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normally, but a hard list if you need the high wins. The hardest matchup for me (against the top8 lists) would be the Rieekan Ace list. 6 ships and dangerous squadrons. It comes all down to the outcome of the squadron fight. And a few more statistic facts : In these lists are 4 MC80. All are assault. All had Defiance, ECM and Leading shots. 3 use Ackbar as admiral, one Rieekan. There are 16 flotilla in the top 8 lists. So there is still an average of 2 flotilla per list. It became even a bit worse. Because the big ships (MC80 and ISD) need a lot of Flotilla to compensate the high cost of this one ship. Edited September 3, 2017 by Tokra -
running with this idea, Ive sent my crew of imperial special agents on a small scouting mission, that allowed them to take down a rebel cell. Deciding that they can use the near destruction of this cell, they are going undercover as survivors of the raid, and going to try to infiltrate a much larger Rebel flotilla group called Rouge Squadron. They have been assigned to this mission personally by Princess Leia, who secured intel that her missing mother is there in the flotilla. The group consist of a human Justicar; the name of the Force Oder that Emperor Skywalker has created to replace the missing Jedi order. They act much like the inquisitors of the legacy canon, but also serve as diplomats and negotiators of the Empire as well. A bothan infiltrator spy, and a human commando gadgeter. Their prime objective is to locate Lade Padme, and secure ... release. Also to secure as much information as possibly, before calling in renforecments to destroy or capture the flotilla -
Cracken than the Hammerhead does. I've been trying to theory craft these Hammerheads for how I play and ... I just can't. People say you can run them with Ackbar but TRC90s do it better and cheaper. You can take gobs of them because they are cheap but they are only 3 points cheaper than a comparable CR90 and the CR90 is for me just better. I can try to run down flotillas with a CR90. With a Hammerhead you have to rely on a really good front shot because your side arc means diddly. Its also not fast enough to reliably or as reliably as a CR90 can ram that flotilla. I get it is a different beast, the CR90 is happy at long and medium range while the Hammerhead wants to get in close but it just seems like it will be doing is dying ... Because otherwise you aren't getting rerolls. I think a Hammerhead as you have it with TF Organa is as strong offensively with a CR90 and I think TF Antilles Hammerheads with a StM Pelta is as strong defensively as a CR90 but both of these options are more expensive than a CR90. So, I still prefer the CR90 because it is defensible, its cheaper, it synergizes better with a few admirals, can hunt flotillas if need be and more maneuverable . Hm, for some reason what I copied and pasted is in bold and I can't get it out of it. Weird. Edit: Got the bolding fixed. Edited June 3, 2017 by Grujav -
dont mind the bullets heading my way for saying, again: Change relay. There is not a single other aspect of the game, for me, that needs further changes. Yes, occasionally I was thinking to bind the number of flotillas to the number of non-flotillas, but then again, I dont really mind. There are several numbers to improve the situation, surely, but dont let those flotillas command with total impugnity from wherever they happen to be on the board, using the same shuttle over and over and over again. Sloane just worsened this, but I dont mind Sloane herself, on the contrary. There are far better players than me that think relay is too strong, so I feel confident that this issue is not just something that I personally cant manage. I used it myself, there is no choice than to howl with the wolves in competitive play -
consider an attack flotilla something that comes with more than 1 dice a side, still is a flotilla (Garel's Honor is the absolute opposite of a flotilla) that I can put slicers and some boarding upgrades for a price that is not absurdly high -
think there's a distinction to be made between people who were putting naked flotillas on the edge of the map and doing literally nothing with them other than activating, and those who actually used them for all the stuff they offer other than that. For a brief while in previous waves, that worked, and was really easy to do alright with, so lots of people jumped on that hype train. Others actually use them for anti-squadron, for blocking, for bounding and herding the battle, for obstructing more important ships, as well as for the activation. If you actually use your flotillas competently instead of outright trying to cheese with them, they're (shock!) actually pretty good additions to a fleet in their own right, and also fun to play with. So, I agree that parking across the table and doing literally nothing is mostly dead weight ... thought that of the flotillas pretty much since they came out, so... I personally wouldn't really say I think something has changed in that respect. But that's just personal opinion -
