I don't think it's real hard to think up a very plausible fictional reason for why the DS didn't fire on Yavin proper

I just go with the simple explanation that the DS's superlaser isn't powerful enough to have the desired effect on something the size of a gas giant. Not all planets are created equal, nor do they need to be equally vulnerable to a superlaser.

Also, it's a gas giant - what do you shoot? Oh sure, there's a core - but since Gas Giants are almost-but-not-quite stars, I suspect that the core is mostly unnecessary to keeping the planet intact. Blowing up the core certainly wont be good for the planet, but the planetary mass will probably not disperse with it gone. The half hour required to drive around the planet into firing range is almost certainly faster than hanging around waiting for Yavin to dissipate.

(On a side note, I wonder if it would have been possible to shoot THROUGH Yavin? Miss the core, and compensate for the english the planet's gravity would put on the shot? Naw, the gas is probably dense enough that it would mess up the beam on the way.)

The recharging argument doesn't hold up when the Death Star gets used to take shots at individual capital ships...that's going to be dozens of shots.

That was a different Death Star, though with a first generation reactor core. You might as well complain why your Ipod from 2002 doesn't have a touch screen.

Yeah, I agree that the ewoks beating stormtroopers was preposterously pandering. For one thing, what the hell is the point of the stormtroopers wearing armor, which obviously hampers movement at least a little bit, if it can't stop blaster bolts or apparently anything else? I think the ewoks failed to take down one stormtrooper with an attack of...what, some pebbles they threw, or a very crude bow (I don't recall exactly which weapon they used), but everything else they tried worked. The troopers were incredibly inept in that engagement.

1) Terror and intimidation

2) Shrapnel and glancing blows

3) Environmental conditions (heating, cooling, exposure to vacuum)

Also, the Stormtroopers were holding their own against the Ewoks until they broke up into smaller unites and pursued them into the woods. A tactical blunder? Sure, but that's more about the arrogance of the Empire than the effectiveness of their equipment.

The core of a gas giant is much denser than a terrestrial world.

This discussion of spaceship cowboys and samurai wizards is turning into an episode of Cosmos.

I did say its best to just enjoy it......

I dunno. I've been playing for awhile and never come across a lightsaber. Most of the games I've been in haven't necessitated one. We all have blasters and sometimes we have grenades. Who needs a lightsaber when you have military grade explosives and a fuse?

In any case, it depends on the GM and the players. What kind of game do you want to play? Jedi that somehow survived Order 66? Obi-wan did it; Yoda did it. The EU depicts several that pulled it off. Why not your original character?

Or perhaps you were born after Order 66 and thus were never found by the Jedi and therefore were never found by Palpatine to start his little Sith army.

Or maybe you were? Maybe you're a renegade from the program. Or perhaps you are like Starkiller; an agent of the Empire sent to hunt Jedi.

There's plenty of reasons for you to come across a lightsaber. The point is that the characters that play in this game are supposed to be a cut above the rest. Even if you don't take Force Sensitive Exile, the Force still focuses on you. Things happen for you that would never happen to anyone else. Coming across an oddly large number of people with lightsabers or finding them yourself; all in a day for the hero on the Outer Rim.

One of my player characters currently has a lightsaber in his possession. He just doesn't know it yet. It's inside of a rectangular box that has no obvious signs of opening. The Jedi Master in the Holocron he found told him, "When the time is right I will teach you how to open it."

The recharging argument doesn't hold up when the Death Star gets used to take shots at individual capital ships...that's going to be dozens of shots.

There being imaginable explanations for why it wasn't used doesn't mean that what we saw in the movie wasn't kinda dumb--one line would have served to make the plot line up intelligently (at least that part of it).

