Looks like FFG is trying to get rid of the 'put PTL on everything' mentality that's become so common.

One can say "Autoblasters are a counter to high agility ships" but saying they are a "good counter" is where you start pushing things. IF you could easily, and cheaply, figure out how to get those R1 shots then they could be worth it if you face that high agility squadron but the problem is getting there. I figure a PTL+EU+AS Ten could make fair use of the Autoblaster but the cost is sky high and he still wouldn't catch everyone.

Predator is also a good way to forget about being stressed, you get your attack buff, and can use a lot of white.... Given the k turn that's awesome. Stick an ion cannon on and you can close straight to later drop stress....

Looks like FFG is trying to get rid of the 'put PTL on everything' mentality that's become so common.

I still like Push the Limit on Rexler Brath, though. Same price as Predator, but lets you Target lock to reroll ALL dice and keep your focus to flip the damage cards.

Looks like FFG is trying to get rid of the 'put PTL on everything' mentality that's become so common.

I still like Push the Limit on Rexler Brath, though. Same price as Predator, but lets you Target lock to reroll ALL dice and keep your focus to flip the damage cards.

Good luck getting rid of that stress...

Looks like FFG is trying to get rid of the 'put PTL on everything' mentality that's become so common.

I'm not sure that making increasingly powerful EPTs in order to 'tempt' people choosing them over PtL is the correct answer.

My biggest complaint is that the Defender generics aren't PS 3 and PS 5. You'd think the best the Empire has to offer would be better than PS1.

My number one complaint as well. These pilots shouldn't be in the same categories as rookies and academy pilots. 30 points for a pilot that could be close to death before he even gets a chance to shoot is a little extreme. You will have to play very carefully with Tie Defenders unless you want a short match.

Looks like FFG is trying to get rid of the 'put PTL on everything' mentality that's become so common.

I still like Push the Limit on Rexler Brath, though. Same price as Predator, but lets you Target lock to reroll ALL dice and keep your focus to flip the damage cards.

Good luck getting rid of that stress...

Shouldn't be as hard as people are saying. Just have to make use of a hit-and-run tactic. Blast your target from the side, dash straight to clear stress, the target passes you and cant fire. K-turn and repeat.

The Defender is a flanker, but with entirely different strategy than interceptors. It turns like a dog, but it is quite fast. That white K-turn will make strafing common, allowing it to attack from the sides of a formation or from out at range. You fly a Defender with another ship or formation that is easier to pin down, so they remain focused elsewhere while you strafe. I'm not too worried about the dial. In fact, I was hoping the dial would be like it is. It is quite unique and will play differently than any other ship. It can definitely benefit from Push the Limit. Players my need to get used to not being able to attack every round with every ship. The Defender will land a heavy attack, spend a turn passing its enemy to reset, and repeat the process.

Or, 16 pts gives you a nice way to shed stress. Seriously, Wingman is excellent on the Black Squadron TIE.

Looks like FFG is trying to get rid of the 'put PTL on everything' mentality that's become so common.

I still like Push the Limit on Rexler Brath, though. Same price as Predator, but lets you Target lock to reroll ALL dice and keep your focus to flip the damage cards.

Good luck getting rid of that stress...

Shouldn't be as hard as people are saying. Just have to make use of a hit-and-run tactic. Blast your target from the side, dash straight to clear stress, the target passes you and cant fire. K-turn and repeat.

The Defender is a flanker, but with entirely different strategy than interceptors. It turns like a dog, but it is quite fast. That white K-turn will make strafing common, allowing it to attack from the sides of a formation or from out at range. You fly a Defender with another ship or formation that is easier to pin down, so they remain focused elsewhere while you strafe. I'm not too worried about the dial. In fact, I was hoping the dial would be like it is. It is quite unique and will play differently than any other ship. It can definitely benefit from Push the Limit. Players my need to get used to not being able to attack every round with every ship. The Defender will land a heavy attack, spend a turn passing its enemy to reset, and repeat the process.

4 k-turn + boost, 4 K-turn into Boost + barrel roll. This is the king jouster for the empire.

It occurs to me that it might be worth considering the spread of what Rexler means to different ships.

IMO that's not quite right.