commit them to very large fleet battles. We read about those battles because they were few and far between. It was only when an admiral felt he has a significant advantage that he would commit a large fleet to action. Consequently the vast majority of actions took place between smaller ships (50 guns and below) or between vessels (craft with less than 3 masts). Basically the equivalent of Raiders, CR 90's and flotillas. You might see a 60 gun 4th rate ship in the mix occasionally which would be basically a Nebulon or Arq. and another example WW1 The German high seas fleet stayed in port. The other nations fleets had nothing to do but stand off and watch them. Most actions took place between individual cruisers or smaller ships with the occasional clash between a squadron of battle cruisers or larger. There was considerable action between Destroyers ... smaller ships So the idea of Flotillas being a major part of fleets in Armada is not really all that odd to me. Its just not what we think of when we think of Star Wars. Now my buddies and I play Armada about once every two or three months and we generally play 4 player 800 or 900 point per side battles. I am honestly tired of the big rebel ships gunning down weaker Imperials. The last three games have been won by Rebel scum the only win we Imperials had was when we ran an ISD up the gut and blasted Home One to bits only to soon follow it. I have been looking for a way to upset the power curve a bit so multiple flotillas might just be the ticket -
shifting cargo with the frenetic care of lifelong voidsmen, and I was gladdened by the sight even if the merchantmen bore sigils or flew colours I’d rather not see. Svard was already at war, it did not need to become a battlefield for a larger one. That seemed out of my hands; the Winterscale ship Praexitium had arrived almost as soon as I had left for Dripwater. With the grand cruiser came a flotilla of lighter escorts and freighters eager to sample Svard’s war materiel. Captain Sandre Vaunt--dreadfully under-ranked for such a force--was most gracious and contrite for the disturbance. His ship, Before Destruction I assume it’s meant to be called, was an ancient one, a hero ship of the Angevin Crusade. Somehow, the Blessed Enterprise sensed this about the Praexitium, and the two were somehow more alive when their orbits drew them close ... medicae, silenced the tech-priest by offering to ship in more Whisperers and leave them in peace. I was lying, of course. I was more willing to kill the tech-priests and their dwindled servants at that point. Madam Charlabelle sent one message to us. She was retreating to protect Svard after the failure to retake the refineries. A wise move, one that will allow her to influence the now masterless ships in her flotilla. Perhaps one or three could be convinced to join the Armelan Fleet. Captain Keel, feeling it his duty to observe and lend support, dealt with the splinter force that broke away from the Yu’Vath flotilla. He expected to be re-supplied, and I had to factor that with my negotiations with Magos Tevla. Torpedoes do not come cheap. So how did I come to sit on the command throne of another rogue trader -
stretch to attribute the flotilla nerf to 2+3 specifically, though. Like, yes, 2+3 was annoying as heck and a huge problem. And yes, flotillas make really really good carriers. But huge numbers of flotillas were popping up in every list, Imp and Rebel, squads or not, just for cheap activations -
Having played a narrative game with a ship that was required to go last on the opposing team, I can attest that it encourages smarter play by the first player and is very powerful. As for the other issues, I'm not against limiting flotilla presence or unique squadrons. Both are intended to make the game note accessible to new players. Also, frankly, flotillas need a slightly more effective nerf. The existing restriction didn't particularly change their most detrimental effect on the game, which is to perversely elongate it to maximum rounds without a strong individual primary effect on the game. If it weren't for the utter dominance of high efficiency bomber wings, flotillas would rule the roost as the most broken element t of the game -
single big ship, esp if its the only combat ship, is hardly exciting.Battlelines trading blows are exciting. bomber wings making runs while dodging flak are exciting. in general , "Battlefield living hell" is exciting. But one supertightly packed ball "stay close to rhymer/wexley/crow /(insert stacking aura) " of squads vs another ,while ships activate doing next to nothing ,just applauding one real ship, is not exciting. I'd love a fleet with 3 ships and 2 flotillas. Instead we get 1 x ship(demo/isd/admo) , one carrier, plus flotillas. Its not even on vassal; many people here play different stuff, just the tournament result stats are extreme. EDIT: the whole setup of the "2+3" does remind me of the "1 carrier & 1 cruiser escort & smaller frigates/destroyer escorts the us navy forces use. So maybe it IS thematic just the problem is different/has to do with points costs tgat make only flotillas available -
