9 troopers per ship, subdivided into groups of 3 to make initiative a little more interesting.

The players are on the roof of a hotel. 3 of them, plus their captive, are running out from the stairwell, their ship (with remaining 2 players) is on the roof, and one of the stormtrooper transports has landed and unloaded badguys. The players on foot, their ship, and the badguys ship are roughly in a triangle, and the remaining 2 badguy ships have yet to arrive on the scene. My guess is they're going to haul ass for their ship and not get bogged down in a gun fight.

I foresee a ship combat with 2-3 of the transport ships, so I need a statblock to use for them.

I was imagining a clone trooper gunship!

If their ship is damaged who do they go to, to get it fixed?

What's stopping the Storm trooper hitting them with something that allows them to track them afterwards?

Great now I'm picturing a Captain Scarlet episode where Black had to dupe them to follow a captured Operative whilst he decontaminated himself...

However would your players recognise that a tracking beacon or two has been added to their ship let alone the fact that a couple of them may have been implanted with a tracking capsule maybe even have the bounty hunters stalking them and they don't realise what's going on...

I would say use AoR's Sentinel landing craft, but those things are purpose-built assault landers that seat 50-ish troops per ship. I don't know if 3 of those with 9 guys each on it strains plausibility.

You could also use Lambda shuttles, but the people-aboard-to-capacity issue still exists there.

Mainly I would use air speeders since they are more fragile than actual gunships. A Firespray is not going to fare well against 2-3 Lambdas.

DC actually has a few good assault transports.

My thoughts:

Your players have just put themselves between a rock and a hard place. Here's the scenario as I see it:

• The ISB has called in Stormtroopers from the local garrison to help them secure the safety of an informant who has (apparently) been kidnapped by a bunch of violent psychopaths.
• The players are now trapped between the ISB agents and said Stormtroopers (with another batch almost certainly entering from downstairs as well to secure the building).
• The ISB doesn't want their *very* valuable informant damaged, so the Stormtroopers have been instructed to set their blasters on stun.

Stormtroopers are freaking *dangerous* to fresh characters, so here's what you do:

Use autofire with abandon. (After all, the Stormtroopers are set for Stun, so the players won't get killed.) When the party wakes up, they'll find themselves captives with a *very* simple choice to make.

• Spill the beans on why they were sent, and become agents of the Empire working *against* their erstwhile employer, or
• Have fun living out their lives on (aka: escaping from) Kessel (or some other Imperial work camp) without any of their gear, and with another 20 or so group Obligation: Wanted by the Empire.
• Some other option you and I won't think of, that will make for an even *more* interesting chunk of game!

Set up obstacles, and have fun watching your players dismantle them. Then *use* the way the players dismantled them to set up some new obstacles, which won't be so easily solved with the same tactics.

(e.g.: They used brute force and blasters last time, so you want them to have to *think* and/or *talk* their way out of this upcoming sessions' obstacles.)

If they take the bait, and decide that working for the Empire (even if they only intend for it to be a temporary thing) is better than being sentenced to a *long* prison sentence, then you've got a way to set them up with mission-based adventures going forward, and the ability to have them earn a bit of slack on their respective leashes based on future performance.

Oh, and think about having a chat with the players about what they're looking for from the game.

Voice,

There are very few Auto-fire weapons with Stun Setting, and none that are commonly used by stormtroopers. Regular blaster rifles work just fine though.

Voice,

There are very few Auto-fire weapons with Stun Setting, and none that are commonly used by stormtroopers.

Or, there could be, if the GM wants there to be.

From this, do the players understand the accumulation of obligation, as things seem to be piling up, eventually means that they will not be able to spend any experience points until it is paid down. The lowering of ones strain threshold is also huge, especially if the stormtroopers decide to set their boasters to stun.

So far, they appear to be bargaining from points of strength. They make their own demands because they are the ones able to help. What happens when the tables are turned. They're in a cell with all their gear confiscated and impounded with the ISB or a Hutt crime lord making them an offer they can't refuse.