3-agility ships, especially 3-agility ships that can stack focus + evade don't have all that much to fear since he's very often going to need to spend focus just to get any hits at all.

2-hull ships don't fear his special ability at all. If you do enough damage to kill an A-wing or Z-95 then who cares about the ability. It's only going to apply in the narrow range where you don't roll any eyeballs (since spending a focus to turn an eyeball into a hit is a 100% guaranteed kill, while spending a focus to turn a hit into a crit has a good chance of only damaging the target) AND don't roll well enough that you kill the target anyway without needing to flip damage cards AND don't just hit the shields. I'm sure there will be an occasional situation where you'll crit-kill a Z-95, but I wouldn't even consider spending points to buy his special ability for that.

In short, I think he's going to be a metagame-dependent ship. If YT-1300s and bombers are popular he'll be great. If not, it's hard to justify spending that many points.

Players my need to get used to not being able to attack every round with every ship.

It's hard to get used to something that's just a bad strategy. Having ships out of the fight means you aren't focusing fire, while your opponent is free to focus on the 2/3 (or even 1/2!) of your list that just flew away to be useless for a turn or two. This kind of approach is only going to work if you can disengage with every ship at once, and not just leave someone behind to be slaughtered.

It occurs to me that it might be worth considering the spread of what Rexler means to different ships.

IMO that's not quite right.3-agility ships, especially 3-agility ships that can stack focus + evade don't have all that much to fear since he's very often going to need to spend focus just to get any hits at all.2-hull ships don't fear his special ability at all. If you do enough damage to kill an A-wing or Z-95 then who cares about the ability. It's only going to apply in the narrow range where you don't roll any eyeballs (since spending a focus to turn an eyeball into a hit is a 100% guaranteed kill, while spending a focus to turn a hit into a crit has a good chance of only damaging the target) AND don't roll well enough that you kill the target anyway without needing to flip damage cards AND don't just hit the shields. I'm sure there will be an occasional situation where you'll crit-kill a Z-95, but I wouldn't even consider spending points to buy his special ability for that.In short, I think he's going to be a metagame-dependent ship. If YT-1300s and bombers are popular he'll be great. If not, it's hard to justify spending that many points.

We have a pretty large amount of Hull on ships at the moment. Firesprays, YT's and Shuttles are popular. I think he'll shine in epic play.

Players my need to get used to not being able to attack every round with every ship.

It's hard to get used to something that's just a bad strategy. Having ships out of the fight means you aren't focusing fire, while your opponent is free to focus on the 2/3 (or even 1/2!) of your list that just flew away to be useless for a turn or two. This kind of approach is only going to work if you can disengage with every ship at once, and not just leave someone behind to be slaughtered.

What about flankers that already exist in the game, such as interceptors. Interceptors perform the best when they are flanking for a swarmlet or a Firespray. Even when the flanker gets to fire, they are often outside of front arc, so the enemy has to focus on your swarmlet. Same deal here. You have a small group of fighters focusing and chipping away at enemy ships, particularly shielded high-priority ships. Then a defender swoops by and lands the killing blow. The defender zig zags, flying loops around the left and right sides of your enemy's formation and never flies into front arc.

Hey, maybe it's a bad strategy, but that is, in my opinion, what the Defender dial is designed for.

Little late to this party, but one quick note.

I saw a couple people suggest outmaneuver on Wedge. But in my opinion, Wedge is the LAST pilot you want to use outmaneuver on.

Reasons:

1. Several of the most popular ships have only one agility. The extra agility reduction is wasted on them. Better to use Predator or PtL.

2. Wedge is in one of the less maneuverable ships in the game. Chances of him being consistently enough out of arc are fairly slim.

3. Outmaneuver is generally worse than Predator for the same points cost. Predator applies to every attack, has a bonus against low ps, and you are statistically more likely to miss with an attack die (this needing a reroll) than your target is to evade with their defense die (excepting focus on either/both). The pilots that will do well with Outmaneuver are the ones who already have a means of modifying their dice through some method (i.e. Vader, Dual EPT A-Wings, Etc)

Too bad his ability won't work on assault missile splash damage. Now that would have been worth something.

Looks like FFG is trying to get rid of the 'put PTL on everything' mentality that's become so common.

I'm not sure that making increasingly powerful EPTs in order to 'tempt' people choosing them over PtL is the correct answer.