Yeah, I agree that the ewoks beating stormtroopers was preposterously pandering. For one thing, what the hell is the point of the stormtroopers wearing armor, which obviously hampers movement at least a little bit, if it can't stop blaster bolts or apparently anything else? I think the ewoks failed to take down one stormtrooper with an attack of...what, some pebbles they threw, or a very crude bow (I don't recall exactly which weapon they used), but everything else they tried worked. The troopers were incredibly inept in that engagement.

Presumably it takes less energy to blow up a capital ship than a planet, wouldn't you agree? This fires beams of some sort, not shells. Perfectly reasonable to assume it can fire on a lower setting. Many ship destroying shots might equal one Yavin-destroying shot. And then there's everything others have said about different types of planet. I think you git this idea in your head that this is a clever flaw you've spotted and don't want to let go of it. But without more information there sre lots of plausible reasons for this.

You can't condemn soft sci-fi for having particular universe conceits, only for internal inconsistency. If we had elsewhere seen the Death Star rapid-firing planets then you could day it's a flaw not to blown up Yavin, but as we haven't we don't know this was even possible.

Also, as others have also pointed out, they didn't know that the Death Star even was vulnerable. You don't take risks when you're not aware anything is at stake.

Like I said, the whole notion of the DS is kinda dumb. If you can move a planetary sized object through hyperspace you don't need a super laser to destroy a terrestrial world. Just fly by it, the resulting gravitational stresses would cause all manner of tectonic volcanism hell on the world in addition to stripping away its atmosphere. Pretty much why it's best to just not worry about it and enjoy it I think.

I thought that everyone knew that the Death Star was the size of "a small moon" not a planet. Plus hollow to let all those people and ships fly around inside it. So at best a case of some old sailor shaking his fist at the sky and yelling "Durn Imperial messing with the tides".

So the "modern" lightsaber is ~4800 years old by the setting of EotE. How many Jedi do you think went through the whole make your first saber ritual? Voice gave the numbers of "100,000,000,000,000,000 sentient beings vs. 1,000,000 Jedi". But how many is that a year? 1,000 a year 100,000? Let's say 50,000 that's 240,000,000 lightsabers created over that period of time. We've seen things like holocrons last thousands of years, so I don't see them all being broken relics. Even if they've got a shelf life of 1000 to 2000 years, that's still ~100,000,000 lightsabers. I just don't see the Empire expending the resources needed to track down ever single lightsaber. The lightsaber isn't the problem for the Empire, it's only when a Jedi wields one that its an issue. It's much more cost efficient to just track down reports of some crazy dude with a glow stick than hunt down every lightsaber ever made.

You're not going to find them at every Mos Espa pawn shop, but finding one seems closer to a needle in a haystack than a needle in the Sahara. And that's just to find a lightsaber, learning to use it is a whole different kettle of fish.

Nice application of rational thought, there. So do Jedi get buried with their lightsabre? I have a delightfully macabre idea for how I'll make a PC obtain one if they absolutely must get their paws on one: "Well, there used to be lots of lightsabres but Jedi each make their own rather than pass them on so... Wait, get some shovels and go find me an archaeologist!"

So the "modern" lightsaber is ~4800 years old by the setting of EotE. How many Jedi do you think went through the whole make your first saber ritual? Voice gave the numbers of "100,000,000,000,000,000 sentient beings vs. 1,000,000 Jedi". But how many is that a year? 1,000 a year 100,000? Let's say 50,000 that's 240,000,000 lightsabers created over that period of time. We've seen things like holocrons last thousands of years, so I don't see them all being broken relics. Even if they've got a shelf life of 1000 to 2000 years, that's still ~100,000,000 lightsabers. I just don't see the Empire expending the resources needed to track down ever single lightsaber. The lightsaber isn't the problem for the Empire, it's only when a Jedi wields one that its an issue. It's much more cost efficient to just track down reports of some crazy dude with a glow stick than hunt down every lightsaber ever made.

You're not going to find them at every Mos Espa pawn shop, but finding one seems closer to a needle in a haystack than a needle in the Sahara. And that's just to find a lightsaber, learning to use it is a whole different kettle of fish.