So that's where we're at. We're still new to this system, but it seems like so far my players are interested only in getting credits, consequences be damned.

I almost think I should just give it to them. Shower them with more credits than they know what to do with, then see where they take it now that they have no allies anywhere.

So what's a good way to handle this kind of disconnect?

There's some good advice on how to handle consequences but, as I see it, that's not gonna fix anything.

By the sounds of it your players don't want to play Star Wars but "Murder Hobos looking to get rich in Spaaaaaace!"

Punishing them with loads of Bounty Hunters or Storm Troopers hunting them down won't change that.

I suggest you sit down with them, explain what Star Wars means to you, especially the expectations you have in terms of character roles and behaviour. To me, that means no psychopaths, no torture, no **** and pillage etc. Basically, I run my Star Wars PG13 and the players understand and embrace that.

If their idea of what Star Wars is or should be does not overlap with your view, then rather play "Battlelords of the 23rd Century" or something similar which might be more suitable to their tastes.

Always remember: No Gaming is Better than Bad Gaming!

It seems to me, your players are not in mindset intended to play this game, and they may never be. I've thought about your situation and the way you describe your character's actions and it seems as if they are trying to "win" Star Wars. Definitely talk with your players and if this isn't the type of game they want to play, it might be time to find different players or a different game.

I was going to suggest giving your players secret agendas that might pit them against each other and give XP bonus for completing "winning" their agenda. The more I think about it though, your players would probably wind up just shooting each other, Reservoir Dogs style.

FFG forums don't have an appropriate emoticon to convey my feelings right now, so just pretend I linked Picard facepalming while simultaneously bashing his head against a wall.

tl;dr: my PCs are all evil bastards and blame the setting. Also I'm apparently not good at running Star Wars.

The fight went fine. Almost not worth mentioning. The chase after was anti-climactic after we realized their ship could outpace the stormtrooper transports. They got into orbit and expertly dodged a squadron of TIE fighters using a once per session thing, then jumped into hyperspace.

Where did they go? I'm glad you asked. The astrogation programmer rolled a triumph, so basically got to pick what kind of place they ended up at. And they wanted to find some slavers.

Faced with the knowledge that their casino owner captive was unable to deliver any credits, they decided to cut their losses and sell him into slavery. So their jump to hyperspace lands them at a seedy space station with a slave market, and they sell him. They didn't even really debate it - they all just saw it as their best option.

We talked about them being more or less objectively evil after the session, then this morning I got this email from the player of the psychopathic rodian assassin, Meepo:

Thought on goodness: I feel like it's really difficult to play a good character in this game, because the core premise is that we're a band of career criminals, invariably on the run from the law and in desperate need of cash. "Smuggler with a heart of gold" is a common trope, doubly so in the Star Wars mythos, but it strikes me as a very hard one to actually play. It's difficult to reconcile drug smuggling and bounty hunting with a strong moral compass. Weirdly, EOE feels to drive much harder towards amoral sociopathy than Dark Heresy, a "grimdark" game. And I think that's because in DH, everyone is a shade of grey, but the PC's ultimate motivations are good ones -- protecting humanity, upholding religious creeds, fighting dangerous aliens. PCs may ultimately become the evil they seek to fight, but their motivation is positive.

Here, I feel like the setting and scenario encourages evil. I intended Meepo, at the start, as a bounty hunter with a code, hoping to clear his name. But you immediately spiral down into villainous acts, where it isn't clear why you wouldn't kneecap a guy whose drug ring you're robbing. Besides the character backgrounds and general game setting, the obligation seems to encourage bad acts as well: your character is under tremendous pressure from an outside force, but it's set so that the pressure can never be released. You have a bounty on your head, but you can never clear it, or a debt that you can never truly pay. What is the motivation to play nice and act decent, when you're under the gun (literally and figuratively) in perpetuity? The obligations seem to encourage a certain fun motivation/bonding at the start -- "we need to get some money to get out of this mess!" -- but the mess can't actually be gotten out of, so the game becomes "we need to get some money!"

