually talented or already experienced Juve. Or should Comrades be normal Gangers? Or make this something people can "upgrade" by spending XP? (spend XP to increase your Comrade, at the risk of losing him/her in a fight)

I think that provides us with the best approach, in that there are two different ways the game could be played. Players could be house-affiliated gangs, fighting for turf and reputation, or a group of scum who wander from town to town, picking up work where they can.

As for the currency, I think hard currency fits the Necromunda setting and spirit of the game the best. Skills could very well come into play, making things cheaper/easier to find, but quantified wealth is best for these poor sons of guns. Maybe something like an Influence/Reputation pool could be used like Profit Factor?

Juves present an interesting question. They would work well as NPCs, comrades, and players. They seem to make up a portion of every gang, as they are the new recruits and are pretty important, especially if your turnover rate is pretty high. What if players/comrades/NPCs all start as juves, but once they reach a certain level of XP (500? 1000?) they can branch out into a ganger, heavy, or leader?

What if players/comrades/NPCs all start as juves, but once they reach a certain level of XP (500? 1000?) they can branch out into a ganger, heavy, or leader?

That's what I was thinking about first (treating Juve more as a title or "Renown Level" rather than a class), but this would come with a few potential issues:

• Players could no longer play specific "Juve characters" if it's something they are supposed to level out of
• It'd become necessary to alter OW's ruleset by creating a branching tree for career ascension
• At first, your leader would have to be an NPC (unless we disregard class requirements, and treat the entire team as a sort of "Juve squad" with one of their own - the toughest/strongest/meanest - as leader)

I kind of like the idea of people having the option of playing a 14-16 year old brat amongst a group of older gangers, but at the same time I also see the appeal in using Juves as a progress level for everyone. To be honest, I think both ways would be fun - they simply offer different advantages each. Which makes it so hard to choose!

What if players/comrades/NPCs all start as juves, but once they reach a certain level of XP (500? 1000?) they can branch out into a ganger, heavy, or leader?

That's what I was thinking about first (treating Juve more as a title or "Renown Level" rather than a class), but this would come with a few potential issues:

• Players could no longer play specific "Juve characters" if it's something they are supposed to level out of
• It'd become necessary to alter OW's ruleset by creating a branching tree for career ascension
• At first, your leader would have to be an NPC (unless we disregard class requirements, and treat the entire team as a sort of "Juve squad" with one of their own - the toughest/strongest/meanest - as leader)

I kind of like the idea of people having the option of playing a 14-16 year old brat amongst a group of older gangers, but at the same time I also see the appeal in using Juves as a progress level for everyone. To be honest, I think both ways would be fun - they simply offer different advantages each. Which makes it so hard to choose!

They could continue to play Juves, just not choosing to become gangers, heavies, and leaders. Obviously this would have to be balanced, and there would have to be some advantages for continuing as a Juve.

As for the rewriting, this branching could just use the system found in Hammer of the Emperor (which is what I had in mind) to be offered different specializations at an XP level.

They could continue to play Juves, just not choosing to become gangers, heavies, and leaders. Obviously this would have to be balanced, and there would have to be some advantages for continuing as a Juve.

Sure, but that'd still renege on the age difference, which would be the main "non-mechanical" trait for this option...

It was just an idea (born largely of the mental image of such a mixed group - which I am sure follows some sort of Hollywood cliché), but for the moment I actually like it.

As for the rewriting, this branching could just use the system found in Hammer of the Emperor (which is what I had in mind) to be offered different specializations at an XP level.

Oh! There is already something like that in an OW book? Well, in that case ...

(provided ownership of that book is not necessary to understand how it works, of course - just having the core rules should, ideally, be enough for a mod like this)

I see your point. Juves don't necessarily have to be young, though! But it does provide some interesting questions. Maybe they get stealth bonuses, and are a "thief" or "rogue" type that a player could take? I know in my group, no one will really want to be a Juve, instead picking a Heavy or a Ganger.

An interesting thought just came to mind: What if players are given a set amount of points/money to hire gang members (themselves) and to purchase starting equipment? That way it stops everyone from starting as a Heavy with a heavy stubber, instead choosing best how to outfit everyone in a fair way.