Switch the first to flotillas don't count towards tabling (like how squads don't). If players want to bring an MC80 or ISD and 4 flotillas, they then accept that they lose if the solo combat ship dies. It prevents a squad heavy lost from sending a solo flotilla towards nowhere to prevent tabling. I dont actually agree with any of those,posted Edited October 1, 2017 by Church14 -
someone double check this please - I think the wording for the maximum number of flotillas has been removed. I don't think running more than 2 flotillas is fantastic, especially with the new pass rules, but it opens up the design space for more different flotillas -
deployment time. It feels freaking terrible being on the other side of it and knowing your best available decision is to try and make it eat something of lesser value to you, but its gonna eat SOMETHING, because its too manuevearable, and has too much dice manipulation. Everything I've read about handling demolisher is like guarding Michael Jordan, its just damage control. Except underbidding, which is proactive, but guesswork.I'm hoping that the flotillas create a situation where this archtype becomes more difficult to work, becuse bombers will become more effective, because flotillas have scatter, because fighter buils will suddenly have more activations. I'm hoping that bringing too manu flotillas to pad activations in a non fighter scene will simply lead to too many empty activations for MSU builds to run them reliably. But it could just as easily lead to MSU builds with a real squadron presence.I -
Would be way easier to make Flotilla same as squadrons for activation and placement. If you want to move a Flotilla, you have to move two. If you place a Flotilla, you have to place two. If you don't have two left, you have to wait till the end to place/activate it. It would not change anything on the fleet build or the basic rules. This is why i totally disagree with 2: Playing with unique squadrons has the drawback, that you have less squadrons. Changing the rules that you can only use a specific number of squadrons it like saying: half of the ships must have a titel. Or saying that each ship is only allowed to have 10% of the base cost in upgrades. Its not good. and 3: is as well on good idea (imo). Or you end somewhere: Player two may declare X, unless player
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flotillas are to be nerfed, they must do something more than just changing the interaction with Relay. Relay, with unlimited range, can be considered a flaw - or a feature - depending on how you look at the 15+ point investment you must make (our of the 134 squadron pool). But just "fixing" relay will still let flotillas do the Boosted comms thing, which was definitely a thing before RELAY. And even that won't address flotillas as pure activation spam. If anything it would encourage even more super-pickle builds of the no-to-low squad type. Edited October 2, 2017 by Green Knight -
will still be facing the same direction and will be as close to its original position touching the ISD base. A stationary ship cannot avoid being rammed but the MP can choose to avoid ramming a stationary ship. In the event of equal tick marks, the ramming player wins. Damage would be a bit different based off of mass. Large ships give out 3 damage (1 crit, 2 facedown), medium 2, small 1, and flotillas always only take 1 regardless of what hit them but otherwise remain the same. The shield face involved would take the first damage with defense tokens being playable (you can redirect, brace, contain, scatter). So, in the scenario above, given a ram, the ISD player would take 1 damage to the front hull zone (take out one shield or deal 1 card if no shields) and the corvette would take 3 damage to the side ... closest to the ISD. If it was a flotilla being rammed, the ISD would take none and the flotilla would take 1. A bit more complicated than the current system but not overly so. There's no calculus haha. It would address the 3D nature of space, the use of ramming as a viable tactic, the ability to avoid being rammed (especially by a larger ship) if you're faster and more maneuverable, the effects of mass on damage (i.e. more mass means more damage), shields providing protection, and using defense tokens to mitigate some damage. Edited September 27, 2017 by WGNF911 -
Flotilla bomber list would have gotten shredded at Canadian Nationals. I had a 3 flotilla Interdictor heavy bomber list and everyone there was ready for both flotillas and bomber lists. I think some of my fellow Canadians are at worlds right now actually, we have high hopes as the scene in Ontario is highly competitive and yet cooperative -
