You mean if he uses his own TL action, his ability works like a FCS?

Well effectively his ability works like FCS as long as someone on your side has that ship TL'ed already. Doesn't matter if it's him or some other ship.

I wish they can take the evade token out of the preview...

Perhaps someone put that evade token on the table by mistake. It's not like they'd take a new picture for each article they do. But if I were FFG. I'd do something like that every 10th ship or so just to mess with people.

"Hah! they're still trying to figure out why that evade token is there..."

Ok.. this has been bothering me.. could we be missing something.

The way hos ability is written... can he aquire on his own TL'd ship... it doesn't specify another ships.. just a ship TL'd

Just a thought I had... I could be off, for various and many reasons...

But.. the way its worded.. makes me wonder..

Ahm ... good question ...

You mean if he uses his own TL action, his ability works like a FCS?

Yes, that's exactly what I mean..

Vanor... not sure if you're pulling my leg or I'm missing your point.. lol.. not sure yet..

Ok.. this has been bothering me.. could we be missing something.

The way hos ability is written... can he aquire on his own TL'd ship... it doesn't specify another ships.. just a ship TL'd

Just a thought I had... I could be off, for various and many reasons...

But.. the way its worded.. makes me wonder..

You can't acquire a target lock on a ship you already have locked (FAQ relating to Dutch).

So if Vessery has his own lock, you can't re-lock it (and wouldn't need to anyway). If you spend Vessery's lock (say for a missile) then his red token is already gone, and can't trigger his own ability. If someone else has a lock, he'll gain one on the defender.

It's better than FCS, because it happens after dice, and before modification. Basically, if Vessery fires on something that someone else has locked, it's like he's locked on it too.

It's a nifty ability in isolation, but I think that in practice it's going to be very hard to leverage. I can MAYBE see a shuttle with ST-321 and Weapons Engineer, as it could give him the lock he wants with minimal coordination and without having to really give up its own opportunities. But that's an awful expensive addition.

Uhm, yes, Rexler is easily top 5.

I'd agree, with luck he could one shot A-Wings and Z-95's at range 3, could one shot a E-Wing at range 1, and even if it doesn't happen real often, it's still something the rebel player has to keep in mind.

Plus with 3 Shield, 3 Hull and 3 Defense the Defender is very survivable, especially for a imperial ship.

Couldn't you say the same though, for him? At best he could get one shot by Wedge, with Outmaneuver if shot at range 1 outside his shooting arc. I don't think there is a "Top 5", he will be good or he won't be based on the game he is played. His white k-turn and green straights could be his Achilles heel. The dial is pretty limited for such a powerful fighter, honestly.

If he gets stressed, he has to have a someone with Wingman to remove the stress. Maybe you could bring the Shuttle Pilot who can remove it, but that means limiting Rexlar's movement either way. So that leaves you with what he will be doing, he has to do a straight to get rid of stress, predictable. He has to make large/wide/slow turns in order to avoid getting stress from a 1/2 hard turn. Using the K-turn too much could prove to be bad, just because if people understand when he will use it? They just need to time the right movements to avoid him.

I think he will shine in the Epic play scene, given the larger point base. Plus in dealing with the bigger Rebel ships, he can do some nasty damage with his effect. Just think about hit, he gets past the shields on the Rebel Transport. Spends a focus token and BAM! He flips one up and just done..it ends the transport. I fear to see him leading Tie Fighters in the Epic Play.

Isn't in the rules that you can't have more than 1 Target Locks (unless you have weapons engineer)? So, I think he can't do it by himself.

edit: I was too late. Ninja'ed!

Ok.. this has been bothering me.. could we be missing something.

The way hos ability is written... can he aquire on his own TL'd ship... it doesn't specify another ships.. just a ship TL'd

Just a thought I had... I could be off, for various and many reasons...

But.. the way its worded.. makes me wonder..