Nice application of rational thought, there. So do Jedi get buried with their lightsabre? I have a delightfully macabre idea for how I'll make a PC obtain one if they absolutely must get their paws on one: "Well, there used to be lots of lightsabres but Jedi each make their own rather than pass them on so... Wait, get some shovels and go find me an archaeologist!"

Well Sith seemed to like to leave theirs in their tombs and then make unsuspecting wanna-be Sith jump through hoops to get them. I've figured if my group ever gets a lightsaber it'll probably be from some sort of tomb-raiding activity, which to me just sounds like so much fun to design.

I just assumed they didn't blow up Yavin because the Death Star had to cool down or otherwise recharge before firing again.

Well if were going there... There could be a few reasons why they didn't blow up Yavin. First Yavin is a gas giant on par with Jupiter with Yavin 4 being an Earth sized (+-) moon so it's possible that the weapon doesn't have the power to destroy such a large target (Jupiter is 300 times the mass of the Earth). Even if it could have destroyed Yavin the resulting blast would be orders of magnitude larger, likely destroying the Deathstar or at least potentially doing so. Alternatively the weapon could have ignited Yavin and created a new star (2010 style) which would destroy the Deathstar as well. Or it was just more hubris that there was no rush and no reason to destroy a perfectly usable gas giant.

As for why the DS ended up on the wrong side of Yavin? Well Hyperspace jumps are probably linear and the DS's position prior to making the jump to light speed just happened to be such that thats where it ended up when entering the system.

Generally, Star Wars space is treated as being very planar (KHAN!!!!).

Ever notice how the various planetary blockades (Ep 1, TCW), are always engaged by the attacking force flying straight at a group of ships positioned in one very fractional portion of the planet's orbit?

Generally, Star Wars space is treated as being very planar (KHAN!!!!).

Ever notice how the various planetary blockades (Ep 1, TCW), are always engaged by the attacking force flying straight at a group of ships positioned in one very fractional portion of the planet's orbit?

General Skywalker tactics. When in doubt ram through said blockade at a random point!

I would imagine the only reason lightsabers are so easy to find is gm's are willing to put them in adventures for their players who want to either see them or attempt to obtain them.

Our group of misfits are so far out into the boonies of the outer rim that the chance of falling upon a lightsaber is a lot lower than the Rebel Alliance winning against the Empire after the battle of Yavin.

Which sucks because my Jawa would be an impressive figure with a lightsaber. A dangerously impressive figure that the party would want to be far from if he were to ever encounter a lightsaber.

The recharging argument doesn't hold up when the Death Star gets used to take shots at individual capital ships...that's going to be dozens of shots.

That was a different Death Star, though with a first generation reactor core. You might as well complain why your Ipod from 2002 doesn't have a touch screen.

In the novel Death Star, the first DS destroys a Rebel carrier attacking it with a 4% power shot. Certainly it'd be easy even for the first DS to throw around a few shots at that power if necessary, presumably with little downtime given the small amount of power used. The second DS did have an explicit "anti-capital ship" power setting though.

Screw lightsabers and Deathstars. What we really need is a Deathstar sized lightsaber.

Light sabres may be easy to find. But can you collect all the different colours? I imagine you'd have to search long and hard to find Mace Windu's purple one or Yoda's half-sized little green one.

When you think about it that way, finding a functional lightsaber in a post-New Order galaxy is probably about as easy as getting your hands on a functional AR-15 in modern Australia.

You might want to American that reference up a bit if you want us to get it. An AR-15 isn't too difficult to come by in my part of the world. If you aren't a convicted felon and have ~$1500; you're good to go.

Suck it, Not America!

How does that FREEDOM taste?

Like the sweet, sweet nectar of Democrat tears.

USA! USA! USA!

Screw lightsabers and Deathstars. What we really need is a Deathstar sized lightsaber.

The Hutts made one already.