Okay here we go again, with suggesting rule changes to Armada, the first two is to List building, the last is about activation order (Talk about beating a dead horse ) 1: Only up to half of the ships in a list may be flotilla = if you want three flotilla's in a list, you have to have three other non-flotilla ships in your list. 2: Only up to half of the squads in a list may be unique = if you want three unique squads in a list, you have to have three other non-unique squads in your list. 3: Second player may in the beginning of each turn, declare that his last activation must be activated last in the turn = I.e second player has two ship list VS a five ship list and in the beginning of say turn two, he/she declares to have "last activation" meaning that -
still on the "2 flotillas are better than a quasar" argument? Cant put Flight Controllers on a flotilla, can't flak to red range with 2, and can't push 6 squadrons in one activation with them. I say this all as a jealous Rebel, the Quasar is great at its role. Its role is "PUSH SQUADRONS" and "technically have guns" and it does them both admirably. Sorry @Marinealver, i'm not critical of you, i've just been hearing this argument so much recently and it's so aggravating on a ship that came out what, 2 weeks -
Decimators and Valen have been popping up some. And by some, I mean one guy did pretty well with it around me. YT-2400s still pop up too. A Hammerhead swarm made it into the top 8 at Nationals using Rogues as support. Relay and flotillas are the main culprits of the scarcity of Rogues. Rogues pay a tactical advantage by for using their ability, because it means conceding the initiative to squadrons activated in the ship phase. Sure, you can activate Rogues with commands anyway, but that effectively means you are wasting the points the squadron pays for the Rogue ability. The primary advantage of Rogues was being able to operate away from carriers, which Relay now covers. Flotillas provide cheap ship activations and cheap squadron commands. Put the two together, why pay the extra for the Rogue ability -
think relay, flotillas, and better carriers have enough cheap activation now that Rogue took a hit. The relative ease now to activate squads encourages more relentless efficiency over flaxibility. I actually think rogues are in a healthy spot now. Try not spamming them, but putting 2-4 in a squad ball that has escorts and intel. Something like: Jan Biggs 2xXWing 4xYT-2400 128 You could then run a fleet with a single EHB flotilla to push squads. Xwings eat the initial damage and fight well on their own. The 2400s either reinforce your Escorts to win squad battle or move off and hit enemy ships
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rebels Flotilla (No idea on name sorry) from the movie trailers Mc75 medium based Imps IGV-55 surveillance flotilla Lancer frigate This way rebels maintain a one ship numbers up from the Imperials and FFG fills in some role gaps -
post here. I almost left armada because of how crappy NON demolisher gladiators became. I loved the ships because they look cool and they're agile. But we all know there's much better options now than a ship that has a bunch of black dice. However, today I returned to the game and went to a tournament at my FLGs today. I ended up winning 3-0 and fell in love with the flotillas which rekindled my interest in the game. I am sharing the list I won with. This is called Major Rhymer's Allstars and some other ships because that's pretty much what it is. It has a heavy centerpiece ISD. But all of the other ships are just support for the fighters and the ISD. Here ya go! Total: 397 Flagship: ISD 2Commander: SkreedWulf YularenAvengerBooster CommsECMGunnery TeamXI7 Turbo Lasers Gozanti CruiserJamming Field Gozanti CruiserComms ... Gozanti CruiserBomber CommandVector Squadrons:DengarBoba fettDarth VaderTie BomberTie Fighter x3Howl RunnerMajor Rhymer I started all ships at speed one. The Gozanti with Comms spent the first few turns feeding my ISD tokens. Yularen kept the tokens on the ISD whenever I activated it. My fleet basically didn't move until I saw rebels getting too close to my flotillas and then I would just bugger them out. Avenger was really good on the ISD because you activate 5 ships (three bombers, vader who pseudo bombs, and maybe a tie or something - three of those ships get rerolls) and usually the opponent has exhausted one or two of their defense tokens. They kind of forgot about avenger shooting on the same activation normally. Anyways that's my fun success story. Feedback and everything else is well appreciated. I fought all rebel players today and played against a reekan list, a dodo -
ship Wave: ISD-I "Command" Destroyer Chimera with Grand Admiral Thrawn Commander MC75 Cruiser Profundity with Admiral Raddus Commander If 4 ship Wave: IGV-55 Surveillance Vessel Flotilla Braha'tok Gunship Flotilla If Epic: Executor Class Dreadnought SSD with Admiral Piett Commander that should cover all bases