Should PCs be fully aware of an NPCs stats and gear?

By bberry77, in Game Masters

Regarding NPCs, especially those that could be involved in a combat encounter, should I allow the PCs to see the NPCs full stats? Should the PCs be aware of the gear and weapons being carried by an NPC?

I am thinking certain items should be a surprise to the PCs, ie - holdout blaster. What are the guidelines?

Edited by bberry77

I don't see a reason to ever let PCs see the stat block of a given NPC. I

Now if the NPC is wearing a gun and you describe that and they take a Perception or some other check to identify the gun, I'd tell them the model if they succeeded. Or if the NPC passes out or is captured by the PCs or dies, certainly the PCs might search them and discover what gear they have. But I certainly wouldn't ever tell them any NPC's Characteristic or Skill rankings or what Talents they have.

Never....

NPC gear is not privy to the PC's unless some extraordinary effort is made.

STATS... never.. cant look at someone and say.. "OH he must have a 4 brawn" even the biggest guy can be floored witha proper kick in the crotch.

As for weapons.. only after the fight unless its an obvious weapon like a E-WEB. Players who are ask.. "whats he shooting at me" my reply.."you gona take the time to look carefully to identify the make and model of the gun shooting at you?? OK +1 blue..for me.."

Rember NPC's are the domain of the GM and as such can change on the fly mid encounter to suit the narative. Your not a player, your the GM. boxing yourself in to a set of constraints simply because the book says so for PC's is a fallacy many players percive...

Edited by Atraangelis

Don't let them see anything.

That way, if you need to fudge something to make the game more fun or you accidentally screw something up no one is the wiser and the game keeps moving.

Plus, there are some players, and they KNOW who they are, that just can't keep themselves from gaming the system, which is antithetical to this type of narrative system. Keeping those stat blocks away from those players can help keep them focused on the story instead of their spreadsheet.

Even wound threshold - should that also be a mystery? Wouldn't it be appropriate for the PCs to know how close they are to success? How do I let them decide if they stay and fight because they are so close to victory or run to the hills?

At least in the case of wounds, a real-life scenario would show this in an obvious way through physical damage, etc. In an RPG is it expected that I not divulge that the PCs have inflicted 25 out of 30 points of the target NPCs wound threshold, but instead indicate via narrative how banged up the NPC "appears"?

Even wound threshold - should that also be a mystery? Wouldn't it be appropriate for the PCs to know how close they are to success? How do I let them decide if they stay and fight because they are so close to victory or run to the hills?

At least in the case of wounds, a real-life scenario would show this in an obvious way through physical damage, etc. In an RPG is it expected that I not divulge that the PCs have inflicted 25 out of 30 points of the target NPCs wound threshold, but instead indicate via narrative how banged up the NPC "appears"?

They have zero way of knowing that without at least (imo) a Hard Medicine check with Setbacks determined by distance from the person you're trying to observe - it's hard to see how hurt they are from decent distance, possibly preceded by a Lore: Xenology check to even know what the tells are for injury of that race.

I would not give them a number, regardless. I'd frame it narratively. Telling them numbers and letting them use that as a determination to stay or flee only encourages metagaming.

Close to ST = "they look like they're getting exhausted from this fight"

Close to WT = "they look really banged and blasted up, you're not sure but you think they've sustained serious injury"

Edited by Kshatriya

It should all be a mystery, there is no reason to tell the PCs anything, and especially not Wound or Strain thresholds. Been playing this way in every game since...1977. Even if the GM pulled a monster straight out of the AD&D Monster Manual, something would always be tweaked. We discovered almost immediately how dissatisfying it was, both as player and GM, to know the stats.

The only thing different about this game from most I've played is the dice pools are open, which does give the players some insight into the opponent's capabilities. It took a bit for me to get used to, but I prefer it now.

OK, that sounds reasonable. I think my group is going to have even more fun with this now. In our first couple of sessions I was revealing everything and it definitely made things more mechanical... like a video game. This approach will add a new layer of suspense that I am sure will be appreciated by the PCs.

We discovered almost immediately how dissatisfying it was, both as player and GM, to know the stats.

Amen. Even showing pictures out of the Monster Manual was no good for people who knew the game.

whafrog: You show your dice results to your players when you roll? I keep the hard dice on the table and use the app on my phone for NPC's. I'll let them decide for threat if I roll some, sometimes.

- James

I use pictures. Most of the group I play with are not at the same level of "Star Wars nerd" as I am - lol! All these weird species names usually have no meaning to them but when I show them a picture - for example a Gamorrean, I get a bunch of "Ohhh yeah... the pig men from Jabba's palace in ROTJ!"

Edited by bberry77

I'm with most of the above, though I think it's ok to mention openly wielded gear at least in broad strokes. If the bad guys run in with blaster rifles you can say that, the players only need roll if they want to know the exact make/model.

Also sometimes openly wielded gear should be mentioned as color, especially if it's really colorful. "The hulking gamorean walks in, bare-chested, his pierced nipples connected by a chain from which a half dozen grenades dangle."

I'd say a minimum of three setback dice to actions against NPCs with a half-dozen ANYTHING dangling from their nipples, let alone GRENADES - yikes!

Edited by bberry77

Players should be getting some feedback just from the fact that they've been hitting or missing enemies - not to mention Criticals. If they've critted a bad guy more than once and have landed a few hits they can draw their own conclusions. Sometimes very incorrect ones.

"He has to be going down soon, pour it on!"

Or

"He's still not dropping and we're all banged up badly...retreat!"

As an aside, a Force Sensitive individual may even be able to sense the current emotional state of an enemy.

"He's just getting angrier...it might be time for new tactcs!.