Is that's what's happening here, though?

Outmaneuver and Predator are both solid choices, but are they more powerful than Push the Limit on any sort of equal scale? I have a hard time seeing that.

PtL will still be the king for ships that can handle the stress. Focus+TL beats Focus+Predator, and gives more flexibility for actions. And Opportunist is probably a better attack booster than either, again for ships that can handle the stress. Both of these provide good options for ships that have a harder time shedding that stress.

Are these better than Expose or Marksmanship or Elusiveness? Certainly, but if you want to consider that power creep, I'll say it's power creep that needed to happen. One of the reasons that the game is still dominated by as many generic ships as you can cram in is because none of the unique skills/upgrades give enough bang for the buck to replace the loss of an entire other ship. I may be distressed at the timing of when this hit between the Rebel and Empire, but there's plenty of room for abilities and upgrades to get better without truly breaking the game.

Sabatuer does the same thing and is considered very weak (have to have damage cards on there, takes an action and you took an action to focus).

Uhm, now you're starting to sound nuts. Seriously - I believe that Vorpal Sword enumerated the reasons that this is NOTHING LIKE Saboteur above, if you're trying to compare the two you're into total tinfoil hat territory.

And really - you're going to count "need a focus" as a serious limitation? <shrug> Okay. Whatever. You seem to be so invested in the idea that the Imperials are getting shafted that your going way, WAY out of your way to find, or invent, reasons to justify that.

The Defender has its drawbacks - I honestly think the dial is possibly one of the worst in the game, rivaling the shuttle and HWK. It's expensive. But Rexler's ability is not one of them.

Rexler's ability is the best of the 2 but that doesn't say much...tycho's ability is better than Arvel's... It just isn't as good as many imperial pilot abilities.

It is like sabatuer- doesn't take up your crew, takes up your pilot talent; does work about 50% of the time since you can't modify your dice and use it because you had to focus (focus isn't a bad thing, but the use of the ability does require your action) your opponent had shields or you killed them anyway; it takes an action because imperials lack focus shifting.

Rexlar is decent and his ability is powerful IF it gets used. So is Cowall's, Kanos', Kagi's. the platform to support it is even there but all of those are more expensive and situational than they are powerful at the end of the day.

Dismiss my tin foil hat if you want... It still has a point. And is still more stylish than those rebel scooter helmets.

In general I think that there are a lot of people here doing unwarranted complaining about the Defender dial. While I think it is short on "green" options (and I think it should have had the banks and even the turns at "3" as green) the dial reflects the high speed (almost TOO high speed) nature of the ship well.

Further this synergises with the white K-Turn effectively to offer a truly unique ship on the table which will fly in a way which we have not previously seen on the table.

On the other hand I do agree with those who are protesting about the pilot skill of the generic options. While this matches against other patterns within the game I don't think it is a good reflection of the progression from TIE Fighter, to TIE Interceptor to TIE Defender which the Imperial pilots here have done. While the Defender is another step up (as much as the Fighter to the Interceptor was a step up) I disagree that it's the same kind of change and I think that higher generic PS could have been defended.

The REAL killer is going to be if that Pilot Skill 3 Onyx Squadron pilot doesn't have an Elite Pilot Skill slot. I'd argue that there shouldn't be ANY Defender without an EPT, but don't have a problem with ONE generic ship without one, but if BOTH have no EPT then I'll be screaming blue murder (and I don't think I'll be alone).

The Pilots we have seen are certainly interesting.

Delta Squadron Pilot:

The base line Defender is (as noted above) frustratingly PS 1, but at least it's not so dependent on action manoeuvrability (unlike the Interceptor) so I don't think that hurts as much as it might. Adding Target Lock in exchange for Evade certainly makes the Defender more aggressive and with 3/3/3 on the defensive side I don't think you are going to suffer too much for the loss. The white K-Turn on the dial and encouragement towards higher speed movement make the Ion Cannon a VERY interesting prospect (and the classic Defender trick) while there are arguments for other options I think cost alone will prevent these seeing too much table time. The Missile slot is interesting, but likewise I don't think we are going to see it used a lot except for niche alpha strike builds.