And then, slavery. I really like the dice mechanics, but the setting seems uninspiring; I have a hard time discerning any real purpose to the PCs beyond the ultimately pointless collection of wealth. Just my .02

I fired off this quick response this morning:

This is useful feedback.

One thing that I tried to illustrate at the end of the last session was that Obligation is a resource. You're supposed to be able to lower it, remove it, take on more for benefit, etc. Money is one way to do that in some cases, but not all. For Meepo, maybe he could pay off his owed fees and taxes, or maybe he could have a Hutt do it for a favor (exchange one Obligation for another). The cliff-hanger endings to our sessions don't exactly make it easy to roll in the less tangible obligations, but hopefully with rolling before the session I'll be able to plan better for introducing them to the game.

I intended ISB and the Empire to be the greater evil to fight against, but nobody really followed that hook. I've been trying to tell you guys repeatedly that money isn't the be-all end-all of the game. Bendix [casino owner] was loaded, and look where that got him.

Part of it is definitely my unfamiliarity with the setting. Shifting gears from Dark Heresy is harder than I thought it'd be :\

So really, blame all around. I've been having a hard time working Obligation into the game, so we're trying out a thing where we roll at the end of the session and use the result for the next one, giving me some time to plan. I'm also a little at fault for introducing mostly drug smugglers and criminal types as the main NPCs. I think the biggest issue is the lack of direction. In Dark Heresy, you have a mission given to you. In EotE, it's more or less free form.

We ended in a spot where we can more or less do whatever next session, so I'd really like some ideas for getting this back on track in terms of being more Star Wars than slave/drug traders in space.

I would start by giving them a job that encourages a minimum of violence. Just off the top of my head, I would have them body guarding a celebrity. Not only do they need to keep her safe, but they need to avoid bringing any bad press as well. Maybe one the NPCs who is holding an obligation over a character is willing to reduce or even eliminate the obligation if the entertainer makes it to the big gig, or whatever.

You could possibly set them up to take an exploration mission. Some scholar needs some muscle. Take them out of their obligations reach for a few session and give them an objective to focus on. If it looks like they're going to kill the scholar and take his stuff, crash the ship on a world, where only the Scholar's knowledge can help them escape.

Whatever you decide, make it a job that encourages a non-violent solution. Make it obvious too.

I still think that there is something else going on though. I disagree with the idea that this is a game where you are forced into being a bad guy or always have some sort of deadly obligation hanging over your head in perpetuity. That's just not the case at all. Also the actions your PCs are taking to maintain their obligation could very well be adding to it. I think some of this is due to playing in a very different setting. I think another part of it is, as I said before, they trying to "win" Star Wars.

Good ideas on alternate scenarios.

I still think that there is something else going on though. I disagree with the idea that this is a game where you are forced into being a bad guy or always have some sort of deadly obligation hanging over your head in perpetuity. That's just not the case at all.

Agreed, I haven't had this issue. My son's campaign began with him having a family obligation to find his missing grandfather, but being penniless he was forced to borrow money from a Hutt to fix his ship, and now he owes the Hutt a few courier favours. Of course he was operating outside "the law", but he didn't use that as an excuse to break kneecaps wherever he went. He only broke them when he had to...

One way to pull your game out of the criminal Murder Hobo realm is to take the PCs out of their element for a while. Get them out of trouble by not giving them an opportunity to make trouble for a few sessions (or more depending on how things go). If this was happening in my group I'd engineer a Hyperdrive malfunction and crash land them on a world beyond the Rim where they have to explore and make friends with locals to find the parts (say from another crashed ship) to get their ship in working order to get home. Have the people they meet not be other criminals and their nemeses be creatures and obvious evil bad guys (a lost also crashed Imperial battalion or something, maybe guarding the ships parts they need). Maybe have them saved by the Rebellion?

Get your players out of the criminal mindset for a bit and see how they interact with you NPCs. Hopefully some of this will come back with them when they return to the Edge.

The one issue I have with EotE is that it's too easy for Players (and GMs) let it fall out of the heroic and into the criminal. Remind them that even though Han Solo was a smuggler and had no problem killing Greedo (he shot first, in fact in the very original 77' release there was only one shot, Han's) but he wasn't a psychopath he was a HERO. A hero with flaws but hero none the less.