Suppose Vessery has a TL on some ship in his arc. He declares the ship he's locking as his target and rolls attack dice. His ability is triggered, because he's attacking a ship that has a red target lock token--but he can't get a new lock on the same target (FAQ page 2, bottom left), so it doesn't do him any good.

[EDIT: Ninja'ed by Buhallin.]

Vanor... not sure if you're pulling my leg or I'm missing your point.. lol.. not sure yet..

I think you missed my point, or I'm just making poorly worded posts. Have a headache so maybe not as coherent as I normally am.

So... I did try again but it's already been said better then I can.

Couldn't you say the same though, for him? At best he could get one shot by Wedge, with Outmaneuver if shot at range 1 outside his shooting arc. I don't think there is a "Top 5", he will be good or he won't be based on the game he is played. His white k-turn and green straights could be his Achilles heel. The dial is pretty limited for such a powerful fighter, honestly.

There's a bit of a difference between "Attacking an A-wing" and "Getting shot at by Wedge with Outmaneuver who's put himself outside your arc". For extra bonus fun throw in an APT with Jan.

There are combos which present risk to ANY fighter. Rexler seems to do it all by himself.

After looking at this and thinking it over, Brath is best used with Predator.

Focus as his action, then reroll a die as needed, then burn the focus for the flip. If you inflict no damage, then you have a focus for defense.

Ok.. this has been bothering me.. could we be missing something.

The way hos ability is written... can he aquire on his own TL'd ship... it doesn't specify another ships.. just a ship TL'd

Just a thought I had... I could be off, for various and many reasons...

But.. the way its worded.. makes me wonder..

You can't acquire a target lock on a ship you already have locked (FAQ relating to Dutch).

So if Vessery has his own lock, you can't re-lock it (and wouldn't need to anyway). If you spend Vessery's lock (say for a missile) then his red token is already gone, and can't trigger his own ability. If someone else has a lock, he'll gain one on the defender.

It's better than FCS, because it happens after dice, and before modification. Basically, if Vessery fires on something that someone else has locked, it's like he's locked on it too.

It's a nifty ability in isolation, but I think that in practice it's going to be very hard to leverage. I can MAYBE see a shuttle with ST-321 and Weapons Engineer, as it could give him the lock he wants with minimal coordination and without having to really give up its own opportunities. But that's an awful expensive addition.

However, to me, I feel the FCS is better. Vessery's ability is situational and can't trigger it himself, but with FCS, there's always a guarantee of target lock.

And the E-wing have a systems slot and a droid slot... hm... let's see what's the dial of the E-wing is compared to the Defender.

Ok.. this has been bothering me.. could we be missing something.

The way hos ability is written... can he aquire on his own TL'd ship... it doesn't specify another ships.. just a ship TL'd

Just a thought I had... I could be off, for various and many reasons...

But.. the way its worded.. makes me wonder..

You can't acquire a target lock on a ship you already have locked (FAQ relating to Dutch).

So if Vessery has his own lock, you can't re-lock it (and wouldn't need to anyway). If you spend Vessery's lock (say for a missile) then his red token is already gone, and can't trigger his own ability. If someone else has a lock, he'll gain one on the defender.

It's better than FCS, because it happens after dice, and before modification. Basically, if Vessery fires on something that someone else has locked, it's like he's locked on it too.

It's a nifty ability in isolation, but I think that in practice it's going to be very hard to leverage. I can MAYBE see a shuttle with ST-321 and Weapons Engineer, as it could give him the lock he wants with minimal coordination and without having to really give up its own opportunities. But that's an awful expensive addition.

I get all that, and understand what you're getting at.. it was just provocative...

This game is all about wording on these cards, this is why I was intrigued...

Thanks for the input, it is good for the mental exercise.

Predator is good with him. I think Vorpal made the point earlier that PtL will be bad on the Defender because of the lack of green to respond to the stress, otherwise he'd be a natural candidate for the TL/F.