Colonel Vesery:

First interesting point is that either the Defender gets a "free" PS at the first upgrade (like the TIE Fighter and Royal Guard Interceptors) or the abilities on the Defender pilots are free. Either way it's a good deal (and will encourage investment in PS on these already expensive ships, as others have pointed out it's % wise a great deal). The real selling point here is the ability to get continuous target locks AND to use a Target Lock with ordinance which burns it to launch. THIS is a Defender which will see time with Missiles and the synergy with the Lambda Shuttle Title (allowing a Shuttle to continuously keep any ship on the field locked) is magnificent. He's going to need support (I'd love to see him flying with a pair of Interceptors with Targeting Computers personally) but in the right list I think this is the prize pilot for the Defender.

Rexler Brath:

Once again either "free" PS or a free ability and the % low cost of getting PS up to 8 on an already good hull argues in favour of going with a named pilot here. His ability is certainly interesting and I can see the point made by many that without a source of additional Focus it's going to be hard to optimise. On the other hand it's clearly going to be strong against anything with a lot of Hull and anything which punishes the Falcon is a good thing to add to the game. Lots of people have assumed that Chewie and other "crit preventers" will work to prevent this from functioning, but that is clearly an error and this will be very effective against anything without shields to protect it. Now that's largely Imperial ships, but if it's good it's good no matter who it's good against.

Now, to cost.

I'm not alone (from what I'm seeing here at least) in thinking that these ships are at least slightly overcosted. Now I'm talking Interceptor overcosted here (1-2pts) not Advanced overcosted, but still it's enough to matter.

Nevertheless I think that one thing the article has right is the style of play that the Defender is going to support and the way in which it will fill an interesting role for the Imperial forces. It is going to be standing alongside the Firespray-31 in many cases as a "heavy combat" ship but will have the speed to work more closely with Interceptors and generic TIE Fighters more effectively.

That's the Defender out of the way, now onto the rest of the pack in general.

The Ion Cannon is certainly the right cannon option in THIS pack... as is the Ion Pulse Missile. There are going to be a LOT of great ways to use and abuse poor innocent Ion'ed ships using a Defender. No surprises that we also see Munitions Failsafe, which won't see much use on Defenders but is nice to see in one of the Imperial packs.

Of course the big news is the two new EPT cards on offer (and yes, they are going to be a major factor in how good the new A-Wing unique title is once Rebel Aces hits).

Outmaneuver:

Standing alone this is an excellent upgrade which will be a real help to a number of Imperial ships. Even a Generic TIE Fighter with an EPT would love this, but in particular it's hard to understand why this wasn't in the Imperial Aces pack (to give SOME kind of answer to the "but Interceptors SUCK against turrets" issue). In any case being able to push down defensive dice while out of arc is a great ability on anything with the mobility to use it and both the Defender and the Interceptor love this.

Predator:

This card existing is the biggest issue with Outmaneuver, not because it changes anything I just said but because (especially in the current meta) it's just SO **** GOOD that you can't justify selecting anything else at the same price point. Not only is it every solo-fighter's dream of Howl glory in a bow, but it includes bonus swarm and rookie punishment built in. With the low-PS-high hull/firepower approach in most builds out in the world this card alone may just shake up the meta more than anything similar we've seen.

Here's my take on the Defender:

Red 1-2 turns are ouch, but not devastating. The white K-turn is great. I wish we had greenies for the 2 & 3-banks. I see the Defender as the anti-B-wing: whereas the B-wing is the knifer, the Defender is the opposite. I plan on fielding the following list:

Fel + PtL + RGT + SD + TC

Colonel Vessery

Backstabber

BSP

Shoots at 9-6-6-4, Fel can "tag" one ship with a TL and still have an action + Focus to go after another target, letting Vessery open up with a TL + Focus on it.

Looks like FFG is trying to get rid of the 'put PTL on everything' mentality that's become so common.

I still like Push the Limit on Rexler Brath, though. Same price as Predator, but lets you Target lock to reroll ALL dice and keep your focus to flip the damage cards.

Good luck getting rid of that stress...

Shouldn't be as hard as people are saying. Just have to make use of a hit-and-run tactic. Blast your target from the side, dash straight to clear stress, the target passes you and cant fire. K-turn and repeat.

