The defender isn't really a ship that you make a squad out of it is one you make a squad around . It is the opposite of the shuttle and HWK of wave 3, it doesn't support, it needs to be supported. But when it is...

Couldn't agree more. For the doubters try out this list...

Howl w/ PTL and Stealth

Detla w/ HLC and Stealth

3x AP

Very ANGRY list.

So angry.

I might try something just a little bit different. I've never benefitted from PtL on Howlrunner. It's best when there are more actions available to a ship, but you don't want Engine Upgrade on her cuz she'll break the swarm.

Suggestion: Drop the PtL and Stealth Device. Give Howlrunner Wingman, and then Upgrade one Academy to Black Squadron with Wingman. This allows the entire squadron to K-turn to its heart's content. Your lack of focus could cause problems occasionally, but you will still be buffed by Howlrunner.

I went with PTL on Howl just so she can Focus and Evade every turn with 4 defense dice. All day. Every day. I may have to take an in depth look at your suggestions and One thing I was thinking about doing was dropping the Stealth devices for a Black with Wingman. Decisions decisions.

The defender isn't really a ship that you make a squad out of it is one you make a squad around . It is the opposite of the shuttle and HWK of wave 3, it doesn't support, it needs to be supported. But when it is...

Couldn't agree more. For the doubters try out this list...

Howl w/ PTL and Stealth

Detla w/ HLC and Stealth

3x AP

Very ANGRY list.

The opponent would almost certainly be best off killing the Academies first. Howlrunner is only buffing 4 ships max. Kill an Academy or two in the first round before they get to even shoot, and she's only buffing 2-3 ships even in the first round. The TIE Defender is the tankiest ship there relative to its damage output (even with HLC), so save it for last.

That's kind of what you hope to end the game. In the end you want a clean Defender vs 1 or 2 pretty damaged ships at range 3. But to each their own. So far its been pretty effective.

I'm seeing a lot of people complaining about the predictability of the Defender's maneuver dial in this thread so far, and I feel the need to address a few things.

At first, I was in agreement. The multitude of red turns makes it seem to an opponent that yes, it is very likely to just take that white kiogran whenever possible. However, after thinking about it the idea occurs to me that the TIE Defender is indeed predictable...

… if you keep dogging the same target.

In my experience, I have thrown opponents off the most when I use the 3 bank. It is very good for being somewhere significantly different than an opponent thought you would end up, while at the same time offering you very different target options in one round than you had the round previous. On a boost capable ship (since the Defender comes with Engine Upgrade) you can power straight up the line and land a single heavy hit against an opponent, then zip clear on through the fray and target someone completely different. Allow your cheaper or more turn-capable ships engage the remainder of the HP left to whoever you just railed. TIEs, Interceptors, or even a Bomber who brought up the rear with some heavy ordinance. Fly the Defender in an "I'll set 'em up, you knock 'em down" mentality.

This however, goes against the swarm mentality ingrained in a lot of players: aim all your ships at one target, shoot that, move on to the next.

I would describe a swarm mentality as the mindset that all ships should do the same thing at the same time, whereas all the ships have their different roles and a squad should utilize different ships to the best of their ability.

A Defender is a heavy hitter, use something else to clean up after him. That could be a bomber throwing a missile at it, a few TIEs, a shuttle in command & support or a sniping Kir Kanos from the edges, there's a whole lot of options, that's what makes it fun. And even if they take out the support, there's still that Defender to deal with.

Also, you could probably run a decent Phantom as well. Imagine a round in which both of these bad boys focus on a single target, with a low skill TIE Fighter in the mix for that "light-tap to round it off" KO.

2 defenders with HLC and jonus could be fun. Might have to put engines on Jonus to keep up though.

I'm sure it's got drawbacks, but I've wanted Jonus supporting 2 HLC's for a while and the shuttles are hard to maneuver in pairs.

Triple Trips in a 100-point game... I'm drooling already; it'll be one heck of a fun match.

The Americans will never win the war with piston engine fighters ....

Of course not. They'll give said fighter to the British, who'll fit it with a proper piston engine.

... You have a Spitfire in mind, I guess?

... the Bf109 will always triumpf ...

hrhrhrhrrrrrr ....

... not

The F4U Corsair would like to have words with you two gentleman....

Triple Trips in a 100-point game... I'm drooling already; it'll be one heck of a fun match.

And this is not a MLP thing.

Three with Hull/Stealth/Ion and go!

Three with Hull/Stealth/Ion and go!

If you want to make your opponents to play 117 points ...

Three with Hull/Stealth/Ion and go!

If you want to make your opponents to play 117 points ...

Three with Hull/Stealth/Ion and go!

If you want to make your opponents to play 117 points ...

Hull OR Stealth OR Ion Cannon.

3 x 33pts

I don't see a problem with the Defender overshooting, turning around and coming back to strike again. Maybe that's predictable, but if you mix the defender with other crafts than the opponent has to decide - hunt the "predictable" defender and get some love from its partners (that did not overshoot), or fight those and get to the defender later. Of course the opponent could split, but I don't worry about a single ship going after the defender.

Whatever he decides, the opponent will not have the easy game that all defender critics seem to see here. I will use it a lot when it's around, just to see how I can get it working best - I can see it together with an Interceptor or two, or maybe with a phantom and some TIE Fighters... many options here, new tactics coming up.

The Defender with an Ion Cannon is a scary proposition. You do not go head to head with a Defender with an Ion Cannon. Unless you enjoy a unstressed Defender taking a shot at you from behind.

Well, that's the best thing that could come out of the Defender: more jinking and juking, zigging and zagging

Wave 4 is gunna add a lot of options for list diversity for the Empire and the Defender is gunna be a potent addition to our arsenal.

I forsee Wave 4 bringing more mixed lists, similar to multi-ship type lists for the Rebels, to the Empires side of the board as opposed to "pick one - spam it" that often is the norm.

Vessery

2xBSP+TC

RG+PTL+TC

For example.

Could be fun

The Defender with an Ion Cannon is a scary proposition. You do not go head to head with a Defender with an Ion Cannon. Unless you enjoy a unstressed Defender taking a shot at you from behind.

Yeah,

I see myself using the Defender as a "core ship" around which to build a list a LOT more often than I fly a triplet of them.

But three Defenders with an Ion Cannon?

That is something which will force virtually any list but a swarm to break and run from the "joust".

At which point player skill and ability to read your opponent starts mattering a LOT more than your list.

Though, still, Hull or Stealth Device both offer interesting "3 up" options for the Defender as well.

They are already tough, you add some MORE toughness and it's going to get HARD to chew through them before they do the same to you.

But three Defenders with an Ion Cannon?

That is something which will force virtually any list but a swarm to break and run from the "joust".

Even a typical swarm could struggle; it's going to take a couple of turns of focused fire for 2 Attack, even with Howlrunner's buff, to bring down a Defender. And that focused fire is going to be a lot harder with 1-2 TIEs in the swarm ionized, since in the hands of a typical player TIE swarms start to break down when they lose formation. Throw in some intelligent asteroid placement, and the swarm is in for a rotten match.