Other options I can think of:

- Give him PtL anyway and rely on Yorr or Wingman

- Jendon (bad, but an option)

- Squad Leader (on someone like Vader, not Rexler himself)

Couldn't you say the same though, for him? At best he could get one shot by Wedge, with Outmaneuver if shot at range 1 outside his shooting arc.

Wedge is going to roll at most 4 dice, so even if a Defender is reduced to 0 defense die, Wedge still can't one shot him, because it takes 3 of the 4 dice just to remove the Defenders shields. Wedge would have to roll 5 dice, score 2 hits, with one of those hits being a direct hit! and the Defender would have to roll all blanks.

Edit: Perhaps I didn't understand... Were you talking about Wedge killing a Defender with one shoot, or Wedge being able to one shot a A-Wing?

Uhm, yes, Rexler is easily top 5.

I'd agree, with luck he could one shot A-Wings and Z-95's at range 3, could one shot a E-Wing at range 1, and even if it doesn't happen real often, it's still something the rebel player has to keep in mind.

Plus with 3 Shield, 3 Hull and 3 Defense the Defender is very survivable, especially for a imperial ship.

Couldn't you say the same though, for him? At best he could get one shot by Wedge, with Outmaneuver if shot at range 1 outside his shooting arc. I don't think there is a "Top 5", he will be good or he won't be based on the game he is played. His white k-turn and green straights could be his Achilles heel. The dial is pretty limited for such a powerful fighter, honestly.

If he gets stressed, he has to have a someone with Wingman to remove the stress. Maybe you could bring the Shuttle Pilot who can remove it, but that means limiting Rexlar's movement either way. So that leaves you with what he will be doing, he has to do a straight to get rid of stress, predictable. He has to make large/wide/slow turns in order to avoid getting stress from a 1/2 hard turn. Using the K-turn too much could prove to be bad, just because if people understand when he will use it? They just need to time the right movements to avoid him.

I think he will shine in the Epic play scene, given the larger point base. Plus in dealing with the bigger Rebel ships, he can do some nasty damage with his effect. Just think about hit, he gets past the shields on the Rebel Transport. Spends a focus token and BAM! He flips one up and just done..it ends the transport. I fear to see him leading Tie Fighters in the Epic Play.

I'd put Howlrunner, Fel, Vader, Turr, Backstabber (at point cost), and the Vanilla Royal guard before him before we even start thinking about him. Jax might make a splash. Whisper will likely land in that top 5 at the same time. An ability based on 3 ifs is pretty conditional (If you hit/they don't evade, if you have a focus/don't spend your focus, if they have no shields); at that cost I think we'd want a more consistent ability.

However, to me, I feel the FCS is better. Vessery's ability is situational and can't trigger it himself, but with FCS, there's always a guarantee of target lock.

I think it depends on the ship. FCS has the disadvantage of having to wait until the next turn to yield any benefits. We'll have to see how it plays, but I think the poor turns on the Defender are going to make it very hard to stay on a single target. I see it more as something that's going to have to work for targets of opportunity.

Although FCS might actually be a very good choice on a ship SUPPORTING Vessery. It would remove the predictive need, and let you choose any target as long as it was in both arcs. Kagi, Jendon, and Whisper would all seem to have very good potential for that.

Predator will become a staple in what I like to call the infinite Flechette Torpedo on the Firespray (or B-Wing once it gets a crew slot).

Fire Flechette, award stress

Reroll 1 or 2 hits/crits with Predator, trying not to hit

Munitions Failsafe to keep torpedo

Gunner for your "real" attack, now also improved by Predator

Stupid? Yes! Annoying? Also, yes!

Seems like a lot of points for a ship that only deals stress instead of damage

Wrong, it does stress, followed by a Gunner damage round. Still is pretty expensive though.

I don't know... My guts tell me that Flechette Torpedo will be FAQed to rule something like that if you use munition failsafe with it, then, you won't be able to apply any part of the text in the torpedo card.

Of course, I may be wrong... We'll see.