The Defender is a flanker, but with entirely different strategy than interceptors. It turns like a dog, but it is quite fast. That white K-turn will make strafing common, allowing it to attack from the sides of a formation or from out at range. You fly a Defender with another ship or formation that is easier to pin down, so they remain focused elsewhere while you strafe. I'm not too worried about the dial. In fact, I was hoping the dial would be like it is. It is quite unique and will play differently than any other ship. It can definitely benefit from Push the Limit. Players my need to get used to not being able to attack every round with every ship. The Defender will land a heavy attack, spend a turn passing its enemy to reset, and repeat the process.

4 k-turn + boost, 4 K-turn into Boost + barrel roll. This is the king jouster for the empire.

Except you have to spend another 4pts to get Boost onto an already expensive ship.

Not that I don't think that you are right (or wouldn't consider paying that cost) but it's important to remember that ability isn't native to the Defender.

In general I think that there are a lot of people here doing unwarranted complaining about the Defender dial. While I think it is short on "green" options (and I think it should have had the banks and even the turns at "3" as green) the dial reflects the high speed (almost TOO high speed) nature of the ship well.

Further this synergises with the white K-Turn effectively to offer a truly unique ship on the table which will fly in a way which we have not previously seen on the table.

Predator:

This card existing is the biggest issue with Outmaneuver, not because it changes anything I just said but because (especially in the current meta) it's just SO **** GOOD that you can't justify selecting anything else at the same price point. Not only is it every solo-fighter's dream of Howl glory in a bow, but it includes bonus swarm and rookie punishment built in. With the low-PS-high hull/firepower approach in most builds out in the world this card alone may just shake up the meta more than anything similar we've seen.

I agree, I LOVE the dial. I really think it concretes the Defender as a unique ship with new strategies, because of its stressful turns and fast greens.

I agree with most of what you said about Predator, except for this: Push the Limit is the same cost. For 3 points, you can focus and reroll 1, occasionally 2 (admittedly often due to the state of the meta), but for the same cost, you can Focus and Target lock, allowing you to reroll ALL dice if needed. Predator will have its place. For instance I think it synergizes well with Rexler Brath, but I think that Push the Limit is still the better choice, even with the rough turning situation.

so glad this ship dose not have an evade action or it would be so hard to kill

that said one on one

Horton with Ion, Flechette x2, Engine, R2-D6, Outmaneuver 42 pt

If he could Ion the defender get behind him and it could be game over

In general I think that there are a lot of people here doing unwarranted complaining about the Defender dial. While I think it is short on "green" options (and I think it should have had the banks and even the turns at "3" as green) the dial reflects the high speed (almost TOO high speed) nature of the ship well.

Further this synergises with the white K-Turn effectively to offer a truly unique ship on the table which will fly in a way which we have not previously seen on the table.

Predator:

This card existing is the biggest issue with Outmaneuver, not because it changes anything I just said but because (especially in the current meta) it's just SO **** GOOD that you can't justify selecting anything else at the same price point. Not only is it every solo-fighter's dream of Howl glory in a bow, but it includes bonus swarm and rookie punishment built in. With the low-PS-high hull/firepower approach in most builds out in the world this card alone may just shake up the meta more than anything similar we've seen.

I agree, I LOVE the dial. I really think it concretes the Defender as a unique ship with new strategies, because of its stressful turns and fast greens.

I agree with most of what you said about Predator, except for this: Push the Limit is the same cost. For 3 points, you can focus and reroll 1, occasionally 2 (admittedly often due to the state of the meta), but for the same cost, you can Focus and Target lock, allowing you to reroll ALL dice if needed. Predator will have its place. For instance I think it synergizes well with Rexler Brath, but I think that Push the Limit is still the better choice, even with the rough turning situation.

Predator is going to be especially great for those ships that don't have Target Lock as an option.

You are right that PtL is always going to be a great option, but Stress looks like it might not be the best opportunity cost to pay as the meta advances.

Except PtL gives a stress token and cannot be used if you have a stress token.

Predator works every single round. Stressed or unstressed. AND it doesn't leave you with a stress afterwards.

Don't get me wrong, PtL is not going anywhere. It is much more flexible; and there are some ships that actually like stress. But Predator is definitely a better offensive upgrade. (Oh. It even works if you get blocked!)