Stuff

This is a really good idea. I solicited feedback from my players about the kind of game they'd like to play. 2 of the 5 have responded (we're playing tonight, so maybe the rest will answer my email), and the common thread was helping the rebellion, exploration, and humanitarianism. Shocking, I know.

I still need to work out a segue from the escape from Sleheyron/slaver station to something new and different. I'm basically going to consider this a complete start-over, continuity be damned.

Remind them that even though Han Solo was a smuggler and had no problem killing Greedo (he shot first, in fact in the very original 77' release there was only one shot, Han's) but he wasn't a psychopath he was a HERO. A hero with flaws but hero none the less.

It saddens me that someone, somewhere, doesn't know this. That moment really defines that character and the way Lucas changed it completely re-writes his character.

Remind them that even though Han Solo was a smuggler and had no problem killing Greedo (he shot first, in fact in the very original 77' release there was only one shot, Han's) but he wasn't a psychopath he was a HERO. A hero with flaws but hero none the less.

It saddens me that someone, somewhere, doesn't know this. That moment really defines that character and the way Lucas changed it completely re-writes his character.

One of the dwindling list of good things of being older...

So really, blame all around. I've been having a hard time working Obligation into the game, so we're trying out a thing where we roll at the end of the session and use the result for the next one, giving me some time to plan. I'm also a little at fault for introducing mostly drug smugglers and criminal types as the main NPCs. I think the biggest issue is the lack of direction. In Dark Heresy, you have a mission given to you. In EotE, it's more or less free form.

We ended in a spot where we can more or less do whatever next session, so I'd really like some ideas for getting this back on track in terms of being more Star Wars than slave/drug traders in space.

How about you look to the PC's Motivations and structure future sessions around them? It will give the PCs something to aim for and the intrinsic pressure to succeed should keep the players motivated. Obligation can then come in to add complications to their lives. If you tie some of the Motivations into the Rebellion and the Jedi, you should be able to bring in some Star Wars specific colour.

This is a really good idea. I solicited feedback from my players about the kind of game they'd like to play. 2 of the 5 have responded (we're playing tonight, so maybe the rest will answer my email), and the common thread was helping the rebellion, exploration, and humanitarianism. Shocking, I know.

I still need to work out a segue from the escape from Sleheyron/slaver station to something new and different. I'm basically going to consider this a complete start-over, continuity be damned.

I was actually thinking, as I read this thread, that it would be a good idea to bring your players into the greater galactic war, giving them something more concrete to strive toward. However, your players have established themselves as being borderline psychos. Well, people take notice, including people at the rebellion. Maybe that escape is enabled by a higher ranking officer in the rebellion. Maybe that officer offers them some work for the Rebellion, work that's too dirty to get other people involved in. Your group aren't getting medals on Yavin IV after they complete a mission, they're being told never to try contacting the Rebellion and only given enough supplies to sate their Obligations/Motivations. Give your players the chance to run these humanitarian missions, maybe even give them a choice of missions, and see what they want to go with.

See how the group responds to having this shadowy boss giving them things to do. Do they want to kill him/her? Do they like him/her? Do they respect him/her? Given the players the chance to go through with their desires, but make it at a cost. Maybe killing this boss will cause a vital planet for the Rebellion to cease their aid. Maybe they respect the officer, but he/she only sees them as disposable. Maybe they like the officer, but the officer is actually planning to turn coat to the empire.

Basically, let your group be the A-Team in space and have the officer give them a transport van to drive around in.

When I run a table with players that all want something other than I want or had planned, I usually just breakdown and shift my frame of mind. To avoid unhappiness, I try to see how happy they get when they play the game their way, and try to pretend it makes me happy too. Sometimes it works!

