Regarding the whole "untrained lightsaber, cut my own head off thing," I've never bought into that either. I can pick up a stick and swing it without hurting myself. While I was never particularly good at baseball, I never clubbed myself wth the bat. Sure, I've brained myself with nunchaku. Everyone has. But I did it because I was swinging them around like a ****** without training. But a lightsaber isn't nunchaku; it's a bat.

And before anyone starts crying about balance points and the weightless blade, I have one word for you; flashlight. I'm perfectly capable of pointing a flashlight in one direction. If needed, I could even swing it at someone without shining it in my eyes. So that argument goes away.

The only way someone is going to hurt themselves with a lightsaber is if they are nunchaku-ing it (swinging it around like a ******). Any self-aware player character is going to have better sense, and either exercise caution or learn how to use it. Non-issue.

Let's stop pretending here, the idea of a lightsaber being 'really dangerous' to the wielder more so than any other weapon, stems from the old WEG lightsaber combat rules. Now if that's how you want to play the game, fine. But this is just an instance of saying 'no' to the players and being an adversarial GM. It's not particularly fair to penalize people who wield lightsabers without the Force anymore than it is to penalize ranged weapon users without training..the lack of rolling well is a penalty enough.

This is the only thing I want to comment on, I generally agree with everything else. I have never played WEG so I am not sure where every one else gets their opinion on the subject but for me its pretty **** simple. Saying a sword made out of a laser is not 'really dangerous' your kidding your self. That being said.... If we are going with what the OP was suggesting, absolutely no way. If I was the GM I would not allow it, and I would not want to be in a game where it was permitted, who knows what would happen after that. That being said I see zero issue with someone using it as a primary weapon. I wouldn't expect them deflect blasters though.

Regarding the whole "untrained lightsaber, cut my own head off thing," I've never bought into that either. I can pick up a stick and swing it without hurting myself. While I was never particularly good at baseball, I never clubbed myself wth the bat. Sure, I've brained myself with nunchaku. Everyone has. But I did it because I was swinging them around like a ****** without training. But a lightsaber isn't nunchaku; it's a bat.

And before anyone starts crying about balance points and the weightless blade, I have one word for you; flashlight. I'm perfectly capable of pointing a flashlight in one direction. If needed, I could even swing it at someone without shining it in my eyes. So that argument goes away.

The only way someone is going to hurt themselves with a lightsaber is if they are nunchaku-ing it (swinging it around like a ******). Any self-aware player character is going to have better sense, and either exercise caution or learn how to use it. Non-issue.

Try swinging around a running chainsaw. Are you as confident in your ability to not harm yourself? It's far more accurate comparison than a bat or flashlight. Balance issues aside in the comparison, a Lightsaber edge is a completely unforgiving weapon. All this discussion, even the people that have had training with swords, a sword isn't able to sever a limb with a casual flick of the wrist. As long as you don't bump yourself with the edge, or somewhere unprotected, you won't get injured, or if, not seriously. Brush yourself with a Lightsaber and the injury would be grievous.

Regarding the whole "untrained lightsaber, cut my own head off thing," I've never bought into that either. I can pick up a stick and swing it without hurting myself. While I was never particularly good at baseball, I never clubbed myself wth the bat. Sure, I've brained myself with nunchaku. Everyone has. But I did it because I was swinging them around like a ****** without training. But a lightsaber isn't nunchaku; it's a bat.

And before anyone starts crying about balance points and the weightless blade, I have one word for you; flashlight. I'm perfectly capable of pointing a flashlight in one direction. If needed, I could even swing it at someone without shining it in my eyes. So that argument goes away.

The only way someone is going to hurt themselves with a lightsaber is if they are nunchaku-ing it (swinging it around like a ******). Any self-aware player character is going to have better sense, and either exercise caution or learn how to use it. Non-issue.

Try swinging around a running chainsaw. Are you as confident in your ability to not harm yourself? It's far more accurate comparison than a bat or flashlight. Balance issues aside in the comparison, a Lightsaber edge is a completely unforgiving weapon. All this discussion, even the people that have had training with swords, a sword isn't able to sever a limb with a casual flick of the wrist. As long as you don't bump yourself with the edge, or somewhere unprotected, you won't get injured, or if, not seriously. Brush yourself with a Lightsaber and the injury would be grievous.

No it is not an appropriate analogy. Chainsaws are unweildly. swords are not. I also manage to use a chainsaw with out hurting myself.