"I sense his fear, we have him."

When I run games, I almost completely ignore the hard crunchiness of tracking stat blocks and such once the fight gets into full swing...if they take him out early with a lucky shot I play that to the hilt - his death will be grandiose. Just keeping it lively is key.

whafrog: You show your dice results to your players when you roll? I keep the hard dice on the table and use the app on my phone for NPC's. I'll let them decide for threat if I roll some, sometimes.

Always, even for PC perception vs NPC stealth. It doesn't mean anything is actually there :) For combat, since this game is less lethal, I'm not as worried about PCs going down. Previous games I always felt I need to have the option of fudging if necessary, but then...why roll at all? I haven't felt the need for this game.

The only rolls I do secretly are when I have to wing it and I need a quick read on a situation or the attitude of a spur-of-the-moment NPC. A couple of quick rolls to determine, say, human<-->non-human, or friendly<-->non-friendly, helps jog me out of my preference or default. Then I can roleplay to the result and things usually get take on a life of their own from there.

My PCs only see stats of my NPCs if they pry the sheets from my cold, dead fingers (or if they rummage through my books when I'm getting a drink/using the rest room, but they can't really read my writing, so it's all good!).

I use a whiteboard at my table, and keep track of how much damage a target has sustained, and I narrate how they look. This way, a player can say "The guy with 23 wounds is the one you said is hurt badly? I open fire on him, then!" instead of having to remember which one is at what point.

For equipment, if the players are in combat, they may have a general idea of what is being worn/used by an opponent, but they won't know EVERYTHING. For example, if they see a stormtrooper, they'll clearly be able to tell what weapon is in their hands and that they are wearing stormtrooper armor. But if it's dark and they just started a shootout with a group of mooks, they'll be lucky to even be able to tell what type of weapon, much less make and model.

Basically, common sense dictates how much a player will know of the gear used by an NPC, but it's bad form to show everything since some players will feel cheated if you added something new and/or they'll feel like you went too easy on them for not using a peice of equipment.

For example: I used the Journeyman Bounty Hunter as a Rival for a session, but did not use the Disruptor Rifle as it would have killed the players.

Just my two credits there for you.

With regards to wounds, I also stay away from telling any numbers. I mark down their damage done, but they don't know soak values so it doesn't always help them too much. I make sure to always tell them if their damage doesn't pass soak, usually stuff like "your blow glances off the thug's back, not hurting him but making him mad." If they ask how they're doing I'll tell them how visibly injured the guy is, like is he bleeding? Does he still look healthy? Does he look like he's on his last legs?

I have to go with the majority here, don't let them see the stats. It serves several purposes. It gives them an element of surprise and risk. You never know when that barroom brawler isn't just some thug, but an ex-marine with 10 years of hand to hand fighting under his belt, or Joe Stormtrooper turns out to be an elite Royal Guard out on a training rotation.

It also allows me to fudge things a bit if I need to. More then once I've had an "oh crap this dude is way harder/easier then I thought he'd be." sort of moment. It's not a big deal then to tweak him, remove a talent, raise/lower a skill, etc.

I don't share the hard numbers with my players. I will show them a picture if I can find one and describe equipment in general terms. Two thugs in combat armour with heavy blasters, or an Aqualish street tough with brass knuckles. I won't say what modifications they have to gear, or hidden items.

Some they can figure out. Getting pot shot at extreme range suggests either a sniper scope or mad skills, or both. A heavy blaster shot to the chest of somebody in a long coat who doesn't even flinch is highly suggestive of his wearing body armour. Big muscles = high Brawn. I will also describe an opponent's apparent state of injury, although a clever opponent may fake a worse injury than they have actually sustained.

I hardly ever make dice rolls in secret. Dice are public. Stat blocks are secret.

Regarding NPCs, especially those that could be involved in a combat encounter, should I allow the PCs to see the NPCs full stats? Should the PCs be aware of the gear and weapons being carried by an NPC?

I am thinking certain items should be a surprise to the PCs, ie - holdout blaster. What are the guidelines?

No.

My dice rolls are always in the open and played as they roll.

Stat blocks are not necessarily secret - I've often had players run an NPC (even opponents) if their PCs is uninvolved in a scene (because the group split up or the player's character is downed). I'm also not too worried about letting a bit of info slip out here and there (Characteristic and Skill levels are often easy to recognize when you see the NPCs' dice pools). Essentially, if there isn't a compelling reason to withhold the information, I don't feel compelled to do so.

Dice pools are built and rolled in the open. That way my players can more easily participate in using Advantage and Threat.

I like the NPC templates and the ease with which they can be adjusted. They also allow me to get creative and colorful with descriptions without worrying about the impact on stats. 3 spaceport thugs in a minion group can be a Weequay, and Aqualish, and a Gamorrean, or they can be 3 humans with no change to the stat block. I can even describe an alien of "indeterminate species".

My players have not closely read and digested the rule book so I don't think they have a solid idea of how the NPC stat blocks work anyway.

No, what's the point? It's not going to make the game any faster, it's your job as the GM to do the processing anyway.

i construct the dice pool in the open describing the elements that contribute to the pool. i don't show them the statistics, some of them become apparent through the dice pool though.

Aware of gear? Yes, generally, though such descriptions would be fairly limited as to what weapon or scene object they are immediately carrying, and any immediately obivous bits, jetpacks, armour.Though likely determining the exact model isn't really possible unless your overly famlier with an exotic weapon or otherwise observing the target for a long period of time.

Health and Soak and skills? Until they roll them, you have no idea. While this information is there while the foe rolls, the player shouldn't ever see the monk character sheet, but rather be focused on combating what they can see.

Edited by LordBritish