When you think about it that way, finding a functional lightsaber in a post-New Order galaxy is probably about as easy as getting your hands on a functional AR-15 in modern Australia.

You might want to American that reference up a bit if you want us to get it. An AR-15 isn't too difficult to come by in my part of the world. If you aren't a convicted felon and have ~$1500; you're good to go.

Suck it, Not America!

How does that FREEDOM taste?

Like the sweet, sweet nectar of Democrat tears.

USA! USA! USA!

I know. I'm an American, I own an AR-15 and I've been trained on fully automatic variants in the course of military service. Ownership of an AR-15 isn't all that difficult or surprising here in the U.S. That wasn't my point, though, which is why I specifically did not use the United States in my analogy.

What I was referring to was the virtual ban on semi-automatic long-arms that took place in Australia after the Port Arthur Massacre in 1996. In modern Australia, the only people allowed to possess an AR-15 (a " Category D " firearm) are employed by the government, or given express permission by the government. (Which is rare.) Exceptions are made to specially licensed collectors as long as the weapons are rendered "permanently inoperable."

A random person walking around with an AR-15 in Perth or Sydney is probably going to trigger a pretty big government response in the same way that some PC waving around a lightsaber in Coronet City is probably going to attract some Stormtroopers and/or an Inquisitor.

I'm not really sure what point you were trying to make with the second part of that post.

Screw lightsabers and Deathstars. What we really need is a Deathstar sized lightsaber.

The Hutts made one already.

Let's not remind anyone of that particularly abysmal chapter in Star Wars lore.

Screw lightsabers and Deathstars. What we really need is a Deathstar sized lightsaber.

I'd rather have a lightsaber sized Death Star. . . .

I'm not really sure what point you were trying to make with the second part of that post.

I was being facetious. I'm aware of the Australian ban, but thought your comparison was amusing.

Also: Darksaber [was that the title?] probably won't make the EU cut. So not to worry. After this post, we can all go back to pretending it didn't happen.

Generally, Star Wars space is treated as being very planar (KHAN!!!!).

Ever notice how the various planetary blockades (Ep 1, TCW), are always engaged by the attacking force flying straight at a group of ships positioned in one very fractional portion of the planet's orbit?

The very idea of a blockade is almost absurd. Sure, it could be done with multiple capital ships and a lot of smaller vessels, but at a certain point it isn't cost effective, you would be better off just bombarding all the production facilities and spaceports from orbit. Maybe keep a SD in the system to ward off any aid efforts. Thrawn's solution was pretty clever though.

Generally, Star Wars space is treated as being very planar (KHAN!!!!).

Ever notice how the various planetary blockades (Ep 1, TCW), are always engaged by the attacking force flying straight at a group of ships positioned in one very fractional portion of the planet's orbit?

The very idea of a blockade is almost absurd. Sure, it could be done with multiple capital ships and a lot of smaller vessels, but at a certain point it isn't cost effective, you would be better off just bombarding all the production facilities and spaceports from orbit. Maybe keep a SD in the system to ward off any aid efforts. Thrawn's solution was pretty clever though.

Orbital bombardments are one of those "blatant act of aggression" things though. Blockades on the other hand are something that can be resolved with diplomacy. If you're trying to force a resolution without starting a shooting war a blockade is quite cost effective.

And it's not all that huge. Real-world spacecraft orbit earth once every 45 minutes or so. So if you take say... a half dozen capital ships and lay out their orbits with some thought you'd probably be able to get reasonable coverage. Toss in sensor buoys and probe droids to fill in gaps, and fighter groups and patrol boats to do rapid reaction, and you'd have a respectable chance of intercepting most craft. You'd still have the occasional blockade runner of course, but one CR90 a week can't feed a planet.

And I didn't even mention mines.

If your blockade is starving the planet or you're seeding mines about local space, I'm pretty sure the blockade has moved into 'blatant act of aggression' territory.