I believe I said balance issues aside in the comment I made. I was speaking to the cutting and damage a Lightsaber blade is capable of inflicting and more speaking to the difference between swinging a baseball bat or flashlight and a running chainsaw and if someone would treat a running chainsaw the same as a bat or flashlight in how they handle them. I wasn't suggesting using a chainsaw as a weapon. For the sake of argument say you could swing a running chainsaw like a bat or flashlight, would you treat all three the same and have the same opinion about your level of concern in wielding them? Would it be similar to consider a sword the same as a running chainsaw? That's the point I am trying to make.

Actually yes I would use them all with the same level of care. As all 3 hurt when you get hit with them. And really the people in danger from a lightsaber are those around you. As that is what I tent to hit unintentionally. Coffee tables etc. Roll a despair when using a lightsaber and you cut something bad...like the control console to the ship you are on. good luck controlling the ship now or you buddy behind you or next to you. That is how a lightsaber would be dangerous.

Okey dokey, and on that comment I think I will bring my participation in this thread to an end.

Players shouldn't become their own enemy just because of the weapon that they're wielding. Let the other NPCs or the environment be the dangers that they face, not their sudden GM-imposed ineptitude. If a PC loses a limb it should be because it was gnawed off by a gundark, not because they forgot which way to point the dangerous end of their own weapon.

I think my PCs tend to run the gamut from mundane heroes to extraordinary idiots.

Mine run the gamut from extraordinary idiots to extraordinary idiots.

Both occasionally in the same scene!

At some point this just becomes punishing players for the GM introducing an item that they don't want the players to use – or they want to control the manner in which they use it.

Either way, none of these punitive measures sound fun.

If he wants something to block blasters tell him to find a shield gauntlet .

I think it's very much an exception to the rule, but it would be remiss not to point out that Cad Bane (seriously - what was with his parents?) blocks repeated blaster bolts from Obi Wan in TCW. Not sure of the episode but it's the one where Ziro escapes from the Hutts and Bane has a showdown in some badlands landscape. He's using some sort of staff, I think.

Cad Bane (seriously - what was with his parents?)

According to WotC's Galactic Campaign Guide, it isn't all that common for a Duros to develop an alias and then drop their original name to stick with the alias alone. If using that logic, there's no reason to believe that Cad Bane was actually given that name by his parents.

Cad Bane (seriously - what was with his parents?)

According to WotC's Galactic Campaign Guide, it isn't all that common for a Duros to develop an alias and then drop their original name to stick with the alias alone. If using that logic, there's no reason to believe that Cad Bane was actually given that name by his parents.

Next time I need a Star Wars question answered, I'm coming directly to you!

I have watched recently that Mandalorian royal guards from Clone Wars 2x13 blocking and defclecting blaster bolts with electro staves. So, non-Force users can block and deflect blasters with lightsabers probably too.

I have watched recently that Mandalorian royal guards from Clone Wars 2x13 blocking and defclecting blaster bolts with electro staves. So, non-Force users can block and deflect blasters with lightsabers probably too.

Sure non-force users might be able to block blaster bolts, but that'd be a melee check. Someone without the force will likely need more training. I'm guessing a colonist isn't going to be blocking anything with a melee weapon or a lightsaber. That's been my argument all along, someone who doesn't have much melee skill is likely a danger to themselves and others with a lightsaber. They'd still be with a vibro-sword as well. Someone trying to wield a lightsaber and a blaster without high levels of training in both like in the OP mentioned, would be an even bigger danger.

I have watched recently that Mandalorian royal guards from Clone Wars 2x13 blocking and defclecting blaster bolts with electro staves. So, non-Force users can block and deflect blasters with lightsabers probably too.

Sure non-force users might be able to block blaster bolts, but that'd be a melee check. Someone without the force will likely need more training. I'm guessing a colonist isn't going to be blocking anything with a melee weapon or a lightsaber. That's been my argument all along, someone who doesn't have much melee skill is likely a danger to themselves and others with a lightsaber. They'd still be with a vibro-sword as well. Someone trying to wield a lightsaber and a blaster without high levels of training in both like in the OP mentioned, would be an even bigger danger.

I'd like to point out that most Talents (which is what this would have to be in this game) don't have any skill prerequisites. You can have 3 ranks of Barrage without every learning a single rank in Gunnery or Ranged (Heavy). You can have Dead to Rights (Improved even) without ever learning Gunnery. In theory, you could take the entire Slicer tree without ever having a single rank in Computers.

Because of this, it's probably going to happen that some talent allowing a weapon to be used to defend - possibly even against ranged attacks - is going to happen and it won't likely matter all that much how skilled (Skill ranks) with the weapon the use might be.