Sensible consequences are important to me and my gaming expectations. I'd feel as frustrated as you do. But if I were running your table, I'd let them chase their credits and do all the absurd stuff that they love to do. You can try to temper their recklessness by attempting to educate them with consequence. But if you, instead, craft situations that use drama to heighten what they do to even greater heights, they'll absolutely freak out and love it. Your group wants to run around and provoke and cause a ruckus. I'd say find the fun in letting them, or suggest a different game. Either way, you can't run the table while you're not having fun!

EDIT: I should say that I'm starting a secondary game with another group and it's looking like I'm in your boat. My optimism might sour, ha.

you have a group of murder hobo on your hands dude

When I run a table with players that all want something other than I want or had planned, I usually just breakdown and shift my frame of mind. To avoid unhappiness, I try to see how happy they get when they play the game their way, and try to pretend it makes me happy too. Sometimes it works!

Sensible consequences are important to me and my gaming expectations. I'd feel as frustrated as you do. But if I were running your table, I'd let them chase their credits and do all the absurd stuff that they love to do. You can try to temper their recklessness by attempting to educate them with consequence. But if you, instead, craft situations that use drama to heighten what they do to even greater heights, they'll absolutely freak out and love it. Your group wants to run around and provoke and cause a ruckus. I'd say find the fun in letting them, or suggest a different game. Either way, you can't run the table while you're not having fun!

EDIT: I should say that I'm starting a secondary game with another group and it's looking like I'm in your boat. My optimism might sour, ha.

You know, you're supposed to have fun, too. Talk with your players about it. See if someone else will GM and let you play. If you're deadset on playing a serious game, just tell the players. Make some pregenerated characters, design am adventure you can play in one night, and run it with your players once as a side story, asking them to take it a bit more seriously and see how that goes. Make sure to liberally award them with bonus dice for playing it in the style you want. If your players have a problem with taking one night to play in the style you like, consider not running a game for them or not inviting whomever isn't going to want to play.

I'm definitely not looking to put the game on rails. At the same time, though, the players have really gotten themselves into a pickle. They blew up an ISB investigation, they're about to get into a firefight with a dozen or so stormtroopers and then have a chase through the city, which will cause who knows how much collateral damage. The Hutt may decide they're too much of a liability to work with. They'll probably go straight from this encounter to hyperspace to try to start over on another planet.

I just don't know where to take the game if they're going to go from one half-thought-through get rich quick scheme to the next and just make enemies everywhere they go.

I like Voice's idea for basically overwhelming and capturing the PCs, then providing them a choice between cooperating (at least temporarily) with the ISB, or getting shuffled off to some prison. I'll say that the scenes in the Kessel mines in one of the EU books were fun, although I'd imagine the PCs would just get themselves killed there.

Given what your player wrote to you, and what else you've said, my suspicion is that part of the problem is that there doesn't seem to have been a lot of thought put into the characters' backgrounds and motivations, so they're defaulting to something that makes sense in some way for the criminal element they are playing, but without any real thought being given to why they're doing certain things, or what they actually want out of it.

Have you or your group watched Firefly? There's another example of outlaws who maintain some sense of honor and goodness (often less than Han Solo displays).

Some possibilities:

• Start over with new characters that have better defined goals, obligations, motivations and backstories.
• Provide the players with an opportunity to revel in their sociopathy and greed...maybe they come out of hyperspace above a world with a weak governing force, but resources and attractions enough to spur the group into trying to set themselves up as the crime lords of the region...they could try to build their own criminal empire from that start, butting up against both their former Hutt employer and the Empire as their power grows.
• Some even more dastardly crime boss observes their behavior and tries to bring them on board with his organization as something of a SpecOps/brute squad, meant to do dirty jobs and instill fear in this boss' enemies and contributors alike.
• If someone in the group has any sort of connection to an NPC (family or friends in their backstory/motivation), send them to visit, and have the Empire slaughter everyone in the area (including their family/friends). See what they do. You could have them run into someone from the Rebellion who lets slip that the Imperials turned to this wanton destruction because they were trying to root out some suspected Rebels...now they can choose to side with the Rebels against the Empire that just slaughtered their loved ones, or side with the Empire if they believe the Rebels put innocents in danger.