Powerfist and Unnatural Strength

By VronishKez, in Rogue Trader Rules Questions

A powerfist's damage bonus is twice the characters strength bonus...now in the talents section, there are abilities that double ability bonuses and then states "if he has unnatural agility, add +1 to the multiplier....."(lightning reflexes p.101). Powerfists don't state the second part, that leads me to believe that it doesn't just ad +1 to the multiplier, but instead doubles the bonus after the unnatural strength bonus is factored in... am i doing it wrong?

Nope, by RAW you'd double the already doubled bonus. Melee Explorators are somewhat... unfriendly in that regard.

My rule has always been:

Unnatural Strength x2 + SBx2 (Or Unnatural Strenght x2) = SB x3

Santiago said:

My rule has always been:

Unnatural Strength x2 + SBx2 (Or Unnatural Strenght x2) = SB x3

Which is how FFG say it works, if you check the Unnatural Characteristic trait in the Rogue Trader rulebook.

MILLANDSON said:

Santiago said:

My rule has always been:

Unnatural Strength x2 + SBx2 (Or Unnatural Strenght x2) = SB x3

Which is how FFG say it works, if you check the Unnatural Characteristic trait in the Rogue Trader rulebook.




hah, i am infact playing an explorator....rolled hideous strength on my tainted mutations roll, and deficeded to get best quality synth muscles...and am from a death world and put my natural 20 into str...so yeah, mellee explorators are pretty **** disgusting

Non-Unnatural modifiers stack multiplicatively. The precident is the Rakasya in DotDGs, which has Unnatural Toughness and the Daemonic trait, doubling it's Toughness Bonus of 6 to 12, and then again to 24 (except against attacks which ignore Daemonic). Bring Psykers, Force Weapons, Blessed gear, and Pentagramic Wards...and preferably a Black Priest or Sister of Battle.

This came up in our game and let me tell you, allowing them to stack both bonuses is unhealthy for ...Land Raiders...small Titans...it was Captain Insane-o.

I don't remember exactly how the DH rules are supposed to go, but I wound up letting the Ogryn* have a grand total of x3 SB and they didn't complain because he could still crush a Power Armored Chaos Marine like an empty can of Old Milwaukee.

*(Don't ask. It was a custom-made Ogryn-Sized PF...they did a favor for an Arch-Magos...I let them have it because the model conversion and paint job was so darn good...)

Unnatural Strength doubles your strength bonus and you strength bonus shoud be considered this for all purposes. If a power fist doubles your strength bonus that means that it would become your natural SBx4. It is not the same as adding another level of unnatural strength it is just a multiple to a stat that has already been doubled.

Kaihlik

I'm in the multiplicative non-Unnatural modifier camp. A character with Unnatural Strength x2 and a Power Fist gets SBx4 damage.

I also think a PC smashing a tank with a power fist is awesome, so your mileage may vary.

I'm in the x2 UN + x2 PF = x3 total.

Power Fists are basically designed with smashing tanks in mind, so that's an appropriate use indeed. Power Weapons are melee versions of Plasma and Melta Weapons, while Chain are melee equivalents of Bolters. And all of the above are anti-tank weapons, although more effective in that role in the hands of Space Marines than Guardsmen.

Also, SBx4 is rather easily obtained by a DH Psyker using Hammerhand alone, with Burning Fist to remove the Primitive quality.

This came up in our game and let me tell you, allowing them to stack both bonuses is unhealthy for ...Land Raiders...small Titans...it was Captain Insane-o.

Well, so are melta-bombs, which are probably easier to acquire.

Maxim C. Gatling said:

This came up in our game and let me tell you, allowing them to stack both bonuses is unhealthy for ...Land Raiders...small Titans...it was Captain Insane-o.

I don't see the issue. A Powerfist wielded by a Space Marine veteran of equivalent strength to Brother Sergeant Agamorr (SB10, including armour bonus) in Purge the Unclean deals 2d10+20 I damage, averaging 31. A Man-Portable Lascannon deals 5d10+10 E damage for an average of 37.5. The Lascannon has a much higher maximum (and a lower minimum, but only by 7), and is no less difficult to obtain.

Both are known to be potent anti-tank weapons in 40k, so the damage values don't seem to be all that disproportionate.

The classic mistake I see people making in RT/DH is seeing that something does a lot of damage and assuming that it's overpowered. Combat in this system is simply very lethal. There isn't much stated that a good BS and a nice roll with an autogun or even autopistol can't kill, once you factor in Righteous Fury.

When you consider how strong a Space Marine would be, it's easy to see why noone would want to mess with one wearing a powerfirst if that';s the case...

Back when we gave Inquisitor a spin, we quickly discovered Space Marines didn't even need a weapon to be the deadliest thing on two legs... One could quite easily (and reliably) PUNCH your head off. Accurate? Most likely. Frustrating? Definitely.

I see it no other way that unnatura str makes your str bonus be x2, so a player with 50 str wil have a str bonus of 10. And a power fist deal your str bonus x2 in damages, so a totalt of +20 damages.

Its a hell of a weapon and a killer in the right player hand. But its also unwielding so you cant parry and that means you be easyer to take down also, wich is a trade off. DH+ TR is a deadly game for sure and using a powerfist instead of a powersword that can give you +15 parry is something to consider.

I rather meet a chaos marine with a power first than one using a power sword, no matter what im prolly dead if he hits me and the one with the power sword might just be that must harder to take down, since he wil parry alot.

If you can't Parry, you just Dodge.

If you can't Parry, you just Dodge.

Which may or may not be worse than parrying - Dodge is Agility-based, which is another ability you have to raise apart from WS. And in the best case (agility as cheap as WS advancements, Dodge +20 available at your rank, no heavy armour), you're five points better than wielding a Power Sword.

Or carry a shield or a sword in your offhand to parry with. You rarely need two powerfists :-)

But there might come a time when you need two powerfists gran_risa.gif

Like when you and the Lictor are having cuddly time and you really want to give it a V-8?

HappyDaze said:

Like when you and the Lictor are having cuddly time and you really want to give it a V-8?

As long as the lictor is wearing a red hankie in his righthand back pocket, all should be well.

As long as the lictor is wearing a red hankie in his righthand back pocket, all should be well.

Since lictors are so great at adapting, does it suffice if one of the lictor's victims wore a red hankie?

I always figured Lictors as more of the left pocket types.