I'd put Howlrunner, Fel, Vader, Turr, Backstabber (at point cost), and the Vanilla Royal guard before him before we even start thinking about him. Jax might make a splash. Whisper will likely land in that top 5 at the same time. An ability based on 3 ifs is pretty conditional (If you hit/they don't evade, if you have a focus/don't spend your focus, if they have no shields); at that cost I think we'd want a more consistent ability.

I can understand you feeling disappointed here, but you're absolutely digging for justification at this point. "If they don't evade" applies to any attack-based ability, including several you mention there. "If you have a focus" parallels Turr nicely with "If you have room to barrel roll" and Whisper might as well get "If you don't get ionized and stuck unable to attack at all".

You can take ANY ability and put as many "Ifs" on it as you want. Counting them is an exercise in inventive justification.

And Vader? Really? He's a moderately competitive pilot, but top 5??

Couldn't you say the same though, for him? At best he could get one shot by Wedge, with Outmaneuver if shot at range 1 outside his shooting arc.

Wedge is going to roll at most 4 dice, so even if a Defender is reduced to 0 defense die, Wedge still can't one shot him, because it takes 3 of the 4 dice just to remove the Defenders shields. Wedge would have to roll 5 dice, score 2 hits, with one of those hits being a direct hit! and the Defender would have to roll all blanks.

Edit: Perhaps I didn't understand... Were you talking about Wedge killing a Defender with one shoot, or Wedge being able to one shot a A-Wing?

Use Jan Ors' ability to give Wedge 5 dice...

My biggest complaint is that the Defender generics aren't PS 3 and PS 5. You'd think the best the Empire has to offer would be better than PS1.

My biggest complaint is that the Defender generics aren't PS 3 and PS 5. You'd think the best the Empire has to offer would be better than PS1.

This has been an oddity with the PS system from the beginning, and honestly isn't new to the Defender. The A-wing and even the Interceptor both have the same descriptive problem. Red Squadron became the Rogues, but weren't all that spectacular at that point, but have the same PS as Sabers, with the 181st theoretically being one of the most feared squadrons the Empire had.

<shrug>

Use Jan Ors' ability to give Wedge 5 dice...

Or an APT. But the point is you need 5 dice to one shot a defender.

But I think the point was that Wedge can one shot those same ships as well. Which is true, but any X-Wing rolling 4 dice can one shot a A-Wing or Z-95.

Couldn't you say the same though, for him? At best he could get one shot by Wedge, with Outmaneuver if shot at range 1 outside his shooting arc.

Wedge is going to roll at most 4 dice, so even if a Defender is reduced to 0 defense die, Wedge still can't one shot him, because it takes 3 of the 4 dice just to remove the Defenders shields. Wedge would have to roll 5 dice, score 2 hits, with one of those hits being a direct hit! and the Defender would have to roll all blanks.

Edit: Perhaps I didn't understand... Were you talking about Wedge killing a Defender with one shoot, or Wedge being able to one shot a A-Wing?

I was mainly stating for argument sake, that it is possible Rexlar could die as well. By a one shot via the right Combo, giving possible ideas that Imp players need to be wary of in order to handle him. Ten Numb with Autoblaster is also still a good counter to Rexlar and the Defender. Though it is all speculation till I fight a Defender later this year. With a wide while at the same time predictable dial it means each player is going to make that Defender either extremely deadly or just like any other ship..expendable.

Ten Numb with Autoblaster is also still a good counter to Rexlar and the Defender.

(Protip: Don't suggest an Autoblaster as a counter to anything. Really, just... don't...)

By a one shot via the right Combo, giving possible ideas that Imp players need to be wary of in order to handle him.

True. It's not like they're on par with the Defender from the Tie Fighter game.

But one shooting is pretty tricky. With 3 Shields and 3 Hull you need a minimum of 5 dice, and one Direct Hit! That means either Jan, or APT.

Rexlar on the other hand has the possibility of doing it on every attack against the 2 hull ships. I mean in theory he alone could kill off 4 A-Wings in 4 attacks all by himself.