Sure non-force users might be able to block blaster bolts, but that'd be a melee check. Someone without the force will likely need more training. I'm guessing a colonist isn't going to be blocking anything with a melee weapon or a lightsaber. That's been my argument all along, someone who doesn't have much melee skill is likely a danger to themselves and others with a lightsaber. They'd still be with a vibro-sword as well. Someone trying to wield a lightsaber and a blaster without high levels of training in both like in the OP mentioned, would be an even bigger danger.

In this world, sure. For mundane NPCs in a Galaxy Far Far Away, sure. For the heroes of a story in that same Galaxy? Well, if they weren't already special individuals with the potential for awesomeness then why would a GM and the players even bother to spend hours of their precious free time to tell their stories?

When running or playing a game based on a series of movies where seemingly ordinary people do amazing things that can't be done and if it can't be as fun as watching Netflix...

PC: "I throw my grappling hook to a nearby pipe on the ceiling, grab the princess, she lands a little kiss on my cheek while wishing me, 'Good luck,' and I swing across the bottomless gap while the stormtroopers fire relentlessly at us."

GM: "Spend a Destiny Point for no benefit, roll Athletics vs four purples and a red since this is both impossible and dangerous."

PC: (rolls, everyone looks in horror at the result)

GM: "Your shoulder is pulled out of socket dislocating it immediately, your spine snaps at the waist where you attached the line to your utility belt instantly paralyzing your legs, you fail to make the landing and you are now dangling helplessly in mid air."

PC: "..."

GM: "NPCs turn. They all fire potshots at you until you're smoking husks of carbon and ash."

PC: "..."

GM: "Look, I saw that episode of Mythbusters! They proved beyond a shadow of a doubt that this was impossible. Even Jamie couldn't do that swing by himself!"

PC: "Mythbusters... That sounds like fun. Let's all watch Mythbusters instead. Anybody with me?"

All the same, I probably wouldn't let someone gain ranged defense with a lightsaber (absent any talents that may be coming out with F&D) but if they really wanted to dual-wield one with a blaster then that sounds stupendously awesome. Even if they're a Scholar, I'm not going to just arbitrarily make them a danger to themselves and to everyone they know within their vicinity. They may not be very good but I'm not going to just make them dread cutting their own limbs off. Failure is punishment enough—no need to add injury to insult.

Sure non-force users might be able to block blaster bolts, but that'd be a melee check. Someone without the force will likely need more training. I'm guessing a colonist isn't going to be blocking anything with a melee weapon or a lightsaber. That's been my argument all along, someone who doesn't have much melee skill is likely a danger to themselves and others with a lightsaber. They'd still be with a vibro-sword as well. Someone trying to wield a lightsaber and a blaster without high levels of training in both like in the OP mentioned, would be an even bigger danger.

In this world, sure. For mundane NPCs in a Galaxy Far Far Away, sure. For the heroes of a story in that same Galaxy? Well, if they weren't already special individuals with the potential for awesomeness then why would a GM and the players even bother to spend hours of their precious free time to tell their stories?

When running or playing a game based on a series of movies where seemingly ordinary people do amazing things that can't be done and if it can't be as fun as watching Netflix...

PC: "I throw my grappling hook to a nearby pipe on the ceiling, grab the princess, she lands a little kiss on my cheek while wishing me, 'Good luck,' and I swing across the bottomless gap while the stormtroopers fire relentlessly at us."

GM: "Spend a Destiny Point for no benefit, roll Athletics vs four purples and a red since this is both impossible and dangerous."

PC: (rolls, everyone looks in horror at the result)

GM: "Your shoulder is pulled out of socket dislocating it immediately, your spine snaps at the waist where you attached the line to your utility belt instantly paralyzing your legs, you fail to make the landing and you are now dangling helplessly in mid air."

PC: "..."

GM: "NPCs turn. They all fire potshots at you until you're smoking husks of carbon and ash."

PC: "..."

GM: "Look, I saw that episode of Mythbusters! They proved beyond a shadow of a doubt that this was impossible. Even Jamie couldn't do that swing by himself!"

PC: "Mythbusters... That sounds like fun. Let's all watch Mythbusters instead. Anybody with me?"

All the same, I probably wouldn't let someone gain ranged defense with a lightsaber (absent any talents that may be coming out with F&D) but if they really wanted to dual-wield one with a blaster then that sounds stupendously awesome. Even if they're a Scholar, I'm not going to just arbitrarily make them a danger to themselves and to everyone they know within their vicinity. They may not be very good but I'm not going to just make them dread cutting their own limbs off. Failure is punishment enough—no need to add injury to insult.

Just for the record, I'll point out that I watched that episode of Mythbusters. The consensus was that the trick was, indeed, *possible*. The consensus was also that it would absolutely *suck* for the person who had to try it, and would be a plan attempted only out of utter desperation, as a last-ditch attempt at staying alive.